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StarryEyes
Guest
Does tithing mean that 10% needs to go to the church, or does it mean the money can go to other places, such as the Red Cross? Or do you just give the money wherever God leads you?
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mrscplus
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The tithe was put into place so that the local "church" would be able to function. It fed the priests, and saw that those who needed help would be able to receive it. It was our "rent", as presecibed by God.
Offerings are anything over and above that. I heard a really great sermon a number of years ago that explained this. We need to "pay the rent first", 10% off the top, and then we give our offerings.
DH and I have had times over the years where we were not able to afford the 10%. When we cut it back, we struggled more. God honours sacrificial giving (read the parable of the widow's mite). When we are able to tithe, or better - we have more liquid funds available.
God wants us to trust him to provide, and the less we hang on to what he has given us in the first place, the more He honours that.
Offerings are anything over and above that. I heard a really great sermon a number of years ago that explained this. We need to "pay the rent first", 10% off the top, and then we give our offerings.
DH and I have had times over the years where we were not able to afford the 10%. When we cut it back, we struggled more. God honours sacrificial giving (read the parable of the widow's mite). When we are able to tithe, or better - we have more liquid funds available.
God wants us to trust him to provide, and the less we hang on to what he has given us in the first place, the more He honours that.
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
Tithing is an Old Testament law, which was a bit like social security welfare, everyone paid 10% of their crops to be placed in the storehouse for feeding the Levites and Priests. It was also used to look after the orphans and the widows.
Today, the New Testament there is no tithing, but giving with a grateful heart to the church, and there is no set figure, it's an offering.
I give with a grateful heart, whether it's 2% or 20%. I also give to all other charities, and all other offerings over my set offerings. I support a child in Ethiopia.
So when it all comes down to the points score, it's all between you and God and no one else.
There are no set rules, and whatever your heart tells you and basically what you can afford.
Don't allow Malachi to berate you about tithing.
Today, the New Testament there is no tithing, but giving with a grateful heart to the church, and there is no set figure, it's an offering.
I give with a grateful heart, whether it's 2% or 20%. I also give to all other charities, and all other offerings over my set offerings. I support a child in Ethiopia.
So when it all comes down to the points score, it's all between you and God and no one else.
There are no set rules, and whatever your heart tells you and basically what you can afford.
Don't allow Malachi to berate you about tithing.
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
The tithe is an OT thing ... we do need to give but I don't think it's 10%. Some things that were covered by the tithe are now covered through taxes. I personally think whatever we give is what we give to God, not necessarily directly to the church. For example, my ministry costs me a fortune to run and the church doesn't pay me like they do everyone else who has less costs associated with their ministry - so I feel ok about giving less financially to the church as I'm giving plenty to God's service. My church wouldn't agree but unless God convicts me otherwise, I'm ok with that.
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
If the pastor is throwing money around on limos and first class air fares I think it's time to find a new church! If there's that much money they should use it for more outreach! I know our church is struggling financially.
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
MMMmmm Aldar, it's time that you left that church.HEY! Someone has to pay for those first class tickets and limo shuttles from and to the airport!!!
We have many such churches in our country who berate and molest their congregation for a new jet plane.
They do get many "mention in despatches", but all falls on deaf ears and scale laden eyes.
Oh well, only HE know what will hapen to those who live in luxury, while the poor suffer.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
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StarryEyes
Guest
yeah my church is struggling too but I feel led to give money somewhere else, and I dunno if I should use tithe money or "other" money
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
Your spirtual mind, your heart, will lead you.
You offer whatever you are able to other to your church, and if you wish to offer more to other charities that is between you and our Lord Jesus Christ.
This doubt and confusion that you appear to be experiencing is of the enemy.
We offer to our church what we can afford, but we shouldn't reduce our church offerings for some other needs of others. Those offerings are extra offerings.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
What do you feel is right? I personally think we need to be giving to our church as they have bills to pay and if we want the 'service' to be there someone has to support it. But I don't think you have to give them everything that you have allocated for 'giving'.
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GraceDaily
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I remember asking this on here with my old account!
Someone gave me a very good answer. When Paul speaks in the New Testament he said a lot about giving and money and yet never mentioned a 10% tithe, I think it's an Old Testament thing like someone else said. Of course it's still good to give as much as you can, more than 10% or just whatever you can. I think also, if you feel it is right to give 10% then it's also okay to give some of that to a charity.
Someone gave me a very good answer. When Paul speaks in the New Testament he said a lot about giving and money and yet never mentioned a 10% tithe, I think it's an Old Testament thing like someone else said. Of course it's still good to give as much as you can, more than 10% or just whatever you can. I think also, if you feel it is right to give 10% then it's also okay to give some of that to a charity.
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The tithes went to the storehouse, but there were also offerings for all sorts of things, and community dinners where everyone brought according to their abundance.
We might think, well, I pay taxes so that's taken care of. But how many of us scramble and maneuver to get out of as much taxation as we can? It's the mindset of making sure that everyone in your community is taken care of, and that your governing systems have what they need to operate and take care of their people.
If everyone respects giving to these systems, then there is no inability to provide safe roads, good schools, care for disabled, etc.
Our family tends to pay about ten percent of our tithe to shelters or ministries that take care of people, about ten to friends who are missionaries, and roughly eighty percent of the tithe to church. Then donations to secular nonprofits cover the slushy things we never noticed people gave us -- outgrown bikes, fix-it favors, books, etc. (We don't get as many donation requests as some people do.)
I also like to think of tithe as a percentage of time, so when starting a project I also feel God prompting me to offer free work to someone else who needs it. That's just a creative thing He does, not something I've seen written out as a rule.
There are people who take care of elderly or ill relatives -- it would be great if others made that a share of what they considered giving, to lighten some of the responsibility.
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
Yep, as I said earlier the 10% tithe was a means of taxation that paid for government officials,and unemployed, and others on welfare, etc., etc.
Yep, they didn't have good old taxation in those days, and these modern days they really get at you, and you are paying more than 10% out of your wages.
And when you hear some pastors badgering and berating their congregation to pay 10% of their gross wage before tax, before they pay their bills and before they buy groceris to feed their family is disgraceful. And to add insult to their intelligence they use Malachi as their Law.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
Yep, they didn't have good old taxation in those days, and these modern days they really get at you, and you are paying more than 10% out of your wages.
And when you hear some pastors badgering and berating their congregation to pay 10% of their gross wage before tax, before they pay their bills and before they buy groceris to feed their family is disgraceful. And to add insult to their intelligence they use Malachi as their Law.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
Our church wants 10% of gross income and missions giving on top of that (no prescribed amount) and offerings *phew*. Considering we pay an average 34% tax, that's about half our income accounted for between the government and the church if we were to tithe and give as much as they'd think was fair ... I don't tithe although I do contribute generously timewise and financially to the church.
If I ever were to work for the church on church pay I'd pay 10% of my personal income because I think it would be hypocritical not to. In fact, I'd give more if they were more willing to help me with my ministry but they don't so I consider what my ministry, run out of the church and utilised fully by the church, costs me is a generous offering.
If I ever were to work for the church on church pay I'd pay 10% of my personal income because I think it would be hypocritical not to. In fact, I'd give more if they were more willing to help me with my ministry but they don't so I consider what my ministry, run out of the church and utilised fully by the church, costs me is a generous offering.
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In wonder if those sermons pushing for more than 10% are really trying to raise the bar for people who don't give anything... thinking that intimidation will get them to understand the concept, where in reality it overwhelms them.
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
I don't know. But I do know that when we are told it's 10% and then missions giving and offerings on top, I start to feel quite overwhelmed!!!!
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TakeAllOfMe
Guest
I don't know. But I do know that when we are told it's 10% and then missions giving and offerings on top, I start to feel quite overwhelmed!!!! Though I don't feel intimidated or pressured.
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
It's all overwhelming when His Servants are being berated and badgered by false teaching using Old Covenant stuff, which has no bearing whatsoever on GIVING WITH A GRATEFUL HEART, which is the New Covenant.
HIS WORD doesn't say anything about tithing 10% of any income whatsoever!
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
HIS WORD doesn't say anything about tithing 10% of any income whatsoever!
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
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Most of the Mosaic Law was given with this wording:
Ex 31:16
Wherefore the Israelites shall keep the Sabbath to observe it throughout their generations, a perpetual covenant.
Nu 15:21
Of the first of your coarse meal you shall give to the Lord a portion for a gift throughout your generations [your heave or lifted-out offering].
Nu 15:23
When you have erred and have not observed all these commandments which the Lord has spoken to Moses, even all that the Lord has commanded you through Moses, from the day that the Lord gave commandment and onward throughout your generations, Then it shall be, if it was done unwittingly or in error without the knowledge of the congregation...
And the priest shall make atonement for all the congregation of the Israelites, and they shall be forgiven, for it was an error and they have brought their offering... and their sin offering before the Lord for their error.Jesus made this offering for our atonement, and He is also our High Priest. We bring Jesus' offering of Himself to God, to atone for our errors.
Obedience to the Law was not meant to make us righteous -- it was meant to protect us. Our repentence and devotion to God -- our acts of remorse (offerings) and our faith, our attention to His advice, have always been what God is pleased with.
Abraham's faith was counted to his as righteousness. Ro 4:9
Jesus said he did not come to abolish the law, but to fulfill it. Mt 5:17
Following the guidelines Moses laid out are a matter of respect for God's wisdom. If we don't give to church, we don't have a minister or a building.
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Elijah2
No weapons formed against me will prosper.
My dear sister that is Old Covenant stuff.
Matt. 5:17 was a comment made by Jesus to the Pharisees, who charged him with nullifying the law, and has nothing to do with the New Covenant. And HE was referring to the Ceremonial Law, The Civil Law, and The Moral Law.
All the principles behind the laws to worship and love our Holy God, to guide our conduct, and reveal the nature and will of God.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
Matt. 5:17 was a comment made by Jesus to the Pharisees, who charged him with nullifying the law, and has nothing to do with the New Covenant. And HE was referring to the Ceremonial Law, The Civil Law, and The Moral Law.
All the principles behind the laws to worship and love our Holy God, to guide our conduct, and reveal the nature and will of God.
Be blessed in Jesus' Name.
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