Sabbath question from seeker

[k4c]

Do I understand what true worship is, do you understand what a true relationship is? If God had a wallet and you opened it up you would see my picture. I have loved God for as long as I can remember, maybe that’s why he healed me from liver cancer, maybe that’s why I know his vorce.

God loves you more than you know and yes, if He had a wallet your picture would be in it and yes He healed you from cancer and has even given you eternal life so that you could be with Him forever but all this is God showing His love for you in hope of you loving Him back.

1 John 4:19 We love Him because He first loved us.

Those who know the voice of God will follow Jesus.

John 10:27 "My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.

To follow the Lamb is to obey Him. It's not enough to call Him Lord, we must also do the will of His Father who is in heaven.

Matthew 7:21 "Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father in heaven.

The seventh day Sabbath is God's holy day. He blessed and sanctifed the seventh day even before sin was in the world. He protected the seventh day by Law, which He wrote with His own finger. Jesus taught many times on how to keep the seventh day holy in light of the things that come up during the Sabbath.

The book of Revelation speaks of a woman, which is symbolic for a church. This church has done alot of things outside of God's will such as changing God's holy day from the seventh day to the first.

Official quote from The Catholic Catechism
Question - Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer - “Saturday is the Sabbath day.”
Question - “Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?”​

Answer – “We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A.D. 364), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday." Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, p. 50, 3rd edition, 1957.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday.” Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is our mark or authority, the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact." Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923”.

There will be a people in the last days that will not let themselves be defiled by this woman, but instead, they will follow the Lamd wherever He leads.

Revelation 14:4 These are the ones who were not defiled with women, for they are virgins. These are the ones who follow the Lamb wherever He goes. These were redeemed from among men, being firstfruits to God and to the Lamb.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm sure you love God but loving God is manifested through worship and true worship that is precious in the eyes of God is expressed through our obedience to God over man or even self.

Matthew 15:9 In vain they worship Me, You teach as doctrines the commandments of men.

Mark 7:7-8 In vain they worship Me, teaching as doctrines the commandments of men.' You leave the commandment of God, and hold fast the tradition of men.

So let us grow to know God's will for His people so that we can love Him in a way that is pleasing and acceptable in His sight.

John 14:15 "If you love Me, keep My commandments".

Titus 1:16 They profess to know God, but in works they deny Him, being abominable, disobedient, and disqualified for every good work.

 

[trubeautie]

Question: Is this an area for debate from other branches of Christianity?

It seems as though the individual that asked the question was seeking an SDA perspective. With all the back and forth, did they ever come back?

 

[OldStudent]

Exodus

20.8:Remember that thou keep holy the sabbath day.


I will keep this short but I would like to know how you personally keep Sabbath, what you regard as Holy and what you would not find to be appropriate. I won't get in to the debate regarding the Saturday/Sunday issue as it's all quite peripheral to me but I do acknowledge the importance of a rest day so I would love to get your thoughts on it.

There is a fair amount of guidance about Sabbath observance. But if you carefully follow Jesus' interaction with Sabbath you will gain more sense of His thought on it. You will sense rather quickly He had it in for the rules of the church and tradition.

But I stray from the intent of your post. I don't have to get up at 5am for work so 7:30 or so is fine. We host Simple Church in our home so there is some setup for that. Church fellowship takes 3+ hours. We live where there is nice green space so I often mix walk, think, meditate, read, watch for a time outside. We may take a family walk or bike ride. There are various forms of visitation (family, friends, shutins, homeless, etc.) to enjoy. There may be study time. I have a set of keyboards in my "man cave" that often gets some wear. I try to attend vespers with a congregation. I try to avoid much sleep time. If I need to sleep Sabbath, I haven't taken care of myself through the week. I may even attend to some on-line fellowship.

If someone asks for Biblical details for Sabbath observance there is, of course, the 4th commandment, follow "sabbath" in Nehemiah, examine Jesus' experiences, and there are little clues from the book of Acts. One day I noticed that the 10th commandment (Thou shalt not covet...) was a state of mind - that covetousness was the well from which the transgressions named above flowed. Taking that as a model I looked back at the 4th commandment as also a state of mind which is appropriate with "remembering." If our Sabbath fellowship with God is in place, we will have no problem with the other transgressions or what to do with Sabbath.

I think you asked your question from a good perspective. When people ask me for "rules" of Sabbath observance I am not so satisfying because, like intimacies at home, much of it is personal (with a few definite dos and don'ts) and up to the personalities of the members to work out. Remember, "God is love." He relishes our time AND our personalities.

 

[ricker]

Official quote from The Catholic Catechism
Question - Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer - “Saturday is the Sabbath day.”
Question - “Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?”​

Answer – “We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A.D. 364), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday." Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, p. 50, 3rd edition, 1957.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday.” Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is our mark or authority, the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact." Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923”.

Why do you continue to quote Roman Catholics? Do you think they are accurate and dependable in their doctrine and interpretations of history?

 

[k4c]

Why do you continue to quote Roman Catholics? Do you think they are accurate and dependable in their doctrine and interpretations of history?

I'm not concerned with what the state does such as, Constantine or the Blue Law, but I am concerned with what the Christian church does, in particular the Catholic church, because they, during the dark ages, set the stage for what mainline Christianity believes today.. The Bible speaks of an apostasy, which is referring to a time when the church falls away from the teachings of Jesus. This is why we should never use the state or the church as our standard of truth, but rather, Jesus, who is the way and the truth. Jesus never once changed the Sabbath day from the seventh to the first and nor did the Apostles. Jesus did teach many times on Sabbath observance. He even identified Himself as Lord of the Sabbath.

 

[ricker]

Originally Posted by ricker

Why do you continue to quote Roman Catholics? Do you think they are accurate and dependable in their doctrine and interpretations of history?
​

I'm not concerned with what the state does such as, Constantine or the Blue Law, but I am concerned with what the Christian church does, in particular the Catholic church, because they, during the dark ages, set the stage for what mainline Christianity believes today.. The Bible speaks of an apostasy, which is referring to a time when the church falls away from the teachings of Jesus. This is why we should never use the state or the church as our standard of truth, but rather, Jesus, who is the way and the truth. Jesus never once changed the Sabbath day from the seventh to the first and nor did the Apostles. Jesus did teach many times on Sabbath observance. He even identified Himself as Lord of the Sabbath.

Was this supposed to be an answer to my question? If you don't think the RC church is authoritative, why do you always quote them?

 

[k4c]

Was this supposed to be an answer to my question? If you don't think the RC church is authoritative, why do you always quote them?

The roman catholic church is the christian church in apostasy. This is a why God is calling His people to come out of her. Most of the doctrines today in mainline churches have been formed by the roman catholic church, which include the immortality of the soul, the Sabbath change and heaven or hell at death just to name a few.

 

[ricker]

The roman catholic church is the christian church in apostasy. This is a why God is calling His people to come out of her. Most of the doctrines today in mainline churches have been formed by the roman catholic church, which include the immortality of the soul, the Sabbath change and heaven or hell at death just to name a few.

I'm not arguing with you, just asking a question. If you don't think Catholic teaching is authoritative, why do you keep quoting them? You have quoted them at least 4 times in this thread alone!

Originally Posted by k4c

Official quote from The Catholic Catechism​

Question - Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer - “Saturday is the Sabbath day.”
Question - “Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?”​

Answer – “We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A.D. 364), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday." Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, p. 50, 3rd edition, 1957.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday.” Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is our mark or authority, the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact." Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923”.

​

 

[k4c]

I'm not arguing with you, just asking a question. If you don't think Catholic teaching is authoritative, why do you keep quoting them? You have quoted them at least 4 times in this thread alone!

Go here if you really want to know...http://www.looking4jesus.com/Prophe-cy.html

 

[ricker]

Go here if you really want to know...http://www.looking4jesus.com/Prophe-cy.html

Will that website tell me why you believe and quote Roman Catholic doctrinal statements? (At least 4 times just in this thread!) You must think Catholics are an authority on doctine and history to quote them so much.

Edit to add: I wasn't going to say anything, but after you had quoted the RC for the fourth time, as if they were a reliable source of doctrine and history, I had to try to find out why you would think that.

 

[k4c]

Will that website tell me why you believe and quote Roman Catholic doctrinal statements? (At least 4 times just in this thread!) You must think Catholics are an authority on doctine and history to quote them so much.

Edit to add: I wasn't going to say anything, but after you had quoted the RC for the fourth time, as if they were a reliable source of doctrine and history, I had to try to find out why you would think that.

Sounds like you're running out of excuses. Why don't you just accept the truth?

 

[ricker]

Sounds like you're running out of excuses. Why don't you just accept the truth?

???????

If you think Catholics are truly an authority on doctrine and history, fine. I could find many interesting quotes by them for you to ponder.

If you think they are not an authority, stop quoting them as if they were.

 

[k4c]

???????

If you think Catholics are truly an authority on doctrine and history, fine. I could find many interesting quotes by them for you to ponder.

If you think they are not an authority, stop quoting them as if they were.

Did you go to the website? If you didn't, then you need to. If you did and you still don't get it then there is nothing I can do for you accept maybe pray. But even then, God says there is a time when we shouldn't even pray for them. I'm not sure if you're at that point yet, only time will tell.

 

[ricker]

Did you go to the website? If you didn't, then you need to. If you did and you still don't get it then there is nothing I can do for you accept maybe pray. But even then, God says there is a time when we shouldn't even pray for them. I'm not sure if you're at that point yet, only time will tell.

I'm not saying that Catholics are good. I am wondering why you quote them as if they are truthfull. Is this so hard to understand?

 

[k4c]

I'm not saying that Catholics are good. I am wondering why you quote them as if they are truthfull. Is this so hard to understand?

I will once again waste my time answering your endless questions that serve no purpose other than to ware out the saints. The RCC is an authority and one that has persecuting power. The problem is that its authority and throne does not come from God nor does it have the right to change God's Law. Now my good friend, if you would like a more in depth study on the subject please visit the website and pray that God would open your eyes.

 

[ricker]

I will once again waste my time answering your endless questions that serve no purpose other than to ware out the saints. The RCC is an authority and one that has persecuting power. The problem is that its authority and throne does not come from God nor does it have the right to change God's Law. Now my good friend, if you would like a more in depth study on the subject please visit the website and pray that God would open your eyes.

Will you now stop quoting them as if they were a source of truth like you did here? I don't believe what they say, why do you?

Originally Posted by k4c

Official quote from The Catholic Catechism

Question - Which is the Sabbath day?
Answer - “Saturday is the Sabbath day.”
Question - “Why do we observe Sunday instead of Saturday?”​

Answer – “We observe Sunday instead of Saturday because the Catholic Church, in the Council of Laodicea (A.D. 364), transferred the solemnity from Saturday to Sunday." Peter Geiermann, C.S.S.R., The Convert's Catechism of Catholic Doctrine, p. 50, 3rd edition, 1957.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is founded, not of scripture, but on tradition, and is distinctly a Catholic institution. As there is no scripture for the transfer of the day of rest from the last to the first day of the week Protestants ought to keep their Sabbath on Saturday and thus leave Catholics in full possession of Sunday.” Catholic Record, September 17, 1893.​

Official Statement of the Catholic church ​

“Sunday is our mark or authority, the church is above the Bible, and this transference of Sabbath observance is proof of that fact." Catholic Record of London, Ontario, September 1, 1923”.
​

​

 

[k4c]

Will you now stop quoting them as if they were a source of truth like you did here? I don't believe what they say, why do you?

​

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

It's like they don't even read what we write...

 

[k4c]

It's like they don't even read what we write...

I really have to learn when to kick the dust off my heels because it's too frustrating and time consuming for me...

 

[Byfaithalone1]

I'm not saying that Catholics are good. I am wondering why you quote them as if they are truthfull. Is this so hard to understand?

I don't think so. It seems like a fair question to me.

Catholic documents are being cited as a source of truth and yet those who cite them do not view Catholics as being a source of truth. Seems to be a serious disconnect to me.

BFA