Praying for the Sick

[Alithis]

Mark 8 ...And a leper came to Him and bowed down before Him, and said, “Lord, if You are willing, You can make me clean. (The leper knew he was ABLE to heal him, but not sure if he would.) Jesus stretched out His hand and touched him, saying, “I am willing; be cleansed.” And immediately his leprosy was cleansed...Sometimes we know God can, but oftentimes we wonder if He will... But Jesus is always willing.. No matter how "unclean" we may be..

Amen

 

[Frogster]

Who is arguing against healing??

I thought the same thing..no one is arguing against healing.

 

[Frogster]

These signs will follow the believers: they will lay hands on the sick and they shall recover. We have authority over sickness and can use it. He healed all that were oppressed by the devil. Give me one text where Jesus said to someone: No I don't want to heal you for this and this good reason.
It makes no sense to me that He wouldn't want to heal me or anybody else. If it's their time, okay, but for the rest.. He just gave us the power to heal the sick. What is there to ask if it is His will?

Can you heal every sick believer, that has asked in faith?

Jesus said raise the dead TOO.

 

[Frogster]

In Romans 8 we see that paul teaches us that we will endure hardship and suffering. Paul is not promising that we will be free of those things but he is promising that it will not separate us from Christ and Gods love. This scripture is not promising that we will not have hardship, its instead promising that we will have love from God despite what may happen to us on earth. Look at what paul talks about- famine, death, persecution, trouble. Nothing in this world can separate us from Gods love although this world will destroy our bodies. Look at this scripture, it doesn't seem to paint an image of life more abundantly on earth. To the contrary, it seems to suggest that we will not always escape the woes of life, but the Lord will still be with us.


Romans 8:5 Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall trouble or hardship or persecution or famine or nakedness or danger or sword? 36 As it is written:

“For your sake we face death all day long;
we are considered as sheep to be slaughtered.”[j]
37 No, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him who loved us. 38 For I am convinced that neither death nor life, neither angels nor demons,[k] neither the present nor the future, nor any powers, 39 neither height nor depth, nor anything else in all creation, will be able to separate us from the love of God that is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Yup, and 8:17 says heirs have to suffer. Suffering can come in the form of sickness.

 

[Frogster]

Maybe its not necessarily a problem with their faith but instead their doctrine. Maybe they just need to prove all things as paul says. We all have problems with our doctrine, we all need to learn more i think. I think when we follow preachers and theologians then we will be following fallible men. WE sometimes think that a book written by some famous theologian or some famous preacher who started some denomination or movement, is infallible. However those books do contain some error and the only infallible book of doctrine is the scripture itself. If we learn from a fallible book that teaches us what the bible says then we are learning from a fallible man. But if we learn from the bible itself then we have a pure source. We may misunderstand the bible too at times but at least we know that its not the scriptures fault, but instead its our fault. However if we follow the misunderstandings of other men by following their books then its our fault or perhaps the fault of the author. My point is that if we learn from the bible then perhaps our misunderstanding will be diminished, but if learn from other fallible men then our misunderstanding may be multiplied rather than diminished.

You have wisdom.

 

[Frogster]

That is because many would not accept the healing.
Jesus can not heal if you are unwilling to accept the healing.

His hometown people rejected him and would not accept him as one who heals.
They wanted nothing to do with him or the idea of healing from him.

What faith did Lazarus have to "accept" the raising?

Besides, there were towns full of unbelievers, that even were rebuked, where Jesus did miracles, so there is n formula.

Just like casting out a demon, when Paul did it, the person in Acts 16 did not have faith to ask to be delivered.

Same in Acts 13 when Paul stuck a guy blind, Paul wielded power beyond the scope of the recipients faith or willingness.

Peter in Acts 3, same thing, healed the lame guy, who was wanting money.


No formulas.

 

[Frogster]

Faith delivered paul from the stonings he endured, yet faith didnt deliver stephan from the stoning which killed him. He was spirit filled yet he still died. The point is not if we escape anything that this world may do to our body, the point is that we must walk in faith that we are going to heaven where our bodies will not grow old and die anymore. Thats faith

Exactly looking at what is not seen. Again, sawed in 2 by faith, Heb 11.

Even Abe, our faith father, was in the land, but he still looked for a greater city. Hebrews talks about not having a continuing city HERE...

Paul talked about these present sufferings how they can't be compared to the real glory coming.

 

[Frogster]

Where does scripture say that sickness is considered hardship or suffering though?

I can show you scripture that says Jesus' blood paid for our healing Matthew 8:17 and that a benefit of knowing God personally is healing Psalm 103:3

Most would consider sickness a hardship suffering, like Job did.

 

[Frogster]

Where does scripture say that sickness is considered hardship or suffering though?

I can show you scripture that says Jesus' blood paid for our healing Matthew 8:17 and that a benefit of knowing God personally is healing Psalm 103:3

Moses did not want it, and the text says God caused illness too.


Ex 4:10 But Moses said to the Lord, “Oh, my Lord, I am not eloquent, either in the past or since you have spoken to your servant, but I am slow of speech and of tongue.” 11 Then the Lord said to him, “Who has made man's mouth? Who makes him mute, or deaf, or seeing, or blind? Is it not I, the Lord?

 

[Souldier]

Exactly looking at what is not seen. Again, sawed in 2 by faith, Heb 11.

Even Abe, our faith father, was in the land, but he still looked for a greater city. Hebrews talks about not having a continuing city HERE...

Paul talked about these present sufferings how they can't be compared to the real glory coming.

Its good to move forward in faith, love and hope, despite what we may go through. Faith wont always fix our problems but faith will help us endure.

 

[Frogster]

Its good to move forward in faith, love and hope, despite what we may go through. Faith wont always fix our problems but faith will help us endure.

Exactly, suffering comes, but we have faith too, be blessed bro!

 

[ByTheSpirit]

Trying to rationalize when God heals and when he doesn't isn't faith...

Faith says every time that God will heal and believes it. Do you really try to "pray" for the sick and not believe God will heal them every time?

If you do not approach healing every time with faith that healing will come, then that is not faith. Compassion maybe. Sympathy perhaps, but not faith.

Faith doesn't deal with maybe's or shoulda's,....

Faith believes... 100%... every time!

So sorry, this stuff about "suffering and persecution", "trials and tribulations" or whatever other religious sounding words you want to use, isn't faith. It is veiled doubt at best.

 

[Frogster]

Moses by faith had to just believe what God said, and go with it!


Moses did not want it, and the text says God caused illness too.


Ex 4:10 But Moses said to the Lord, “Oh, my Lord, I am not eloquent, either in the past or since you have spoken to your servant, but I am slow of speech and of tongue.” 11 Then the Lord said to him, “Who has made man's mouth? Who makes him mute, or deaf, or seeing, or blind? Is it not I, the Lord?

 

[Souldier]

Trying to rationalize when God heals and when he doesn't isn't faith...

Faith says every time that God will heal and believes it. Do you really try to "pray" for the sick and not believe God will heal them every time?

If you do not approach healing every time with faith that healing will come, then that is not faith. Compassion maybe. Sympathy perhaps, but not faith.

Faith doesn't deal with maybe's or shoulda's,....

Faith believes... 100%... every time!

So sorry, this stuff about "suffering and persecution", "trials and tribulations" or whatever other religious sounding words you want to use, isn't faith. It is veiled doubt at best.

That just doesn't add up. You yourself are saying you have no faith because you yourself know you have prayed for healing in others and it didn't always come to pass. So your own definition says that you have no faith. Likewise, the gift of healing isnt given to everyone either. Paul didnt tell timothy to go seek a healer, he said to take medication. I dont understand the need to define faith by miracles. When paul told timothy to fight the good fight of faith he mentioned many things. Those things are what faith is for. Why is faith defined only by miracles?

 

[Frogster]

Trying to rationalize when God heals and when he doesn't isn't faith...

Faith says every time that God will heal and believes it. Do you really try to "pray" for the sick and not believe God will heal them every time?

If you do not approach healing every time with faith that healing will come, then that is not faith. Compassion maybe. Sympathy perhaps, but not faith.

Faith doesn't deal with maybe's or shoulda's,....

Faith believes... 100%... every time!

So sorry, this stuff about "suffering and persecution", "trials and tribulations" or whatever other religious sounding words you want to use, isn't faith. It is veiled doubt at best.

Faith is not a simple matter, did they receive , even though they had faith?


Heb 11:13 These all died in faith, not having received the things promised, but having seen them and greeted them from afar, and having acknowledged that they were strangers and exiles on the earth.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

That just doesn't add up. You yourself are saying you have no faith because you yourself know you have prayed for healing in others and it didn't always come to pass. So your own definition says that you have no faith. Likewise, the gift of healing isnt given to everyone either. Paul didnt tell timothy to go seek a healer, he said to take medication. I dont understand the need to define faith by miracles. When paul told timothy to fight the good fight of faith he mentioned many things. Those things are what faith is for. Why is faith defined only by miracles?

Was Timothy sick and needed healing when Paul advised wine for his stomach's sake? Aren't you reading into the scripture what isn't there?

 

[Souldier]

Was Timothy sick and needed healing when Paul advised wine for his stomach's sake? Aren't you reading into the scripture what isn't there?

He said his stomach and often infirmities. He had multiple things going on perhaps. That is what the scripture seems to suggest.

 

[Presbyterian Continuist]

He said his stomach and often infirmities. He had multiple things going on perhaps. That is what the scripture seems to suggest.

That's possible.

 

[Souldier]

Here is a scripture which i hear taken out of context often. Sometimes its used to suggest that we use "word of faith" to speak and to get healed. Those who take this scripture out of context will say that "we believe and therefore we speak."

But lets look at it and see what it is really is saying. It seems to tell us that we will endure suffering and that we look toward heaven and the next life, not this life. That is what "walking by faith not sight" means. It means to look toward heaven not earth. But it doesnt mean that we get healed. That is yet another scripture they take out of context.



2 Co 4:13 And since we have the same spirit of faith, according to what is written, “I believed and therefore I spoke,”[a] we also believe and therefore speak, 14 knowing that He who raised up the Lord Jesus will also raise us up with Jesus, and will present us with you. 15 For all things are for your sakes, that grace, having spread through the many, may cause thanksgiving to abound to the glory of God.

Seeing the Invisible
16 Therefore we do not lose heart. Even though our outward man is perishing, yet the inward man is being renewed day by day. 17 For our light affliction, which is but for a moment, is working for us a far more exceeding and eternal weight of glory, 18 while we do not look at the things which are seen, but at the things which are not seen. For the things which are seen are temporary, but the things which are not seen are eternal.


5:1 For we know that if our earthly house, this tent, is destroyed, we have a building from God, a house not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.

6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.

4 For we who are in this tent groan, being burdened, not because we want to be unclothed, but further clothed, that mortality may be swallowed up by life. 5 Now He who has prepared us for this very thing is God, who also has given us the Spirit as a guarantee.

6 So we are always confident, knowing that while we are at home in the body we are absent from the Lord. 7 For we walk by faith, not by sight. 8 We are confident, yes, well pleased rather to be absent from the body and to be present with the Lord.

 

[Souldier]

That's possible.

Yes.