Predestination? Doesn't God want all to be saved?

[98cwitr]

No, on His desires for us, which He won't force us to embrace or obey. The Parable of the Talents gives a good description of how this principle works BTW.

Why would God attempt to work in someone who would never do anything but resist Him? Did the master in the parable demonstrate Omniscience? So when God says "I will give you a new heart and a new mind and write my Law on your hearts" it's really some sort of passive analogy instead of an actual, active thing that God does?

 

[98cwitr]

You don't see a problem with loving those that God hates? You don't see a problem with God telling you, through His son, to love those that He hates?

Nope. I certainly don't. God will handle them, it's not my place to. It's my place to do as His Will has contended for the life in me He has created. Christ asked the Father to forgive even those who were killing Him.

 

[bling]

Nope. I certainly don't. God will handle them, it's not my place to. It's my place to do as His Will has contended for the life in me He has created. Christ asked the Father to forgive even those who were killing Him.

So did Christ Love even the non-elect while he was on earth?

Can you show me when Christ was not loving to the non-elect?

Would this not mean Christ and God are very different when Christ was to show through His being here exactly how God is?

Is God our poor example of Loving our enemies?

 

[bbbbbbb]

So did Christ Love even the non-elect while he was on earth?

Can you show me when Christ was not loving to the non-elect?

Would this not mean Christ and God are very different when Christ was to show through His being here exactly how God is?

Is God our poor example of Loving our enemies?

Christ definitely had some very harsh words addressed to the Pharisees and scribes. Based on their reaction, I would say they did not see any love in Him.

In addition, He did not mince words concerning the fate of the lost at the Last Judgment.

 

[seeingeyes]

Nope. I certainly don't. God will handle them, it's not my place to. It's my place to do as His Will has contended for the life in me He has created. Christ asked the Father to forgive even those who were killing Him.

And did the Father forgive them?

 

[bling]

Christ definitely had some very harsh words addressed to the Pharisees and scribes. Based on their reaction, I would say they did not see any love in Him.

In addition, He did not mince words concerning the fate of the lost at the Last Judgment.

So that is “not loving” on Christ’s part?

The truth can hurt, but it also can help over time especially.

Some of those white washed pillars eventually heed Christ’s warnings and would turn to Him.

The judgment, hell and fate of the lost can help some nonbelievers to humbly accept God’s help similar to the way it helped those 3000 on Pentecost (Acts 2:37).

Does Christ seem pleased over the fate of those lost at judgment?

None of what you have said suggest Christ did not still Love his blatantly rebellious non-elect.

 

[98cwitr]

So did Christ Love even the non-elect while he was on earth?

Scripture does say that Christ loved the rich ruler, who would not give away his possessions.

Christ also asked the Father to forgive those who killed Him.

We dont know if either were reborn later in life.

Can you show me when Christ was not loving to the non-elect?

Flipping over money changing tables isn't loving. He didn't seem to be very loving toward the Pharisees and Saducees either.

Would this not mean Christ and God are very different when Christ was to show through His being here exactly how God is?

It would not mean that, no.

Is God our poor example of Loving our enemies?

No, I don't think so.

 

[98cwitr]

And did the Father forgive them?

We have no evidence whether He did or didn't actually. Good question though.

 

[seeingeyes]

We have no evidence whether He did or didn't actually. Good question though.

If He didn't, then Jesus and the Father would be of two minds on the matter, not one.

 

[Johnnz]

Originally Posted by seeingeyes

And did the Father forgive them?
​

All sins were forgiven on the cross. That deal was done between Father and Son back then.

John
NZ

 

[Rick Otto]

Originally Posted by seeingeyes View Post
You don't see a problem with loving those that God hates? You don't see a problem with God telling you, through His son, to love those that He hates?

Nope. I certainly don't. God will handle them, it's not my place to. It's my place to do as His Will has contended for the life in me He has created. Christ asked the Father to forgive even those who were killing Him.

Man,... I sure have a problem with it.
Not returning evil for evil, as you can plainly see.
And it just spirals, until I get a hateful, childish rant from a little yes man calling me a little yes man posting hateful childish rants.

 

[98cwitr]

If He didn't, then Jesus and the Father would be of two minds on the matter, not one.

What do you think of the following?

Matthew 26:42 He went away a second time and prayed, “My Father, if it is not possible for this cup to be taken away unless I drink it, may your will be done.”

 

[fhansen]

Why would God attempt to work in someone who would never do anything but resist Him? Did the master in the parable demonstrate Omniscience? So when God says "I will give you a new heart and a new mind and write my Law on your hearts" it's really some sort of passive analogy instead of an actual, active thing that God does?

It's a process that God does, of justifying us unto salvation, placing His law in our hearts and writing it on our minds, a process we cooperate with-or not-as per the example of the servants in the Parable of the Talents. And we can walk away at any time, refusing to live in the Spirit, to remain in Christ, etc. We can bury our talents, the grace God gives us.

 

[seeingeyes]

It looks like Jesus doing the will of the Father. As always.

Should I think that he did the will of his Father after that horrific night, yet stepped outside of the Father's will when asking forgiveness for those who were currently murdering him?