Sanders misleads on Family healthcare

[JIMINZ]

After that we need to apply the likelihood of this agenda getting voted into law as he lays it out.

I believe that answer to be ZERO, based on the grounds, poor Bernie or any other Socialist will never become President.

 

[JIMINZ]

What makes you think it's a "free program?" Medicare isn't a free program, why should Medicare for all be free?

Let me put it in a brighter light then.

Every program coming from Bernie, or any one of the other so called Socialist Democrats will cost not only more than 1/2 of what you earn, it will also cost you your Freedom to boot.

 

[Desk trauma]

Let me put it in a brighter light then.

Every program coming from Bernie, or any one of the other so called Socialist Democrats will cost not only more than 1/2 of what you earn, it will also cost you your Freedom to boot.

And contaminate our precious fluids!

 

[JIMINZ]

And contaminate our precious fluids!

????

 

[Speedwell]

Let me put it in a brighter light then.

Every program coming from Bernie, or any one of the other so called Socialist Democrats will cost not only more than 1/2 of what you earn, it will also cost you your Freedom to boot.

You've got numbers to back that up, of course. As to freedom, it's a toss-up. As an officially branded atheistic commie who hates America and wants to destroy Judeo-Christian values I don't think I have much of a future in the crypto-Christian paradise you expect Trump to build for you either.

 

[JIMINZ]

You've got numbers to back that up, of course. As to freedom, it's a toss-up. As an officially branded atheistic commie who hates America and wants to destroy Judeo-Christian values I don't think I have much of a future in the crypto-Christian paradise you expect Trump to build for you either.

Ok then, very simply for you personally.

For you as an espoused (officially branded atheistic commie who hates America and wants to destroy Judeo-Christian values). there isn't anything I can say which would be satisfactory to you, the numbers are readily available but that isn't going to change anything you already believe.

 

[Speedwell]

Ok then, very simply for you personally.

For you as an espoused

LOL!

(officially branded atheistic commie who hates America and wants to destroy Judeo-Christian values).

That's just Trumpspeak for being an other-than-Evangelical Christian and a Democrat

there isn't anything I can say which would be satisfactory to you, the numbers are readily available but that isn't going to change anything you already believe.

You haven't given us any numbers. We were actually talking about numbers when you butted in and changed the subject to a rant about socialism.

 

[JIMINZ]

LOL!That's just Trumpspeak for being an other-than-Evangelical Christian and a Democrat
You haven't given us any numbers. We were actually talking about numbers when you butted in and changed the subject to a rant about socialism.

I'm terribly sorry, at the time I was under the impression I was talking to a logical human being, I guess I was mistaken sorry again for the mistake.

the fact you cannot make the connection between the two isn't my doing.

 

[JIMINZ]

You haven't given us any numbers.

Personal Income Tax Rate in European Union averaged 41.13 percent from 1996 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 47 percent in 1996 and a record low of 38 percent in 2009.

In the United States, the average single worker faced a net average tax rate of 23.8% in 2018, compared with the OECD average of 25.5%.

 

[Speedwell]

I'm terribly sorry, at the time I was under the impression I was talking to a logical human being, I guess I was mistaken sorry again for the mistake.

the fact you cannot make the connection between the two isn't my doing.

It's too late for me--I'm on Medicare already. See, my (illogical) take on it is that you size up the problem first; how much are the American people going to be paying for health care over the next ten years. Then you decide how to do it. But, of course, you have decided already that doing it along the lines of Medicare for All would turn the US into a barbaric totalitarian hell-hole like Canada, the EU or Australia. Fair enough.

 

[JIMINZ]

It's too late for me--I'm on Medicare already. See, my (illogical) take on it is that you size up the problem first; how much are the American people going to be paying for health care over the next ten years. Then you decide how to do it. But, of course, you have decided already that doing it along the lines of Medicare for All would turn the US into a barbaric totalitarian hell-hole like Canada, the EU or Australia. Fair enough.

That is not what I said, nor is it what I implied.

I was saying that with the Socialist agenda which Bernie is espousing, it is all part and parcel of the same package he is peddling to the American Public.

The references to other parts of the world were to demonstrate what the future would become if, that type of thing were to ever happen.

It's not as simple as just one program, it's all part of the Socialist agenda.

You have to listen to more than just the parts that affect you personally.

You need to hear all of what Bernie wants to do, do you believe taxing the rich will cover it all?


I too am on Medicare, although I have never needed to use it, imagine that.

 

[Skreeper]

Personal Income Tax Rate in European Union averaged 41.13 percent from 1996 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 47 percent in 1996 and a record low of 38 percent in 2009.

In the United States, the average single worker faced a net average tax rate of 23.8% in 2018, compared with the OECD average of 25.5%.

Hey there bud. I'm a person living in one of these "socialist hell holes" and even though we do have higher taxation than the US you shouldn't forget what we get for it.

Around half of my monthly income goes directly to tax and insurance programs. But you have to remember that I don't pay a penny when I go visit the doctor, and if I lose my job I still get a monthly payment for up 12 months based on my last income.

Even though I only have half my income available I still live a very comfortable life and I wouldn't trade it for your system.

 

[JIMINZ]

Hey there bud. I'm a person living in one of these "socialist hell holes" and even though we do have higher taxation than the US you shouldn't forget what we get for it.

Around half of my monthly income goes directly to tax and insurance programs. But you have to remember that I don't pay a penny when I go visit the doctor, and if I lose my job I still get a monthly payment for up 12 months based on my last income.

Even though I only have half my income available I still live a very comfortable life and I wouldn't trade it for your system.

Hey Buds:

OK, be happy!

Oh by the way, I never said that any of the places I referenced were Hell Holes, that was the other Atheist I was talking to at the time.

My wife is German, and we travel there about every two years I have nothing against the Country as a whole, but it's just way to expensive to live there.

 

[Skreeper]

Hey Buds:

OK, be happy!

Oh by the way, I never said that any of the places I referenced were Hell Holes, that was the other Atheist I was talking to at the time.

My wife is German, and we travel there about every two years I have nothing against the Country as a whole, but it's just way to expensive to live there.

Expensive to live here? Hmmm

I do not have a direct comparison but I'm currently making 32k a year which is not that much but I have no problem buying things I want.

Sure, I can't just decide to buy a Tesla or get a Rolex but I could if I were to save up for a couple of years.

Do you have some examples of what you think is expensive? I know that rent can be pretty crazy is the bigger cities but I've heard it's that same in the US.

 

[JIMINZ]

Expensive to live here? Hmmm

I do not have a direct comparison but I'm currently making 32k a year which is not that much but I have no problem buying things I want.

Sure, I can't just decide to buy a Tesla or get a Rolex but I could if I were to save up for a couple of years.

Do you have some examples of what you think is expensive? I know that rent can be pretty crazy is the bigger cities but I've heard it's that same in the US.

Having a direct comparison, I have been there 6 times in the last 12 yrs. I compare the Housing, Land, Gas.

I don't believe there is much of a difference in the food or the commodities, and things like a Tesla, and a Rolex are just about out of everyone's comfortable range of living, when there are more important things to consider.

I am on a fixed income because I am retired, but I live very comfortably and I can honestly say I have more now than when I was working, I retired 23 yrs. ago and only made a top pay of $16,000 in the last yr. I worked.

I did not have Savings when I Retired, Stocks, a Pension, or Retirement plan, but over the years I have managed to both Save and Travel, and I continue to thrive and prosper.

Therefore speaking out of my own experience, I fully believe there isn't a better system of Government in the entire world than a Capitalistic one.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

Sen. Bernie Sanders continues to make the misleading claim that “the average family of four spends $28,000 a year on health care.” That’s the projected average cost for employer-sponsored health insurance for “typical” families of that size, but the employee paid about 44% of that total amount in 2018, while the employer paid the other 56%.
​

I listened as Mr. Sanders also said that the drug industry made 100,000,000,000 in profits and they should not.

Let's look at some numbers:

Congressional Republicans seized on a new study Monday estimating that a universal health-care plan by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) would cost the federal government $33 trillion by 2031, arguing that it proves Democrats have moved too far left.
​

Let's knock nine zero's* off to help understand a little better.

Mr. Sanders does not like the pharma companies making 100 x 10 years = 1,000* while wanting to spend 33,000*.

Now, let's look at the famous 1%

In fact, the top one percent alone holds more wealth than the middle class. They owned 29 percent—or over $25 trillion

EX - Jeff Bezo has 127* - once you take it - he doesn't have it any longer.
​

That 25,000* is total wealth, all their cash, properties and belongings EVERYTHING. You can take everything only once. Take that and add it to the 1,000* of big pharma profits.

You can confiscate all the wealth of the top 1%, all the profits from the big pharma and you still run short of the costs by 7,000*

Thoughts?

Well, I have known several “families of four” for some time, some with insurance and some without, and the most any of these “families of four” paid out of pocket for health care was around $14,000, the least was $1800, and the overall yearly average was $8,900. Perhaps Mr. Sanders could get more accurate numbers or these “families of four” could come to Michigan for treatment.

 

[Aryeh Jay]

Now all you have to do is apply that amount with all of the other free programs he wants to employ.

Not applicable to U.S.

Now wait, Bernie may have a point. With free college everyone can get a Medical Degree and take care of themselves for free.

 

[iluvatar5150]

Personal Income Tax Rate in European Union averaged 41.13 percent from 1996 until 2018, reaching an all time high of 47 percent in 1996 and a record low of 38 percent in 2009.

In the United States, the average single worker faced a net average tax rate of 23.8% in 2018, compared with the OECD average of 25.5%.

The US tax rate doesn’t include health insurance premiums. If you add another $10k+ to the average American’s expenses, that’ll more than eat up that 16% they didn’t pay in taxes. And then there are all sort of strings attached to it since it’s either provided through your employer or regulated by the state in which you live. So, who’s really more free?

 

[Desk trauma]

????

Classical reference.

 

[Hank77]

Expensive to live here? Hmmm

I do not have a direct comparison but I'm currently making 32k a year which is not that much but I have no problem buying things I want.

Sure, I can't just decide to buy a Tesla or get a Rolex but I could if I were to save up for a couple of years.

Do you have some examples of what you think is expensive? I know that rent can be pretty crazy is the bigger cities but I've heard it's that same in the US.

If you wouldn't mind sharing, what percentage of your available monthly income do you pay for housing?