Sabbath Instituted in creation?, Written vs Reasoned

[Eila]

But the day you worship is important to God as He set the Sabbath for worship and not the day of another god, that is were Gods truth and false traditions of man will be cut to the quick, and some will be told "I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity."

Do you only worship God on one day a week? Is is wrong to worship God the rest of the week? Are there other gods who actually claim a day for worship? Worshiping God on a Sunday is working iniquity?

 

[Cribstyl]

If you have no way to worship God, how can you truly have a relationship with Him and come to Love him. That's why the Sabbath was given as a gift and to keep paganism and heathenism from substituting worship to the sun gods of Baal or the earth gods, or wooden gods or any gods other than the true Creator.

In spirit and in truth. It's like having unlimited anytime minutes on my cellphone.

Ask yourself when did COI began worship rather than resting on the Sabbath day?

 

[Cribstyl]

www.jewfaq.org/shabbat.htm

Sabbath cant be more real than is presented by this websight listed. Where are the Sabbatarians to agree or disagree with what is written here about the Sabbath.

As Christians we are greatful for the hisotry of the Jewish people. We're even more thankful when they make The books of Moses true and easy to swallow.

It is my pray that God would bless them with even a greater revelation of Him.

 

[reddogs]

What man says matters not, what the Creator says to the created is what matters.......

Genesis 1:27
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.

 

[Cribstyl]

What man says matters not, what the Creator says to the created is what matters.......

Genesis 1:27
So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.

That text only validates that God is the creator of man....what is your point Reddogs?


Here is what the creator says about His sabbaths.

Eze 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I [am] the LORD that sanctify them.

So, Are you calling God a liar?

Why would God say that His sabbaths was given "between Himself and them" if His sabbath was ever given to Adam as a moral law for everyone to keep?

Who should we say "them" references?

Should we ignor bible text to make "reasoning" as truth and God's word optional?

CRIB

 

[djconklin]

Worshiping God on a Sunday is working iniquity?

I wouldn't call it iniquity, but since you asked you to worship Him on the Sabbath why wouldn't you?

 

[Eila]

I wouldn't call it iniquity, but since you asked you to worship Him on the Sabbath why wouldn't you?

I would think He wants us to worship Him everyday.

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

I would think He wants us to worship Him everyday.

Yes we are to worship Him everyday of course but He also said:

“ Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God......“

Marc

 

[freeindeed2]

Yes we are to worship Him everyday of course but He also said:

“ Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD your God......“

Marc

If Jesus did not fulfill the law as he said he would, then not one 'jot or tittle' has disappeared from it and Israel is still obligated to keep it in it's entirety, including the sign of the old covenant/10 commandments, the Sabbath.

 

[Your Neighbor]

If Jesus did not fulfill the law as he said he would, then ...

Fulfilling something doesn't end it, unless you think all righteousness came to an end when Jesus was baptized!

Matt 3
14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

freeindeed2, tell the cop when he pulls you over for speeding that you fulfilled the speed limit 5 years ago, and see if he agrees that the speed limit doesn't apply anymore.

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

Fulfilling something doesn't end it, unless you think all righteousness came to an end when Jesus was baptized!

If people would take the time and find out the Greek behind the translation they will discover that fulfill doesn't mean 'end it'.

In short fulfill in the Greek pleroo (Strong's 4137) meaning "fill up" "make complete" "fully preach" "to supply" and "to perfect

Think not that I am come to kataluo(to utterly destroy" or "overthrow completely) the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to pleroo( "make complete" "fully preach" "to supply" and "to perfect)

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in NO wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

Heaven and earth will pass away before the Law (Torah) will. Not one jot or tittle will be altered "until all be fulfilled." Has all been fulfilled? Has Jesus returned? Has all Israel been regathered back into the land of Israel? Has the Heavenly Kingdom been established here on earth? Not one stroke in Law ( Torah) will be changed in any way until all is fulfilled.

Marc

 

[freeindeed2]

Fulfilling something doesn't end it, unless you think all righteousness came to an end when Jesus was baptized!

Matt 3
14 But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me? 15 And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.
16 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

We're talking about the law-the old covenant here. We gain, or are credited with, the righteousness of Christ apart from the works of the law.

freeindeed2, tell the cop when he pulls you over for speeding that you fulfilled the speed limit 5 years ago, and see if he agrees that the speed limit doesn't apply anymore.

On what basis would my claim have any validity? How would I fulfill something that obviously condemned me? I would stand guilty before the judge, unless someone else were to stand in my place and taken my sentence for me.

The analogy fails because it doesn't take into account that we were born with a sinful nature. We are born infected to the core and Jesus is the only way to experience the transforming power of His Spirit living within us. We aren't sinners because we sin, we sin because we're sinners. That's why we need a Savior who became sin for us in order that we could be made righteous before God. He HAS ALREADY satisfied completely God's anger that was against us before being credited with His righteousness.

 

[freeindeed2]

If people would take the time and find out the Greek behind the translation they will discover that fulfill doesn't mean 'end it'.

In short fulfill in the Greek pleroo (Strong's 4137) meaning "fill up" "make complete" "fully preach" "to supply" and "to perfect"

Think not that I am come to kataluo(to utterly destroy" or "overthrow completely) the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to pleroo( "make complete" "fully preach" "to supply" and "to perfect)

"Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil. For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in NO wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled."

Heaven and earth will pass away before the Law (Torah) will. Not one jot or tittle will be altered "until all be fulfilled." Has all been fulfilled? Has Jesus returned? Has all Israel been regathered back into the land of Israel? Has the Heavenly Kingdom been established here on earth? Not one stroke in Law ( Torah) will be changed in any way until all is fulfilled.

Marc

Then you're in big trouble. If Jesus didn't fulfill (make complete) the law as he said he had come to do, then not even ONE 'jot or tittle' could possibly have disappeared from the entire law (all 613 Mitzvah). That would mean it's ALL still in place, including the penalties for breaking it commanded by God.

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

Then you're in big trouble. If Jesus didn't fulfill (make complete) the law as he said he had come to do, then not even ONE 'jot or tittle' could possibly have disappeared from the entire law (all 613 Mitzvah). That would mean it's ALL still in place, including the penalties for breaking it commanded by God.

Didn't the prophet say(unquote): He was bruised for our iniquity?

Was it or was it not prophesised that He would save us from iniquity and the penalties?

Are you saying that the Savior was a new concept in the New Testament and that it wasn't even thought of' in the Old Testament?

Marc

 

[freeindeed2]

Didn't the prophet say(unquote): He was bruised for our iniquity?

Was it or was it not prophesised that He would save us from iniquity and the penalties?

Are you saying that the Savior was a new concept in the New Testament and that it wasn't even thought of' in the Old Testament?

Marc

Marc, how would you pull the idea that Christ was a 'new concept' from what I posted? Sorry, that's a complete disconnect.

Did Jesus do what he said? Did he fulfill the law or not? If not then not 'one jot or tittle' has changed or disappeared from the law, including the penalty. It sounds like you're saying that he removed the penalty and parts of the law disappeared, but not all. So, in essence, Jesus fulfilled some parts but not others and he took the penalty. So if we break the parts that he did not fulfill is there still a penalty for doing so? Do you see the inconsistency in what you seem to be proposing?

If he didn't fulfill it all, then it is ALL still in force.

 

[Messianic Jewboy]

Marc, how would you pull the idea that Christ was a 'new concept' from what I posted? Sorry, that's a complete disconnect.

Did Jesus do what he said? Did he fulfill the law or not? If not then not 'one jot or tittle' has changed or disappeared from the law, including the penalty. It sounds like you're saying that he removed the penalty and parts of the law disappeared, but not all. So, in essence, Jesus fulfilled some parts but not others and he took the penalty. So if we break the parts that he did not fulfill is there still a penalty for doing so? Do you see the inconsistency in what you seem to be proposing?

If he didn't fulfill it all, then it is ALL still in force.

He fulfilled the Law meaning in the Greek: fully preach, perfect, supply. He didn't end or abolish the law.What about the prophets?

Has all been fulfilled by the prophets?

But the Messiah hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, and hath been a curse for us; (for it is written, Cursed is everyone that is hanged on a tree

Not the law he has redeemed us but from the curse of the law. 'The wages of sin are death'

The Law itself isn't a curse which is often mis-interprated as such.

Marc