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Pro-Choice?

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Boltwave

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I'm not a Christian, but I definetly despise abortion, today my family had some friends over and I listened in on my brother in law stating he was "pro-choice", when I heard this, I became slightly disturbed, I brought it up with my sister and her response was "well of course, we are all pro-choice", I argued with her that instead of killing the fetus people should consider adoption, her take on it was that 1/10 of every orphan gets adopted and the rest are sent to institutions, therefore she attempted to justify that it woudl be better to abort that unwanted fetus than to let it grow up in an orphaned lifestyle.

This conversation got started because one of my sister's friends is a few weeks pregnant, especially gut-churning was to sit there doing my homework and listen to her conversation "obviously you are not the type of person to get an abortion because you are willing to raise it, for certain people it's okay, for you it's obviously not."

However, for me this just doesn't cut it, my sister claims to believe in "God" but she like most other people twist and rehash things to be more "considerative" and "open minded."

My sister supports homosexuality, I certaintly don't want it banned from the country, and people can practice whatever they want under their free rights, but I don't think "God made them that way" and this is what my sister asserts, she thinks of homosexuality as God's "natural birth control."

The problem with her logic is that if she supports "God's natural birth control" why does she approve of some atrocity as a small living human organism being plucked from the whom with a pair of tweezers? When I told her I disagreed, she mocked me, calling me ignorant and making a joke of my perspective, I, on the other hand, found nothing hillarious at all to do with it, she even thought it was funny to say "the reason I'm pro-choice is because of your existence", I kept my words inside my head, but I wanted to say: "well then, do enjoy the taste of fire and brimstone."

I honestly think my sister is a complete and total idiot, how can anyone who believes in God be so incredibly stupid to approve of abortion? Abortion is exceptional in the rarest of occasions, and I mean, life or death occasions, not a third option for being an irresponsible puke, to try and justify it saying "just because they are aborted doesn't mean that their souls don't go to heaven", HERE'S A BETTER QUESTION: IF GOD TRUELY DOESN'T OPPOSE THIS IDEA WHY PUT THE LIFE IN THE WHOM IN THE FIRST PLACE????

A few times I've tried to embrace Christianity but my family would badily ridicule me for it, if I'm not this "liberalist" or I'm for "pro-choice" I'm ignorant and close minded, I'm a "religious nut, a zealot", why is society deluding itself like this? It's all because of a little thing they call "religious bigotry", even though it's more of a cop out of a person's responsibilities, their actions and the consequences that follow, today I felt great grief for all of the lives that are lost due to the practice of abortional surgery, and, if a creator truely put them there, how evil it is for man to dispense of life like garbage, and to not want to be held accountable.
 

Annoula

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... today I felt great grief for all of the lives that are lost due to the practice of abortional surgery, and, if a creator truely put them there, how evil it is for man to dispense of life like garbage, and to not want to be held accountable.


i totally agree with you my friend.

even if you are mocked or rediculed for what you believe... don't let anyone make you feel bad.

you are in the right side, you are promoting creation... like our Creator.
 
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rocklife

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boltwave, I hope you do not think that just because someone believes in God makes them a christian. that is not true (friendly reminder). A christian is one who follows Christ and His teachings, and one way to do that is by actually taking time to read His teachings and spending time with Jesus. many churchgoers do not do this, I would also doubt if they know Jesus, how can you follow Him if you don't know Him? you can't, and many churchgoers are going to be told as Jesus says in Matthew 7:21-27 "away from me, evildoers, I never knew you." I sincerely question whether your sister actually knows Jesus and follows Him just with the little bit of information you share (I don't know, but I do question her stance of homosexuality and etc, sin is what nailed Jesus to the cross, christians reject sin as much as possible, sin brings death, we wish to encourage all to life, not death)

I don't know why so many things happen, but it seems the Bible has a position that we won't know all things clearly right now, but one day, in His time, He will share all things and give all the reasons, and I believe we will be able to see why He allowed what He did.

and I have faith that God does save babies. I don't know the age of accountability, but there is something to it. David says in 2 Samuel 12:23, when his baby died, that he would see that baby again, he would go to his baby, but that baby would not come back to him, meaning seeing him in heaven times. I believe babies who are taken away before they can consciously be held accountable are in God's care. God does give us choice, but He also has reasons for things.

I have faith in goodness, righteousness, and that evil is not going to win.
 
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Confess

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Welcome to the club where families do not understand and are intolerant to your views. My family is just as closed minded.

The Bible says that God gives people over to their perversions when they continue to reject and reject and reject.

What God creates is good. It is just the people who are blessed with children who are bad. God is a loving God who loves all his creation. If you really look at it, he is constantly giving us blessing after blessing after blessing. And we tend to reject most of them.

Take the lady who recently was diagnosed with a mental disorder. She feels that her limbs (arms and legs) stop her from feeling human, so she found a doctor to remove one of her limbs. She felt good after the operation but now feels that she needs her other leg removed.

How crazy is that, right?

She was blessed with arms and legs and yet she sees them as a burden.

To me she is just as crazy as the pro-abortionist. I do not call them pro-choicers because they are against choice. They are only in favor of abortion.

Notice how they are not in favor of the choice of adoption, or in favor of the choice to financial help the women who are struggling to keep their children, or in favor of providing moral support.

People who speak of death are scary to me and they cannot be trusted.
 
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Calminian

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I'm not a Christian, but I definetly despise abortion, today my family had some friends over and I listened in on my brother in law stating he was "pro-choice", when I heard this, I became slightly disturbed, I brought it up with my sister and her response was "well of course, we are all pro-choice", I argued with her that instead of killing the fetus people should consider adoption, her take on it was that 1/10 of every orphan gets adopted and the rest are sent to institutions, therefore she attempted to justify that it woudl be better to abort that unwanted fetus than to let it grow up in an orphaned lifestyle.

Even if her statistics are true, this doesn't justify murder. There was a european doctor a while back that was advocating the right of parents to kill their child up to a year after its birth. He used the same reasoning your family did.

This conversation got started because one of my sister's friends is a few weeks pregnant, especially gut-churning was to sit there doing my homework and listen to her conversation "obviously you are not the type of person to get an abortion because you are willing to raise it, for certain people it's okay, for you it's obviously not."

However, for me this just doesn't cut it, my sister claims to believe in "God" but she like most other people twist and rehash things to be more "considerative" and "open minded."

My sister supports homosexuality, I certaintly don't want it banned from the country, and people can practice whatever they want under their free rights, but I don't think "God made them that way" and this is what my sister asserts, she thinks of homosexuality as God's "natural birth control."

This is usually a sign they don't really know the Lord at all. The bible warns about false christians. I was actually both pro-choice and pro homosexual (though I was hetero) before I was saved. God changed me.

A few times I've tried to embrace Christianity but my family would badily ridicule me for it, if I'm not this "liberalist" or I'm for "pro-choice" I'm ignorant and close minded, I'm a "religious nut, a zealot", why is society deluding itself like this? It's all because of a little thing they call "religious bigotry", even though it's more of a cop out of a person's responsibilities, their actions and the consequences that follow, today I felt great grief for all of the lives that are lost due to the practice of abortional surgery, and, if a creator truely put them there, how evil it is for man to dispense of life like garbage, and to not want to be held accountable.

Becoming a christian is not easy and more difficult when family opposes you. My family is very similar. But boltwave, you really need to commit yourself to the Lord before you can be an effective witness. Remember God is only true evangelist and He will work through His people. What's holding you back? I'm thinking maybe your family has soured you toward christianity?
 
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MooCar93

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I honestly think my sister is a complete and total idiot, how can anyone who believes in God be so incredibly stupid to approve of abortion? Abortion is exceptional in the rarest of occasions, and I mean, life or death occasions, not a third option for being an irresponsible puke, to try and justify it saying "just because they are aborted doesn't mean that their souls don't go to heaven", HERE'S A BETTER QUESTION: IF GOD TRUELY DOESN'T OPPOSE THIS IDEA WHY PUT THE LIFE IN THE WHOM IN THE FIRST PLACE????

Wow. And so tolerant of other people's opinions, too.
 
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KomissarSteve

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The Bible says that God gives people over to their perversions when they continue to reject and reject and reject.
I do not call them pro-choicers because they are against choice. They are only in favor of abortion.

As a pro-choice Christian, I deeply resent both of these mischaracterizations. The point of the pro-choice movement is not to increase the rate of abortions; far from it, as Bill Clinton put it towards the beginning of his term, the aim of the pro-choice movement is to keep abortions "safe, legal, and rare." This is evidenced by the fact that abortion rates declined by 10% under Clinton - and went back up 10% under George W. Bush. The reason for this is obviously not that Clinton outlawed abortion and Bush didn't, because neither of these things happened. What DID happen, however, was that Bill Clinton's policies regarding the minimum wage and benefits, gave young pregnant women a better chance at carrying their baby to term and raising him or her on their own. Now that the minimum wage and maternity benefits have failed to keep pace with the cost of living under the current administration, abortion rates have gone up again.

Nobody likes abortions. Everybody wants them to not happen. But unwanted pregnancies occur either way, and we in the pro-choice movement believe that it is a far, far greater evil to create an incentive for young women to have back-alley abortions, in which many of them will be mutilated or die, than it is to keep legal safe, clean options that will not compound the sin.

Take the lady who recently was diagnosed with a mental disorder. She feels that her limbs (arms and legs) stop her from feeling human, so she found a doctor to remove one of her limbs. She felt good after the operation but now feels that she needs her other leg removed.

How crazy is that, right?

She was blessed with arms and legs and yet she sees them as a burden.

To me she is just as crazy as the pro-abortionist.

If you're referring to body integrity identity disorder, or Apotemnophilia, that's a serious mental disorder, but it has nothing to do with being pro-choice, which is a decision made out of strong moral conviction.

Notice how they are not in favor of the choice of adoption, or in favor of the choice to financial help the women who are struggling to keep their children, or in favor of providing moral support.

This is also completely untrue. The pro-choice crowd is doing far more than the hardcore pro-lifers to reduce the number of abortions. Check the website for the Washington Post; they had an article just a week ago on the issue: "Democratic Leaders Back Bills to Increase Aid for Family Planning, Pregnancy Support."
 
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Zeena

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s a pro-choice Christian, I deeply resent both of these mischaracterizations.
And you can CONTINUE to deeply resent it all you want!
I see no reason to have taken offense in the FIRST place! =P
Matthew 11:6
And blessed is he, whosoever shall not be offended in me.

The point of the pro-choice movement is not to increase the rate of abortions; far from it, as Bill Clinton put it towards the beginning of his term, the aim of the pro-choice movement is to keep abortions "safe, legal, and rare." This is evidenced by the fact that abortion rates declined by 10% under Clinton - and went back up 10% under George W. Bush. The reason for this is obviously not that Clinton outlawed abortion and Bush didn't, because neither of these things happened. What DID happen, however, was that Bill Clinton's policies regarding the minimum wage and benefits, gave young pregnant women a better chance at carrying their baby to term and raising him or her on their own. Now that the minimum wage and maternity benefits have failed to keep pace with the cost of living under the current administration, abortion rates have gone up again.
Here in Canada, abortion has been 'legal' for long time, and the mortality rate continues to climb =P

http://www.webhart.net/vandee/abortstat.shtml

Nobody likes abortions. Everybody wants them to not happen. But unwanted pregnancies occur either way, and we in the pro-choice movement believe that it is a far, far greater evil to create an incentive for young women to have back-alley abortions, in which many of them will be mutilated or die, than it is to keep legal safe, clean options that will not compound the sin.
They will not occur either way, unless one is willing to break the law! =P

If you're referring to body integrity identity disorder, or Apotemnophilia, that's a serious mental disorder, but it has nothing to do with being pro-choice, which is a decision made out of strong moral conviction.

This is also completely untrue. The pro-choice crowd is doing far more than the hardcore pro-lifers to reduce the number of abortions. Check the website for the Washington Post; they had an article just a week ago on the issue: "Democratic Leaders Back Bills to Increase Aid for Family Planning, Pregnancy Support."
Adoption is a VERY viable method of dealing with 'unwanted' pregnancies! For EVERY child born there is someone who would raise him/her as his own!!! :cry:

But really, what is 'unwanted' is God's will!

EVERY child is a gift from God!
 
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Zeena

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Prochoice =/= proabortion.
Prochoice means letting each individual come to a conclusion about it, using their brains and thought process the same way you did. Anything else wouldn't be prochoice, it would be YOURchoice...imposed on everyone else.
And if I decided to MURDER my neighbor?!?!

MY CHOICE, RIGHT?!?!!?!

Let ME weigh the pro's and con's and I'll tell YOU what I decide! =P
 
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MooCar93

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They will not occur either way, unless one is willing to break the law! =P

Because people never do things that are illegal when they're desperate, right?

I see no reason to have taken offense in the FIRST place! =P

Please re-read the posts on page 1. Thanks.
 
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Zeena

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MooCar93 said:
Because people never do things that are illegal when they're desperate, right?
Romans 3:19
Now we know that what things soever the law saith, it saith to them who are under the law: that every mouth may be stopped, and all the world may become guilty before God.

No, but because then their conscience would be seared!
KNOWING they have broken the LAW!

Romans 3:31
Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.
 
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Shemjaza

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I honestly think my sister is a complete and total idiot, how can anyone who believes in God be so incredibly stupid to approve of abortion? Abortion is exceptional in the rarest of occasions, and I mean, life or death occasions, not a third option for being an irresponsible puke, to try and justify it saying "just because they are aborted doesn't mean that their souls don't go to heaven", HERE'S A BETTER QUESTION: IF GOD TRUELY DOESN'T OPPOSE THIS IDEA WHY PUT THE LIFE IN THE WHOM IN THE FIRST PLACE????

A few times I've tried to embrace Christianity but my family would badily ridicule me for it, if I'm not this "liberalist" or I'm for "pro-choice" I'm ignorant and close minded, I'm a "religious nut, a zealot", why is society deluding itself like this? It's all because of a little thing they call "religious bigotry", even though it's more of a cop out of a person's responsibilities, their actions and the consequences that follow, today I felt great grief for all of the lives that are lost due to the practice of abortional surgery, and, if a creator truely put them there, how evil it is for man to dispense of life like garbage, and to not want to be held accountable.
I don't think "If God didn't want it to develop, he wouldn't have allowed it to grow there" is a very good argument. If God exists then he allows a great many things, cancer, Ebola, brain parasites and all many of other natural things.

If the actions of an omnipotent beings are of such a concern to you, why don't you question why he doesn't stop abortionists? I'm sure either a stern word from an angel or a localized lightening bolt would so.

And you might be irritated with your family, but remember, saying "It's wrong! It just is, you idiot!" is very rarely going to convince anyone.
 
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MooCar93

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No, but because then their conscience would be seared!
KNOWING they have broken the LAW!

Great, so in addition to the searing pain of having her uterus torn and perforated with a rusty coat hanger, the woman needs to deal with a jail sentence. Awesome.
 
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Zeena

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Great, so in addition to the searing pain of having her uterus torn and perforated with a rusty coat hanger,

Romans 1:27c
and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.

the woman needs to deal with a jail sentence. Awesome.
It's not so much a matter of a jail sentence, as it is with the hopeful expectation that God would open thier eyes to see this as a sinful act, and themselves as sinners in need of a Saviour!

John 16:8
And he, when he is come, will convict the world in respect of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment:
 
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