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It's not they will prepare themselves, it's that God will prepare them, purify them, convince them et al. In Christian universalism, it's all God and Christ. A common objection to universalism is that it denies free will, if people are drawn to Christ despite their initial rejection.
Good for old Johnny. Sorry one guy is NOT many.Nonetheless many Christians consider what Graham said to be heresy. Like in the article I just posted. John MacArthur went on quite a tirade.
I don't have a transcript for this one. He get's to Billy Graham at 2:12.
He created all humankind, and will not allow an evil serpent to steal, kill and destroy it...
So, at this point, it isn't fallible people, who have the definitive answer to the finished work of Christ, it is the will of the Father.
"And He has made known to us the mystery of His will according to His good pleasure, which He purposed in Christ as a plan for the fullness of time, to bring all things in heaven and on earth together in Christ." -Ephesians 1:10
Interesting. I consider Graham's view to be borderline universalist. I know it appeals to universalists, whereas many other Christians would call it heresy.
"I think there's the Body of Christ, which comes from all the Christian groups around the world. Or outside the Christian groups. I think everybody that loves Christ, or knows Christ, whether they're conscious of it or not, they're members of the Body of Christ" - Billy Graham (1997).
What do you base that on?
Baptist are fallible, if you think they are infallible you completely missed my point.
Not according to Paul...
Rom 9
14 What shall we say then? There is no injustice with God, is there? Far from it! 15 For He says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whomever I have mercy, and I will show compassion to whomever I show compassion.” 16 So then, it does not depend on the person who wants it nor the one who runs, but on God who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very reason I raised you up, in order to demonstrate My power in you, and that My name might be proclaimed throughout the earth.” 18 So then He has mercy on whom He desires, and He hardens whom He desires.
19 You will say to me then, “Why does He still find fault? For who has resisted His will?” 20 On the contrary, who are you, you foolish person, who answers back to God? The thing molded will not say to the molder, “Why did you make me like this,” will it? 21 Or does the potter not have a right over the clay, to make from the same lump one object for honorable use, and another for common use? 22 What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with great patience objects of wrath prepared for destruction? 23 And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon objects of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory, 24 namely us, whom He also called, not only from among Jews, but also from among Gentiles,
It's more like universalism teaches that scripture doesn't mean what certain doctrine says it means. In other words, it's their doctrinal view based on scripture vs the other two Christian doctrinal views based on scripture.
The question regarding ainios is whether it means eternal or age. In the Christian universalist view, there are those who will experience an age united with Christ, and those who will an experience an age of purifying fire which will lead them to come to Christ.
What is your personal interpretation? Predestination, and only a few chosen for salvation? Is that what you think Paul is teaching?
Jesus said twice that many are called but few are chosen.What is your personal interpretation? Predestination, and only a few chosen for salvation? Is that what you think Paul is teaching?
Yes Moses was willing to sacrifice himself for Israel. Just a Paul was in the NT.@[URL='https://www.christianforums.com/members/p1lgr1m.310212/']P1LGR1M[/URL]
Moses requested God to blot his name out of the book of life, do you believe Moses was asking to go to hell for all eternity?
The Bible is an ancient book and hyperbolic expressions are used consistently. It is not a Steven King Horror Novel.
I think there's the body of Christ which comes from all the Christian groups around the world, or outside the Christian groups.
I think that everybody that loves Christ or knows Christ, whether they're conscious of it or not, they're members of the body of Christ.
Whether they come from the Muslim world, or the Buddhist world, or the Christian world, or the non-believing world, they are members of the body of Christ because they've been called by God.
They may not even know the name of Jesus, but they know in their hearts they need something that they don't have and they turn to the only light they have and I think they're saved and they're going to be with us in heaven."
"Yes it is because I believe that. I've met people in various parts of the world in tribal situations that they have never seen a Bible or heard about a Bible, have never heard of Jesus but they've believed in their hearts that there is a God and they tried to live a life that was quite apart from the surrounding community in which they lived."
"This is fantastic. I'm so thrilled to hear you say that. There's a wideness in God's mercy." Dr. Graham: "There is. There definitely is."
Moses was asking to burn in hell?Yes Moses was willing to sacrifice himself for Israel. Just a Paul was in the NT.
The bible for your information is Gods eternal word. God has proclaimed it and will cause it to come to pass.
Mt 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.
Even Stephen King could not imagine the total horror of being somewhere in the complete absence of the presence of God.
Good points, many who practiced religious activities will be outside the door, unprepared for the Kingdom of God. Salvation is secure, sanctification is not complete and they will be purified by the fire.Jesus said twice that many are called but few are chosen.
Matthew 20:16In this passage Jesus said that He would say to many I never knew you depart from me you that work iniquity.
(16) So the last shall be first, and the first last: for many be called, but few chosen.
Matthew 22:14
(14) For many are called, but few are chosen.
Matthew 7:21-23
(21) Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
(22) Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
(23) And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
This is formed as a question. And I believe was not directed to you. You are free to believe as your Baptist faith teaches.There you go again, trying to state what you want me to believe in order to help yourself in the teaching you offer.
Shame, shame...
The word trinity is not found in the Bible. I believe in the trinity, do you?Not found in the Bible.
You are arguing against another false teaching,
that most of mankind is created only to be
destroyed, which you have called the 'traditional view'. The Bible doesn't support that either.
Justice For The Poor-Reforming the Traditional View of Salvation
It's not they will prepare themselves, it's that God will prepare them, purify them, convince them et al. In Christian universalism, it's all God and Christ. A common objection to universalism is that it denies free will, if people are drawn to Christ despite their initial rejection.
Fact: The universalist view does not teach wickedness is rewarded. Universalism teaches that God is unwilling any perish and is willing to wait for all to come to repentance and the knowledge of the truth. Universalism has a higher view of "sanctification". All must prepare for the Kingdom of God. Those who are not ready will enter the fire of Gehenna. This includes "believers".
WRONG! Nothing in the three vss. I quoted support this false conclusion.Good points, many who practiced religious activities will be outside the door, unprepared for the Kingdom of God. Salvation is secure, sanctification is not complete and they will be purified by the fire.
You view scripture through the lens of Baptist interpretation, just as I did at one time. Bible ping pong as I stated leads to the road Nowhere.Not sure how you can 1) think I am trying to defend Baptists (though I do attend a Baptist Church, and would rather see people going to one of those than any other denomination out there) or 2) that I have missed your point, lol.
Still, not a single address of the original post I addressed, or the error pointed out in them. I showed how you improperly used prooftexts out of context to support your teaching, so it is up to you to show why I myself was in error.
God bless.
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