Questions..

MehGuy

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Thought it would be interesting to create a thread where we can ask various questions about religion/philosophies and those of the corresponding religion/philosophy (or those who know the subject well) can answer. Good way to engage and learn from one another.

Want this thread to be a friendly thread, although it's understandable if some people ask questions others might find offensive. Just try to keep everything with good intentions.
 
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MehGuy

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Don't have any questions on the top of my head at the moment, but always happy to answer any that might be asked...

Alright. As a witch do you worship any god/gods?
 
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MehGuy

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I don't like the word 'worship', but maybe I hold a few in high esteem from ancient Celtic and Gaelic pantheons.

Alright cool. Think this thread might include a lot of stupid questions.. lol.. but I think that's fine. You won't learn unless you ask. I'm pretty clueless when it comes to a lot of topics about religion. So sorry if I ask no brainer stuff, lol.

So do you think these Celtic and Gaelic pantheon Gods are real? What about Egyptian Gods? Are they equally real? Or are they kind of all the same Gods just called by different names? That's the vibe I've heard from other Pagans.
 
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awitch

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So do you think these Celtic and Gaelic pantheon Gods are real? What about Egyptian Gods? Are they equally real? Or are they kind of all the same Gods just called by different names? That's the vibe I've heard from other Pagans.

There are definitely a lot of schools of thought about that.
Some will say that all the deities are just facets of a single deity so it's easier to understand.
Some will say that all gods are facets of one male deity and all goddesses are facets of one female deity.
Some will say that the different cultural names all refer to the same deity (Mars=Ares=Tyr=Indra).

I'm in the hard polytheist camp where each of these deities is a unique entity and more than just the personification of an emotion or natural phenomena. Mythology says there's a hierarchy but I don't take any of that literally, so I don't think one is "more powerful" than another.

When I first pursued a Pagan path, I sought Hecate and a Greek pantheon and got a "No thanks" vibe, so I looked at the Egyptian pantheon but they seemed too alien (that's NOT a StarGate reference, by the way). I didn't seem to fit in with the Norse pantheon either but Celtic worked out. So, I accept the other gods as real (including Jesus) but I see them all as more faces in the crowd.
 
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MehGuy

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There are definitely a lot of schools of thought about that.
Some will say that all the deities are just facets of a single deity so it's easier to understand.
Some will say that all gods are facets of one male deity and all goddesses are facets of one female deity.
Some will say that the different cultural names all refer to the same deity (Mars=Ares=Tyr=Indra).

I'm in the hard polytheist camp where each of these deities is a unique entity and more than just the personification of an emotion or natural phenomena. Mythology says there's a hierarchy but I don't take any of that literally, so I don't think one is "more powerful" than another.

Alright, cool. From what I know of the Romans they wanted the people they conquered to pay tribute to their Gods, although they were fine with them continuing worshiping their own Gods (with the exception being the Jews). So it seems to imply at least they thought the Gods were somewhat different.

When I first pursued a Pagan path, I sought Hecate and a Greek pantheon and got a "No thanks" vibe, so I looked at the Egyptian pantheon but they seemed too alien (that's NOT a StarGate reference, by the way). I didn't seem to fit in with the Norse pantheon either but Celtic worked out. So, I accept the other gods as real (including Jesus) but I see them all as more faces in the crowd.

Do you think people's ancestry matters when it comes to them feeling a good vibe from a particular pantheon? Do most Europeans stick to European pantheon deities, most Arabs to Arabic deities, most Africans to African deities.. etc.. any people mix pantheons with each other?
 
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awitch

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Do you think people's ancestry matters when it comes to them feeling a good vibe from a particular pantheon? Do most Europeans stick to European pantheon deities, most Arabs to Arabic deities, most Africans to African deities.. etc.. any people mix pantheons with each other?

I don't see a problem mixing and matching ancestry with another culture's pantheon. We're all humans and I don't think a reasonable deity cares about our backgrounds or our borders.

I'd say it's far more common for people to stick with their own culture because they face being shunned, taunted, or outcast if they stray from the dominant belief system. Either that or they just don't have access to alternate religions.
 
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Zoness

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Alright. As a witch do you worship any god/gods?

I hope you don't mind if I answer this as well. Similar to awitch, I don't use the word worship but I would say "recognize and hold in high esteem" my concept of deity which I believe in something that awitch I already mentioned: the concept of a male and female deity that has many manifestations, though those manifestations are semi-independent. Does that make sense?

Though I do periodically invoke the names of specific irish/welsh celtic gods and goddesses in rituals. In no specific order of importance: Cernunnos, Brigid, Epona, Cerridwen, Lugh, and Rihannon.

Sometimes I reference only the Horned God and Triple Goddess as an abstraction and my understanding of deity. This is not meant as slight to specific deities but simply a different way to venerate them.

I have also studied the Western Hermetic Tradition and its occultism quite a bit which has brought me closer to Greek and Roman gods/goddesses as well as Christian and Jewish esoteric angels and demons, in particular. Though I do not venerate any of them. I am initiated into a fraternity, which in a way is a Greek Mystery Religious tradition but most people don't see it that way, just figured I'd mention for interest. Furthermore I am a member of a now defunct esoteric order that was mostly a gathering of folks interested in Western magick.

Alright, cool. From what I know of the Romans they wanted the people they conquered to pay tribute to their Gods, although they were fine with them continuing worshiping their own Gods (with the exception being the Jews). So it seems to imply at least they thought the Gods were somewhat different.

Do you think people's ancestry matters when it comes to them feeling a good vibe from a particular pantheon? Do most Europeans stick to European pantheon deities, most Arabs to Arabic deities, most Africans to African deities.. etc.. any people mix pantheons with each other?

This was common in many empires. Interestingly enough, the Mongols, during the reign of Ghengis Khan absorbed many faiths in their conquests. The Mongol hordes identified with the Tengrii religion and did not usually require vassals to convert but they did order people to pray to their specific Gods as a sort of cosmic insurance policy. Muslims, Christians and pagans alike could keep their gods but they had to pray for the safety and strength of the mongols.

As for me, it also applies; I recognize that all deities and spirits of the world's many faiths. That even includes Christianity, although it does not reciprocate. For example, in IT I work with many Indian nationals who are openly Hindu. I could pray to their gods, if I felt so inclined but my lack of understanding and lack of cultural connection are sort of psychological barriers to me connecting with them, if that makes a lot of sense. I recognize their existence but do not particularly worship them.

Some branches of Nordic and Germanic heathenry and Slavic paganism are strict about ethnic origins but frankly, I would stay away from these types as they're often very nationalist which is something that makes me personally uncomfortable.

Many others don't necessarily mix pantheons but have been known to reach out to gods from around the world if felt inclined. I know someone who feels a particular connection to the Egyptian goddess Hathor, and has a small altar dedicated to her. Nothing fancy but its nice for him.
 
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Zoness

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I don't like the word 'worship', but maybe I hold a few in high esteem from ancient Celtic and Gaelic pantheons.

Do you have an altar? Do you celebrate any holidays on the wheel of the year?
 
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Do you have an altar? Do you celebrate any holidays on the wheel of the year?

It's not a permanent altar. I just set it up for special occasions like holidays.
I celebrate only a few of the 8 common ones; Yule, Imbolc, Beltane, Midsummer, and Samhain.
 
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Quid est Veritas?

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Some will say that the different cultural names all refer to the same deity (Mars=Ares=Tyr=Indra).
There is an error here. All the various Indo-European peoples' gods are related to one another, but Indra doesn't fit these others. The various peoples' mythologies likely evolved from a common one, as the languages also evolved from a common root.

The Indo-European War gods of Mars, Ares, Tiw, has an Indian equivalent Marutas - whose name anyway shows the affinity to both Mars and Ares. He is a companion of Indra.
Indra is a form of Dyaus Piter, the sky father and storm god, so the equivalent of Jupiter, Zeus, Thor. Again, the equivalency can be seen in the name.
..., so I looked at the Egyptian pantheon but they seemed too alien (that's NOT a StarGate reference, by the way).
Too late, the image has already been established. Clearly all neopagans believe in the literal interpretation of Stargate and Ancient Aliens.
 
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Alright, cool. From what I know of the Romans they wanted the people they conquered to pay tribute to their Gods, although they were fine with them continuing worshiping their own Gods (with the exception being the Jews). So it seems to imply at least they thought the Gods were somewhat different.
This is wrong. Rome did what is called the Interpretatio Romana, which said that any gods they discovered were just a form of one of their own gods. So people continued worshipping their own gods, but their cults were co-opted into one of the official Roman cults. In this way, continuing to worship your own gods was a way to worship the Roman ones as well. Usually a Roman statue was just sneaked into a native sanctuary and their names twinned, like Sulis-Minerva or Jupiter-Ammon. Sometimes a full syncretic deity arose from this, like Bel in Palmyra.

The Romans did not consider ethnic deities fully separate, unless they were completely unable to find a suitable Roman equivalent - which happened very rarely. An example of this is Nerthus amongst the Germanic tribes. When Tacitus was writing on Germanic religion he would speak of Mercury or Mars, instead of Woden or Tiw - but had to transliterate the Germanic name to a Roman form in the case of Nerthus, as it was too dissimilar.
On occasion they would talk of 'the Asian Venus' or 'Punic Hercules' if they needed to differentiate more specifically between gods they otherwise equated. This was usually related to descriptions of differences in cultic practices or mythology, rather than that a true difference was assumed.

The Jews resisted such interpretations, but this is in fact what Hadrian attempted to do when he tried to rebuild Jerusalem as Aelia Capitolana. He was trying to equate YHWH with Capitoline Jupiter.
 
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This was common in many empires. Interestingly enough, the Mongols, during the reign of Ghengis Khan absorbed many faiths in their conquests. The Mongol hordes identified with the Tengrii religion and did not usually require vassals to convert but they did order people to pray to their specific Gods as a sort of cosmic insurance policy. Muslims, Christians and pagans alike could keep their gods but they had to pray for the safety and strength of the mongols.
There is a tale of the Great Khan Mongke who calls together a Nestorian, a Jew, a Manichee, a Muslim, a Buddhist and a visiting Roman Catholic to debate religion. He concludes that God is like a hand and each religion is a finger of that hand. This is how they generally viewed it earlier, although Tengri-ism is more the wishful thinking of pan-Turkic 19th century Nationalists. They did have a Sky Father High God, but this is very common - if not an almost universal - human trait (Read up on the Vienna school of Anthropology who investigated this in depth).

After the Mongol Empire started breaking up into sub-khanates, some of these became violently specific for one form of religion. The Ilkhanate adopted Islam and violently persecuted the Nestorians and Manichees, while Mongolia proper fell under the Yellow Hat Buddhists that suppressed Nestorianism as well. With Mongols it very much depends on the nature of the Khan, from easygoing ones religion wise, like the the first 4 Great Khans, to utterly devoted absolutists like Tamberlaine or Toktamish.
 
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