Pre-tribulation Rapture Believers Safe House

[Handmaid for Jesus]

This is a more indepth documentary from the history channel which in my opinion discuses the Ps. 83 war. It is 10 parts but I just posted the first.
YouTube - Israel - Birth of a Nation - part 1/10

 

[Sojourner1]

Speaking of events in the middle east, I believe we are winding up to the battle of psalms 83 which I personally believe will happen before the rapture. I wasn't sure how Egypt would play into this but yesterday I saw a tweet where some egyptians swarmed the Israeli Embassey. Apparently some are beginning to side with the palestineans. On the other hand, I read another tweet where the bomb that struck the bus in Israel was Russian. God sure is moving fast. Let it be!

Thank you btw. Sometimes I get tired of debate and would just like opinion.

I also think this battle might precede the rapture.

 

[makeupgirl]

Here is a very short article on this topic to get you started in your study. What are the seven seals and seven trumpets in the Book of Revelation?

Thanks, I will definitely check this out.

 

[makeupgirl]

Hi Makeupgirl. There are a lot of opinions about the seals, and who is to say who is right? In my opinion, when Lord Jesus was ascended back into heaven, He began to unravel the seven sealed scroll, and has been progressively doing so for the last 2,000 years. Of course many of my sisters and brothers say that He has not started to open them yet and will not do so until the Tribulatin period begins.

thanks for the feedback. I have some studying to do.

 

[Truth Files]

I would suggest that both Psalms 83 and Ezekiel are about the battle of Armageddon and not a war before or during the 70th week decreed for Israel [the same as the tribulation period]

The Islamic states in the Middle East will be confederated by the little horn of Daniel's visions, both those ad
jacent to Israel [Psalms 83] and those located in the outer extents of the middle East [Ezekiel 38]

These will successfully invade Israel at the Middle of the 70th week and occupy Israel, Jerusalem, and the temple mount and hold for 42 months

Then the Lord will come and destroy them at Armageddon

If anyone wants further explanation including scriptural support I will answer

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

I would suggest that both Psalms 83 and Ezekiel are about the battle of Armageddon and not a war before or during the 70th week decreed for Israel [the same as the tribulation period]

The Islamic states in the Middle East will be confederated by the little horn of Daniel's visions, both those asjacent to Israel [Psalms 83] and those located in the outer extents of the middle East [Ezekiel 38]

These will successfully invade Israel at the Middle of the 70th week and occupy Israel, Jerusalem, and the temple mount and hold for 42 months

Then the Lord will come and destroy them at Armageddon

If anyone wants further explanation including scriptural support I will answer

I would possibly agree with you if the players were not so specific. It seems that the confederation spoken of in Ps. 83 does not have the same players as Ezekiel 38 and 39.. For instance, Lots children are not complicit in the Ezekiel 38-39, neither are Tyre and Sidon(Lebanon). But both of these are mentioned in Ps. 83( which I think took place in 1948). The Wor is very specific, so we really have to look at the peoples involved in each war. That is just my opinion.

 

[makeupgirl]

Ok, this is my question and if I'm out of line Mods, forgive me and feel free to remove the post.

When I get a post tribber to ask me to prove pretrib and I give them scriptures in Matt 24, 1 Thes 4:13-17, 1 Thes 1:10, 1 Thes 5:9; why the attack I guess I'm trying to ask? I don't see where Pretrib is a false doctrine, when it's clearly indicated through scriptures that we are not appointed to the wrath to come, that we're going to be caught up to meet the Lord in the clouds, and that we are ought to keep watch and be ready. I mean why would the Lord tell us to be ready and keep watch, if we're to go through the tribulation? I feel like post tribers are mocking us who do believe in prettribulation. It's like they are finding and digging for ways to prove prettrib wrong.

 

[Sojourner1]

Ok, this is my question and if I'm out of line Mods, forgive me and feel free to remove the post.

When I get a post tribber to ask me to prove pretrib and I give them scriptures in Matt 24, 1 Thes 4:13-17, 1 Thes 1:10, 1 Thes 5:9; why the attack I guess I'm trying to ask? I don't see where Pretrib is a false doctrine, when it's clearly indicated through scriptures that we are not appointed to the wrath to come, that we're going to be caught up to meet the Lord in the clouds, and that we are ought to keep watch and be ready. I mean why would the Lord tell us to be ready and keep watch, if we're to go through the tribulation? I feel like post tribers are mocking us who do believe in prettribulation. It's like they are finding and digging for ways to prove prettrib wrong.

I don't want to focus on those who believe in the post-trib rapture so I'll just say this. I honestly don't understand why it is that big of an issue whether one believes in the pre-trib or post-trib and it's not an essential doctrine when it comes to our salvation. I try really hard to just respond to questions and not mock others for what they believe in. If you feel like you are being mocked just respond with grace, kindness and patience.

 

[makeupgirl]

I don't want to focus on those who believe in the post-trib rapture so I'll just say this. I honestly don't understand why it is that big of an issue whether one believes in the pre-trib or post-trib and it's not an essential doctrine when it comes to our salvation. I try really hard to just respond to questions and not mock others for what they believe in. If you feel like you are being mocked just respond with grace, kindness and patience.

good advice...thanks

 

[Choose Wisely]

Speaking of events in the middle east, I believe we are winding up to the battle of psalms 83 which I personally believe will happen before the rapture. I wasn't sure how Egypt would play into this but yesterday I saw a tweet where some egyptians swarmed the Israeli Embassey. Apparently some are beginning to side with the palestineans. On the other hand, I read another tweet where the bomb that struck the bus in Israel was Russian. God sure is moving fast. Let it be!

Thank you btw. Sometimes I get tired of debate and would just like opinion.

Perhaps you might consider the 6 Day war that happened in 1967?

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

I don't believe there is anything that has to happen before the rapture happens.Today? Tomorrow? Who knows.

 

[Truth Files]

HFJ is correct

There is nothing left to be fulfilled [required] by the prophetic scriptures standing in the way of the Lord's "harpazo" action to immortalize His church at this time [it could happen before this day is over .... and then His judgment of the earth will roll with the exact events recorded in the unfulfilled portion of the prophetic visions]

The two requirements: Pentecost has come [first century] and a remnant part of Israel has returned to the land surrounded by the nation's ancient enemies of the Middle East .... the only other stipulation is this one [Romans 11:25] .... only the Lord knows this dating and He has not revealed it .... and He has said that the living believers at the time must be ready ..... there will be no warnings or directly related signs before

Israel must be in this setting to experience the 70th week decreed [same as the Lord's coming hour [time] of trial and judgment .... Revelation 3:10] ...... He is going to pressure Israel for turning to Him and a believing remnant will be produced [Isaiah 11; Daniel 9:24-27; 12:1; Zechariah 14:4-5; Matthew 24:15-16; Revelation 7:1-8; 14:1-7]

.... and He is going to judge the nations for intransigence and unbelief [Psalms 2; Revelation 6:12-17]

He will seek to destroy all national governments in the process and only Israel will remain ..... as the center of His earthly millennial kingdom

[Jeremiah 30; Isaiah 11; Ezekiel 36; Micah 4; 5; Zechariah 12; 13; 14; Acts 1:6; Revelation 20:1-6]

 

[Truth Files]

Understanding 2Thessalonians 2

The early believers of Thessalonica were troubled because of the prevalent false teaching that the day of the Lord was in process .... they thought they had missed the Lord's "harpazo" action to immortalize them:

Paul had discussed this issue with them earlier [1Thessalonians 4, 5] and so he sets the record straight by explaining that the day of the Lord had not yet come ..... he also tells them why ..... because certain conditions were not present .... the coming of the lawless one and his following [the falling away].

The gathering Paul speaks of and the day of the Lord are not the same events and the Lord's immortalization of the believer [both those asleep and those living at the time] will occur first ..... and then the day of the Lord will begin abruptly with no warning given to earth dwellers.

The day of the Lord will begin with His "hour" of trial [the coming tribulation period of 2,550 days] .... and will then include His coming millennial kingdom upon the earth for 1,000 years.

The term "last day" [the time frame of the day of the Lord] used in prophetic presentation is a period of time .... not just "one" 24 hour day .... and when this is used it is always presented as "at", or "in" the last day .... not "on" the last day.

Revelation confirms that the gathering noted in 2Thessalonians 2:1 is the Lord's call to immortalize the believer just before His coming hour of trial. Today's church is seen with Him dwelling heaven, in His temple, and around the throne just before, during, and at the closing of the tribulation period. [Revelation 3:10; 4:4; 5:5-10; 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-14; 20;4 (those on thrones)]

 

[Handmaid for Jesus]

What do you all think Lord Jesus was saying in the Parable of the ten virgins?

 

[Sojourner1]

What do you all think Lord Jesus was saying in the Parable of the ten virgins?

Good question! I would love to know what others think about this parable.

 

[DiligentlySeekingGod]

Jesus taught other parables about true and false conversions.

 

[Truth Files]

Matthew 25:1-13 is a parable reflecting His separation of His church at the "rapture"

This separation will be between believers and those who only profess to be .... He knows the difference

This passage of scripture should be read in conjunction with Revelation 3:10 and 3:15-19

He tells the believers who keep the truth that He will keep them from His trial and judgment of an unbelieving earth .... the door is open for these to come in

Then He is warning those who profess only that they will be left out [these will not be included in His "harpazo" action] and that they must repent during the coming tribulation

Notice that the door is shut [which is currently open to believers], and those who profess only will be kept from entering

He will still offer His salvation during the tribulation period, but He will then be on the other side of the door ..... "knocking"

 

[Sojourner1]

Matthew 25:1-13 is a parable reflecting His separation of His church at the "rapture"

This separation will be between believers and those who only profess to be .... He knows the difference

This passage of scripture should be read in conjunction with Revelation 3:10 and 3:15-19

He tells the believers who keep the truth that He will keep them from His trial and judgment of an unbelieving earth .... the door is open for these to come in

Then He is warning those who profess only that they will be left out [these will not be included in His "harpazo" action] and that they must repent during the coming tribulation

Notice that the door is shut [which is currently open to believers], and those who profess only will be kept from entering

He will still offer His salvation during the tribulation period, but He will then be on the other side of the door ..... "knocking"

I agree with this. What do you think about the idea that those who have heard the gospel and rejected it before the tribulation will be blinded to the truth during the tribulation (based on 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12).

 

[Truth Files]

Those who do this today are blinded .... and these certainly will be vulnerable to the same condition of blindness when they enter into the tribulation period

There is no question about the multitudes that will be deceived by and follow Satan’s beast during the tribulation period [2Thessalonians 2:2-12]

However, as I read Revelation’s account I see that there will be those who will not, and they will turn to the Lord during the period [Revelation 6:9-11; 7:1-8; 14:1-7; 14:13; 15:2-3; 20:4 [those beheaded]]

There will also be believing survivors of the tribulation period who will enter and populate the Lord’s millennial kingdom on the earth [Matthew 24:29-31; 25:31-46]

I would have to say that many of those who turn do will be of Israel rather than of the nations [Jeremiah 31; Zechariah 13:8-9; 14:4-5; Matthew 24:15-16; Revelation 7:1-8; 12:6; 12:14-17; 15:2-3] ; and some of these will be martyred and must wait until the end of the tribulation to receive their eternal bodies

A far as the gentiles of the nations I get the impression that not many will turn, some will follow Satan’s beast, and others will simply not turn to the Lord …. I think that billions will be killed by the wiles of the period and lost forever as Revelation’s unfolding seems to imply [Revelation 6:8; 9:18]

There will be mortal survivors of the period and the Lord., leaving no stone unturned, will gather all of them after; He will separate again and those found believing will enter and populate His millennial kingdom on the earth [Isaiah 11; 27-13; Matthew 24:29-31; 25:31-46]

If we are close to His coming visitation then I would say that it will be the core Muslims of the Middle East who will be the prime followers of Satan’s beast and certainly blinded to and against the truth just as they are today [this is for another study]

I am of the opinion that very few humans will get through the tribulation in a saved condition compared to the earth’s total population [6+ billion today]; most of which are unbelievers who will not seek Jesus Christ for their salvation

The exact numbers saved [mortal or immortal] are not explicit in Revelation’s account except for the 144,000 Israelites and to a degree 1/3 of the population of Israel [Zechariah 13:8; Romans 11:25-36]; estimated population of these today is about 7 million in Israel and the balance of about another 25+ million still in the nations

Also I would comment that the 24 elders and the great multitude are all of the pre-tribulation church and with the Lord, and not on the earth during the tribulation period on the earth [Revelation 3:10; 4:4; 5:1-10; 7:9-17; 11:1; 12:12; 13:6; 17:14; 19:1-9; 19:14; 20:4 [those on thrones]]

The great multitude from all nations “come out”, and are not “in” the tribulation on the earth [Revelation 18:4]; a good concordance actually gives the translation of the Greek “ek” as meaning “away from”; these of the immortal church are composed of both the dead in Christ and living believers who will be “caught up” ”snatched away” just before the Lord brings His judgment of an unbelieving world [1Thessalonians 5:1-9]

 

[Sojourner1]

Amazing - Dispensationalists have their own forum and no one hardly writes over there anymore. If the moderators were doing their jobs you wouldn't need these sub forums in the Eschatology forum.

Okay. Anyways, I think it's helpful to have this thread in the Eschatology forum just as a place to get away from the constant debate and just talk about the pre-trib rapture.