Removing the laws of God- what does it really mean?

[Leaf473]

I think its really hard for non-Sabbath keepers to understand Sabbath keeping. I always think of it like having children. If you have never had any, its hard to tell others how to raise their children.

Sabbath keeping I am sure is really strange for a lot of people. The primary day of worship was changed such a long time ago so Sunday church is what most people know.

God tells us to keep His Sabbath Holy. That is first. This means the day is about Him. If my neighbor needs help on something that is not an emergency I can help any other day, God is my priority. If my neighbor is hurt and needs help now, that is a different story. Jesus used a similar example in the Bible over an animal needing help on the Sabbath.

I hope this gives a little bit better understanding.

God bless

When you say,
"This means the day is about Him,"
but... aren't all days about him?

By extension, are the other six days more about us?


I wrote this in post 367,
"I think this is the reasoning of the synagogue official. Jesus has just healed someone who was oppressed for 18 years. He heals her on the Sabbath.

The official says that people should come on the other six days to be healed. The woman was sick for 18 years, it was not an emergency healing.

Is the official wrong in his reasoning?"

Removing the laws of God- what does it really mean?

 

[Leaf473]

1. Jesus said Abraham saw his day and was glad - John 8
2. Peter says the OT prophets knew about "this salvation" that we have today seeing the "sufferings of Christ and the glories to follow" 1 Peter 1.
3. Paul says "the gospel was preached to us just as it was to them also" Hebrews 4:1-2
4. David even admits that the blood offerings of animals are not what God wants.
5. And Daniel is praying directly to God in Dan 9 from Babylon asking for forgiveness of sins - while offering no sin offering/animal sacrifice at all. No priest, no animal sacrifice, no temple. And nothing going on in Jerusalem either with the temple completely destroyed at that time.

So it is "very possible" that many of them did know that these animals were symbols of the future promise.



Mark 12:28-33 The Jews tested Christ to see IF HE KNEW that the two great commandments upon which all others are based -- are

1. Love God with all your heart - Deut 6:4
2. Love your neighbor as yourself - Lev 19:18

the very thing you claim that non-Christian Jews before the cross could not have known - is the very test THEY put to Christ to see whether He was smart enough to know what they already knew!

Deut 6:4 and Lev 19:18 were not deleting scripture in the OT or in the NT.

They are establishing those laws you are talking about them setting aside - not deleting them - according to Christ.

Do you believe that all of the Old testament prophets were told the things that Jesus said he couldn't tell his apostles because they couldn't bear them yet?

The question about which is the greatest commandment is not the same as the question of which rule fulfills all the others.

One rule fulfilling the others does not delete the others, it establishes them.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

When you say,
"This means the day is about Him,"
but... aren't all days about him?

By extension, are the other six days more about us?


I wrote this in post 367,
"I think this is the reasoning of the synagogue official. Jesus has just healed someone who was oppressed for 18 years. He heals her on the Sabbath.

The official says that people should come on the other six days to be healed. The woman was sick for 18 years, it was not an emergency healing.

Is the official wrong in his reasoning?"

Removing the laws of God- what does it really mean?

We give glory and are thankful for His blessings each and every day. I try to read my Bible nightly and pray multiple times daily. God told us to do all our work and labor on the first six days. Since we all have bills and God designed us to be productive, we have six days to work a job, garden, laundry, or however you wish to complete work and household tasks. God asked for one day a week to be Holy. The seventh day is His Sabbath Exodus 20:8-11 , we should stop working (rest). God tells us to put away our own desires on this day, Isaiah 16:22,23. This day is sacred and we should hallow it. For me, I try not to have conversations about business or work on Sabbath, when fellowshipping on Sabbath conversation's should be around Him. I try to keep my thoughts about Him on Sabbath as well. Like I said previously I enjoy Sabbath by going to church, prayer, reading the Bible, Bible studies, nature hikes etc.

The Pharisees took a legalistic view of the Sabbath and was more concerned with what people were doing or not doing on Sabbath, than enjoying it for the blessing it was meant to be. Jesus made sure we understood if needed, we can do good on the Sabbath. The priority of the day is to keep it Holy, but if a neighbor is injured or you want to bring food to people who are in need or doctors who has to work on a Sabbath if no one else is available, Jesus clarified it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. I don't think that means this should be the center of Sabbath, this is the Lords day, He is our priority.

Regarding your example, this was the first time the sick person encountered Jesus and He healed her on Sabbath as He was doing good. Her life changed forever.

I hope this helps.

 

[Clare73]

The Levitical laws are removed (Heb 8:13; Eph 2:15; Col 2:14), and have been for almost 2,000 years now.

No text in the Bible says that.

So childbirth is still defiling (Lev 12:2)?
All male bodily discharges, including marital sex, is still defiling (Lev 15:18)?
A woman's menstrual period is still defiling (Lev 15:19-24)?

It falls to you to demonstrate that the texts I provided do not abolish the Levitical laws.

 

[Chi.C]

bye

 

[pescador]

Mark 2:27 "Then Jesus declared, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. "

Matthew 12:31 “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come."

We are all sinners. Don't let sin become blasphemy. Sin and repent truly along life's journey. But don't give yourself to atheistic/anti-Divine sophistry.

We are not all sinners, at least not in God's eyes. Those of us who are in Christ have been born into a new sin-free state by God's grace.

 

[pescador]

So childbirth is still defiling (Lev 12:2)?
All male bodily discharges, including marital sex is still defiling (Lev 15:18)?
A woman's menstrual period is still defiling (Lev 15:19-24)?

It falls to you to demonstrate that the texts I provided do not abolish the Levitical laws.

The OT laws -- not just those in Leviticus -- are still in effect for all those who are not living under the New Covenant. Christians -- are dead to the law but alive to God in Christ Jesus. (Romans 6:11)

 

[Clare73]

The OT laws -- not just those in Leviticus -- are still in effect for all those who are not living under the New Covenant. Christians -- are dead to the law but alive to God in Christ Jesus. (Romans 6:11)

There is no other covenant, the Old (Mosaic) Covenant is obsolete (Heb 8:13), no one is under it.

 

[Leaf473]

We give glory and are thankful for His blessings each and every day. I try to read my Bible nightly and pray multiple times daily. God told us to do all our work and labor on the first six days. Since we all have bills and God designed us to be productive, we have six days to work a job, garden, laundry, or however you wish to complete work and household tasks. God asked for one day a week to be Holy. The seventh day is His Sabbath Exodus 20:8-11 , we should stop working (rest). God tells us to put away our own desires on this day, Isaiah 16:22,23. This day is sacred and we should hallow it. For me, I try not to have conversations about business or work on Sabbath, when fellowshipping on Sabbath conversation's should be around Him. I try to keep my thoughts about Him on Sabbath as well. Like I said previously I enjoy Sabbath by going to church, prayer, reading the Bible, Bible studies, nature hikes etc.

The Pharisees took a legalistic view of the Sabbath and was more concerned with what people were doing or not doing on Sabbath, than enjoying it for the blessing it was meant to be. Jesus made sure we understood if needed, we can do good on the Sabbath. The priority of the day is to keep it Holy, but if a neighbor is injured or you want to bring food to people who are in need or doctors who has to work on a Sabbath if no one else is available, Jesus clarified it is lawful to do good on the Sabbath. I don't think that means this should be the center of Sabbath, this is the Lords day, He is our priority.

Regarding your example, this was the first time the sick person encountered Jesus and He healed her on Sabbath as He was doing good. Her life changed forever.

I hope this helps.

The healing was not an emergency, couldn't Jesus have told the woman to come back the next day and healed her then?

 

[Leaf473]

Mark 2:27 "Then Jesus declared, “The Sabbath was made for man, not man for the Sabbath. Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath. "

Matthew 12:31 “Therefore I say to you, every sin and blasphemy will be forgiven men, but the blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven men. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man, it will be forgiven him; but whoever speaks against the Holy Spirit, it will not be forgiven him, either in this age or in the age to come."

We are all sinners. Don't let sin become blasphemy. Sin and repent truly along life's journey. But don't give yourself to atheistic/anti-Divine sophistry.

Sorry, I don't follow your what you're saying. I invite you to explain more!

 

[pescador]

There is no other covenant, the Old (Mosaic) Covenant is obsolete (Heb 8:13), no one is under it.

You should inform the Jews that the Old (Mosaic) Covenant is obsolete. 8^)

"Or do you not know, brothers and sisters (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law is lord over a person as long as he lives?" Romans 7:1 Paul wrote this to the church in Rome after Christ had brought about the New Covenant. Notice the present tense.

Also, if you quote Scripture it is best to include the entire sentence. "When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear." Hebrews 8:13

Notice that the author said the Old Covenant is growing obsolete and aging and about to disappear, not that it is already obsolete.

More to the point, Jesus said (in Matthew 5:17-19), “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

If you disagree with the above you're disagreeing with Jesus. Whom should I believe, you or Him?

 

[Nathan@work]

You should inform the Jews that the Old (Mosaic) Covenant is obsolete. 8^)

"Or do you not know, brothers and sisters (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that the law is lord over a person as long as he lives?" Romans 7:1 Paul wrote this to the church in Rome after Christ had brought about the New Covenant. Notice the present tense.

Also, if you quote Scripture it is best to include the entire sentence. "When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear." Hebrews 8:13

Notice that the author said the Old Covenant is growing obsolete and aging and about to disappear, not that it is already obsolete.

More to the point, Jesus said (in Matthew 5:17-19), “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

If you disagree with the above you're disagreeing with Jesus. Whom should I believe, you or Him?

There is a difference between the law and the covenant.

 

[Clare73]

You should inform the Jews that the Old (Mosaic) Covenant is obsolete. 8^)

"Or do you not know, brothers and sisters (for I am speaking to those who know the law), that
the law is lord over a person as long as he lives?"

And that requires that the law be in effect, which it is not (Heb 8:13).

Romans 7:1 Paul wrote this to the church in Rome after Christ had brought about the New Covenant. Notice the present tense.

Also, if you quote Scripture it is best to include the entire sentence. "When he speaks of a new covenant, he makes the first obsolete. Now what is growing obsolete and aging is about to disappear." Hebrews 8:13

The meaning of "will soon disappear," (near vanishing) is clear, not to mention Eph 2:15 and Col 2:14.

You are wrestling the Scriptures (2Pe 3:16).

Notice that the author said the Old Covenant is growing obsolete and aging and about to disappear, not that it is already obsolete.

More to the point, Jesus said (in Matthew 5:17-19), “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.

For truly I tell you, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished. Therefore anyone who sets aside one of the least of these commands and teaches others accordingly will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever practices and teaches these commands will be called great in the kingdom of heaven."

The Levitical laws have been accomplished--the sacrifices, defilements, cleansings, holy days, Temple, priesthood, mediator, lawgiver, etc.
have all been accomplished in Jesus, and are now disappeared. (Heb 8:13; Eph 2:15; Col 2:14).

You are wrestling the Scriptures (2Pe 3:16).

 

[Clare73]

There is a difference between the law and the covenant.

The covenant is obsolete (Heb 8:13).

The Levitical laws are abolished (Eph 2:15), the written code (Levitical laws) that was against us (curse) is cancelled (Gal 2:14).

 

[Chi.C]

bye

 

[Nathan@work]

The covenant is obsolete (Heb 8:13).

The Levitical laws are abolished (Eph 2:15), the written code (Levitical laws) that was against us (curse) is cancelled (Gal 2:14).

Levitical laws = fulfilled

God's eternal law = eternal

 

[Clare73]

Levitical laws = fulfilled

God's eternal law = eternal

Which are God's eternal laws?

 

[Nathan@work]

Which are God's eternal laws?

The ones He writes on our heart.

 

[Clare73]

The ones He writes on our heart.

Are they the same for everyone?

 

[Nathan@work]

Are they the same for everyone?

Yes