Reconciled to God while enemies !

[Brightfame52]

If you believe you can sin all you want and not be held accountable because you have been reconciled, you are living in a deception.

I dont know what you talking about, this comment came out of left field.

 

[zoidar]

I dont know what you talking about, this comment came out of left field.

From your previous post, from your theology view, this is just how it seemed. Uncleaness, fornication etc. does not only affect unbelievers, but is very much a topic for believers (the elect) as well.

I'm kind of glad "it came out of left field".

 

[Brightfame52]

Making Peace /reconciliation by the blood of His Cross !2

Now the word peace in Col 1:20

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Its the greek word eirénopoieó: I make peace, reconcile.

to make peace, establish harmony:

Now Christ by His death established Peace and Harmony, reconciliation between the Parties of Men and God, the relationship was mended on both sides !

Now one may ask how could this be, when those Christ died for are born into this world as sinners and enemies like others are See Rom 5:10 ! They are by nature alienated from the Life of God ! But here's how it was done. When Christ rose from the dead, after having died for the sins of God's Sheep, sins that had been charged to Him, He rose reconciled to God on their behalf, their sins having been put away, purged away Heb 1:3

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

Now God was reconciled to Christ and the Sheep in Him, having been alienated from Him in Divine Justice because of their sins; Christ for sins imputed was forsaken of God the Righteous Judge Matt 27:46

46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? See also Ps 22:1 !

You see when God the Father was executing His fierce wrath upon the Son Shepherd and Surety for the sins of His People , He was as the Prophet wrote:

Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity:

And at this time God was not at Peace with His Son for Justice sake, He abandoned Him to the curse and condemnation for the iniquities of His Chosen, He turned away from, was alienated from Him, because of the blackness of sins charged upon Him !

But yet after He exhausted His Justice, and to give evidence that He has been exonerated, God raised Him from the Dead as the God of Peace Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace/reconciled, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

The word for peace here means:

eirḗnē (from eirō, "to join, tie together into a whole") – properly, wholeness, i.e. when all essential parts are joined together; peace (God's gift of wholeness).

Christ was raised from the Dead, reconciled to God, and God to Him, but not for His sake, but for the sake of the People He died for, and put away their sins. God now sees all for whom He died as being in Harmony with Him, because Christ their Head is. Its just like with Adam, before the fall of the elect in him, they in adam were in harmony and friendship with God ! The harmony between both Parties has been restored by Christ blood establishing Peace, and this is the Message of Peace in the Gospel Rom 10:15

And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Not a possibility of Peace if they do this or that, but Peace in that they have in Christ, been reconciled to God, and God to them ! 10

 

[Brightfame52]

From your previous post, from your theology view, this is just how it seemed. Uncleaness, fornication etc. does not only affect unbelievers, but is very much a topic for believers (the elect) as well.

I'm kind of glad "it came out of left field".

I dont know what you talking about, Im commenting on the Death of Christ and its reconciling to God them He died for.

 

[zoidar]

Making Peace /reconciliation by the blood of His Cross !2

Now the word peace in Col 1:20

20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Its the greek word eirénopoieó: I make peace, reconcile.

to make peace, establish harmony:

Now Christ by His death established Peace and Harmony, reconciliation between the Parties of Men and God, the relationship was mended on both sides !

Now one may ask how could this be, when those Christ died for are born into this world as sinners and enemies like others are See Rom 5:10 ! They are by nature alienated from the Life of God ! But here's how it was done. When Christ rose from the dead, after having died for the sins of God's Sheep, sins that had been charged to Him, He rose reconciled to God on their behalf, their sins having been put away, purged away Heb 1:3

Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

Now God was reconciled to Christ and the Sheep in Him, having been alienated from Him in Divine Justice because of their sins; Christ for sins imputed was forsaken of God the Righteous Judge Matt 27:46

46 And about the ninth hour Jesus cried with a loud voice, saying, Eli, Eli, lama sabachthani? that is to say, My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me? See also Ps 22:1 !

You see when God the Father was executing His fierce wrath upon the Son Shepherd and Surety for the sins of His People , He was as the Prophet wrote:

Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity:

And at this time God was not at Peace with His Son for Justice sake, He abandoned Him to the curse and condemnation for the iniquities of His Chosen, He turned away from, was alienated from Him, because of the blackness of sins charged upon Him !

But yet after He exhausted His Justice, and to give evidence that He has been exonerated, God raised Him from the Dead as the God of Peace Heb 13:20

20 Now the God of peace/reconciled, that brought again from the dead our Lord Jesus, that great shepherd of the sheep, through the blood of the everlasting covenant,

The word for peace here means:

eirḗnē (from eirō, "to join, tie together into a whole") – properly, wholeness, i.e. when all essential parts are joined together; peace (God's gift of wholeness).

Christ was raised from the Dead, reconciled to God, and God to Him, but not for His sake, but for the sake of the People He died for, and put away their sins. God now sees all for whom He died as being in Harmony with Him, because Christ their Head is. Its just like with Adam, before the fall of the elect in him, they in adam were in harmony and friendship with God ! The harmony between both Parties has been restored by Christ blood establishing Peace, and this is the Message of Peace in the Gospel Rom 10:15

And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things!

Not a possibility of Peace if they do this or that, but Peace in that they have in Christ, been reconciled to God, and God to them ! 10

"Reconciling God"? That is not a Biblical term, far from it actually.

Now all these things are from God, who reconciled us to Himself through Christ and gave us the ministry of reconciliation,
— 2 Corinthians 5:18

 

[Brightfame52]

God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ !

2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

According to this scripture, how did God reconcile [believers] to Himself ? Was it by their faith or repentance ? Was it by their obedience ? Does it say it was by their own freewill ? No, it was none of that which they did, no act of theirs, but He did it by Jesus Christ, meaning by His Death on the Cross 1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned or reconciled unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

His death, and all it effected, set in motion reconciled those He died for back to God, the word reconciled in 2 Cor 5:18 is the greek word katallasoo , which means : I change, exchange, reconcile, change as when Two parties reconcile together, like marriage partners who had been estranged and at odds 1 Cor 7:11

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

The word also denotes a change from enmity to friendship ! Not Gods enmity towards them, but their enmity towards God. By nature those whom Christ died for and reconciled to God were themselves enemies in their minds towards God, for so says the scriptures Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

All men by nature are with a carnal mind, thats natural for men 1 Cor 3:3

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he[Jesus Christ] reconciled

Now understand, this enmity we have by nature against God is overcome by the effects of Christ's death, causing us to come into a friendship/ fellowship in our hearts and affections towards God and the things of God, and of course our Faith to come to Him in a pleasing manner Heb 11:6 arises out what Jesus Christ by His work of the Cross effected ! Thats what Paul taught in 2 Cor 5:18 and Col 1:21 !

Now in 2 Cor 5:18 who are the Us ? 2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Its all them He reconciled to God while they were being enemies Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

The Us of 2 Cor 5:18 is consistent with the we of Rom 5:10, in fact that word reconciled is the same in both places !

And folks ultimately thats who Christ died for, those who by Him come to Faith/ Friendship and Fellowship experimentally with God Triune !

BTW, that's who the world is in 2 Cor 5:19, a world of men and women of all nations, whose natural enmity against God has been overcome, and they be experimentally brought into the Fellowship/Friendship with God again through Jesus Christ, to whom be all the Glory !

 

[zoidar]

God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ !

2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

According to this scripture, how did God reconcile [believers] to Himself ? Was it by their faith or repentance ? Was it by their obedience ? Does it say it was by their own freewill ? No, it was none of that which they did, no act of theirs, but He did it by Jesus Christ, meaning by His Death on the Cross 1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned or reconciled unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

His death, and all it effected, set in motion reconciled those He died for back to God, the word reconciled in 2 Cor 5:18 is the greek word katallasoo , which means : I change, exchange, reconcile, change as when Two parties reconcile together, like marriage partners who had been estranged and at odds 1 Cor 7:11

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

The word also denotes a change from enmity to friendship ! Not Gods enmity towards them, but their enmity towards God. By nature those whom Christ died for and reconciled to God were themselves enemies in their minds towards God, for so says the scriptures Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

All men by nature are with a carnal mind, thats natural for men 1 Cor 3:3

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he[Jesus Christ] reconciled

Now understand, this enmity we have by nature against God is overcome by the effects of Christ's death, causing us to come into a friendship/ fellowship in our hearts and affections towards God and the things of God, and of course our Faith to come to Him in a pleasing manner Heb 11:6 arises out what Jesus Christ by His work of the Cross effected ! Thats what Paul taught in 2 Cor 5:18 and Col 1:21 !

Now in 2 Cor 5:18 who are the Us ? 2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Its all them He reconciled to God while they were being enemies Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

The Us of 2 Cor 5:18 is consistent with the we of Rom 5:10, in fact that word reconciled is the same in both places !

And folks ultimately thats who Christ died for, those who by Him come to Faith/ Friendship and Fellowship experimentally with God Triune !

BTW, that's who the world is in 2 Cor 5:19, a world of men and women of all nations, whose natural enmity against God has been overcome, and they be experimentally brought into the Fellowship/Friendship with God again through Jesus Christ, to whom be all the Glory !

And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach⁠—
— Colossians 1:21-22

For you were continually straying like sheep, but now you have returned (or like you say: have been reconciled) to the Shepherd and Guardian of your souls.
— 1 Peter 2:25

What do you think "NOW" indicate? Now like when they have faith in Christ or now like before they have faith in Christ?

After being reconciled are they still hostile in mind? Are they still straying? If not, is that after or before faith?

 

[Brightfame52]

And although you were formerly alienated and hostile in mind, engaged in evil deeds, yet He has now reconciled you in His fleshly body through death, in order to present you before Him holy and blameless and beyond reproach⁠—
— Colossians 1:21-22

For you were continually straying like sheep, but now you have returned (or like you say: have been reconciled) to the Shepherd and Guardian of your souls.
— 1 Peter 2:25

What do you think "NOW" indicate? Now like when they have faith in Christ or now like before they have faith in Christ?

After being reconciled are they still hostile in mind? Are they still straying? If not, is that after or before faith?

I just went over that

 

[zoidar]

I just went over that

Ah, you mean in some places where reconciled is used it means before faith and in some places reconciled refers to after faith. Why do you make that distinction?

Sorry, I didn"t read your post very carefully.

 

[Brightfame52]

Ah, you mean in some places where reconciled is used it means before faith and in some places reconciled refers to after faith. Why do you make that distinction?

Sorry, I didn"t read your post very carefully.

Well please read them more carefully, you putting double work on me,, you need to put work in. Look at my posts compared to your posts.

 

[zoidar]

Well please read them more carefully, you putting double work on me,, you need to put work in. Look at my posts compared to your posts.

I post very straight forward questions, and it has seemed to me you ignore them or avoid them and talk about something else. If you want to give me a reply, please quote me or I don't know who or what you are responding to or if you are just making general statements.

Your posts are a lot of text, and most of the time you say this means this and this means this instead of explaining why you believe this particular text is to be seen this way.

I don't know if I get this wrong, but it seems to me you are more interested in teaching theology than discussing the Bible.

 

[zoidar]

Like in this text, where do I find you explaining how you came up with the idea of "God being reconciled"? If you are responding to that I sure miss it. What question is it you are responding to?

God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ !

2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

According to this scripture, how did God reconcile [believers] to Himself ? Was it by their faith or repentance ? Was it by their obedience ? Does it say it was by their own freewill ? No, it was none of that which they did, no act of theirs, but He did it by Jesus Christ, meaning by His Death on the Cross 1 Pet 2:24-25

24 Who his own self bare our sins in his own body on the tree, that we, being dead to sins, should live unto righteousness: by whose stripes ye were healed.

25 For ye were as sheep going astray; but are now returned or reconciled unto the Shepherd and Bishop of your souls.

His death, and all it effected, set in motion reconciled those He died for back to God, the word reconciled in 2 Cor 5:18 is the greek word katallasoo , which means : I change, exchange, reconcile, change as when Two parties reconcile together, like marriage partners who had been estranged and at odds 1 Cor 7:11

11 But and if she depart, let her remain unmarried or be reconciled to her husband: and let not the husband put away his wife.

The word also denotes a change from enmity to friendship ! Not Gods enmity towards them, but their enmity towards God. By nature those whom Christ died for and reconciled to God were themselves enemies in their minds towards God, for so says the scriptures Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Rom 8:7

7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.

All men by nature are with a carnal mind, thats natural for men 1 Cor 3:3

For ye are yet carnal: for whereas there is among you envying, and strife, and divisions, are ye not carnal, and walk as men?

Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he[Jesus Christ] reconciled

Now understand, this enmity we have by nature against God is overcome by the effects of Christ's death, causing us to come into a friendship/ fellowship in our hearts and affections towards God and the things of God, and of course our Faith to come to Him in a pleasing manner Heb 11:6 arises out what Jesus Christ by His work of the Cross effected ! Thats what Paul taught in 2 Cor 5:18 and Col 1:21 !

Now in 2 Cor 5:18 who are the Us ? 2 Cor 5:18

18 And all things are of God, who hath reconciled us to himself by Jesus Christ, and hath given to us the ministry of reconciliation;

Its all them He reconciled to God while they were being enemies Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

The Us of 2 Cor 5:18 is consistent with the we of Rom 5:10, in fact that word reconciled is the same in both places !

And folks ultimately thats who Christ died for, those who by Him come to Faith/ Friendship and Fellowship experimentally with God Triune !

BTW, that's who the world is in 2 Cor 5:19, a world of men and women of all nations, whose natural enmity against God has been overcome, and they be experimentally brought into the Fellowship/Friendship with God again through Jesus Christ, to whom be all the Glory !

 

[Brightfame52]

Reconciled to God by the death of His Son while Enemies !

Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Reconciled to God, by Christs death, while being Enemies, even enemies in our minds by wicked works Col 1:21

21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled

Thats right, even while being alienated, estranged from God by nature and in nature, those Christ died for were reconciled to God by His death.

Now this is a Truth about Grace that the natural man cannot and will not receive, being void of the Spirit of God, it is foolishness to him, even a great stumblingblock !

You see it does mean, while those for whom Christ died are in themselves rebellious against God, they have been nevertheless reconciled or received into Gods Favor/Grace, which implies they have no sin, or iniquities, trespasses charged against them before God, for all these must be taken away, in order for God to receive us into His Favor/Reconciliation !

The word reconciled in Rom 5:10 is the greek word katallassō and means:

1. to change, exchange, as coins for others of equivalent value
2. to reconcile (those who are at variance)
3. return to favour with, be reconciled to one
4. to receive one into favour

So we know that their sins , iniquities have been removed because they cause separation from God as stated here Isa 59:2

But your iniquities have separated between you and your God, and your sins have hid his face from you, that he will not hear.

Christ's death does away with that separation and reconciles God to them into His Favor and Blessing ! This separation is done away with for them in the fact of Jesus Christ their Surety !

Both Parties are reconciled, God to them, they to God by the Perfect Law obedience they have imputed to them through Christ's Obedience Rom 5:19, and all this is True while they themselves are in a state of nature children of wrath as others Eph 2:3

3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others. See Col 1:21 !10

 

[Brightfame52]

Like in this text, where do I find you explaining how you came up with the idea of "God being reconciled"? If you are responding to that I sure miss it. What question is it you are responding to?

Out of all the points I have made, you ask about a statement, " God being reconciled" is that the only point you dispute or question ? What about everything else, can you discuss and highlight those points ? When you can discuss those things with me, I will answer that question, even though its already been answered. Again Im putting in all the work, and you contribute nothing, but demand me to put in more work. I put in 100% work, you put in 1 %, and with that 1% you demand me put in more work.

 

[zoidar]

Out of all the points I have made, you ask about a statement, " God being reconciled" is that the only point you dispute or question ? What about everything else, can you discuss and highlight those points ? When you can discuss those things with me, I will answer that question, even though its already been answered. Again Im putting in all the work, and you contribute nothing, but demand me to put in more work. I put in 100% work, you put in 1 %, and with that 1% you demand me put in more work.

You put a lot of work into things no one has asked you about. I can't focus on all these questions at once. I can however approach one question at a time. Some things you write I don't care much about to discuss, but what I have tried to do is point out flaws in your understanding of some texts, like Romans 5:10, if possible make you see something you have missed. I also like to point out when you use unbiblical language, using terms like "God is reconciled" which is never used in the Bible.

 

[Brightfame52]

You put a lot of work into things no one has asked you about. I can't focus on all these questions at once. I can however approach one question at a time. Some things you write I don't care much about to discuss, but what I have tried to do is point out flaws in your understanding of some texts, like Romans 5:10, if possible make you see something you have missed. I also like to point out when you use unbiblical language, using terms like "God is reconciled" which is never used in the Bible.

You wasting my time, I have been over these things

 

[zoidar]

You wasting my time, I have been over these things

I will continue to point out errors when I see them. You don't have to respond.

 

[Brightfame52]

They shall be also saved by His Life !

Rom 5:10

10 For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

This is one scripture with the Truth it contains, it assures us that Christ did not die for the sins of all mankind, unless all mankind shall be saved by His Life ! And we know the bible does not teach that all mankind without exception shall be saved by the Life of Christ !

However we know from this scripture : Those Christ died for were, while yet being enemies/unbelievers, reconciled to God ! How ? By the Death of His Son, that's how !

Now this being reconciled to God by His Sons death denotes forgiveness of sins, and here's why !

The word reconciled here katallassō and its the same word Paul uses in 2 Cor 5:19

19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation.

And this reconciliation consists of non imputation of their sins, which is forgiveness of sins according to scripture Ps 32:1-2

Blessed is he whose transgression is forgiven, whose sin is covered.

2 Blessed is the man unto whom the Lord imputeth not iniquity, and in whose spirit there is no guile.

Rom 4:7-8

7 Saying, Blessed are they whose iniquities are forgiven, and whose sins are covered.

8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sin.


So those in the world of 2 Cor 5:19, because of non imputation of their trespasses unto them, they are most blessedly forgiven and reconciled to God Rom 5:10, which is solely by the death of Christ for them, not because of their repentance, or believing, because it occurred while they were still being enemies !

11

 

[Brightfame52]

They shall be also saved by His Life !2

However, this aspect of their reconciliation and forgiveness by the death of Christ, still leaves them in spiritual death, or dead in trespasses and sins as in Eph 2:1,5

And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

So by nature, even though those Christ died for are dead in sin, they still have been forgiven of all them, and reconciled to God, even while they are spiritually dead !

But here is where the Promise comes in, which states, those reconciled to God by Christ's death, while they are yet enemies, dead in sin, they shall be saved by/in His Life !

This means that they shall be saved out of that dead state of enmity and being enemies, by His Life, they shall be quickened by His resurrected Life ! Thats what Paul means here 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Thats right, in His Resurrection from the dead, He was made a life giving Spirit, to give life to those for whom He lived and died for. They already have total forgiveness of sins, but now they need Life out of the dead. Christ, their Adam rose from the dead and was seated on the Right Hand of God to give them Life, which is also His resurrection Life for them ! Same thing is implied here Rom 6:4-5

4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

In order to conform us into the Likeness of His Resurrection [which was for us anyway if He died for us] then we must be given to partake of that resurrection life which He does for us as a Life giving Spirit 1 Cor 15:45, which in turn saves us out of our spiritual death and being His enemies Rom 5:10 ! So the reconciled in Rom 5:10, while being enemies, shall be saved from being enemies, by Christ's Life.

This must happen and is promised to happen to everyone Christ died for !

So how could Christ had died for all without exception, when all without exception are not #1 Reconciled to God by His Death, and #2 Saved out of Spiritual death by His Life ? This saving is the same Paul speaks of also in Titus 3:5 by the renewing of the Spirit, which is the result of Christ being a Life giving Spirit 1 Cor 15:45 !

 

[zoidar]

They shall be also saved by His Life !2

However, this aspect of their reconciliation and forgiveness by the death of Christ, still leaves them in spiritual death, or dead in trespasses and sins as in Eph 2:1,5

And you hath he quickened, who were dead in trespasses and sins;

5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved)

So by nature, even though those Christ died for are dead in sin, they still have been forgiven of all them, and reconciled to God, even while they are spiritually dead !

But here is where the Promise comes in, which states, those reconciled to God by Christ's death, while they are yet enemies, dead in sin, they shall be saved by/in His Life !

This means that they shall be saved out of that dead state of enmity and being enemies, by His Life, they shall be quickened by His resurrected Life ! Thats what Paul means here 1 Cor 15:45

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

Thats right, in His Resurrection from the dead, He was made a life giving Spirit, to give life to those for whom He lived and died for. They already have total forgiveness of sins, but now they need Life out of the dead. Christ, their Adam rose from the dead and was seated on the Right Hand of God to give them Life, which is also His resurrection Life for them ! Same thing is implied here Rom 6:4-5

4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection:

In order to conform us into the Likeness of His Resurrection [which was for us anyway if He died for us] then we must be given to partake of that resurrection life which He does for us as a Life giving Spirit 1 Cor 15:45, which in turn saves us out of our spiritual death and being His enemies Rom 5:10 ! So the reconciled in Rom 5:10, while being enemies, shall be saved from being enemies, by Christ's Life.

This must happen and is promised to happen to everyone Christ died for !

So how could Christ had died for all without exception, when all without exception are not #1 Reconciled to God by His Death, and #2 Saved out of Spiritual death by His Life ? This saving is the same Paul speaks of also in Titus 3:5 by the renewing of the Spirit, which is the result of Christ being a Life giving Spirit 1 Cor 15:45 !

Can you point to an Early Chuch Father who held to limited atonement?