Praise to the Man!

[Toms777]

Here is a Hymn from the Mormon Church Hymnal, written about Joseph Smith. Does anyone have any thoughts or comment about what this hymn says about Joseph Smith?

Praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!
Jesus annointed that Prophet and Seer.
Blessed to open the last dispensation,
Kings shall extol him, and nations revere.

Praise to his memory, he died as a martyr;
Honored and blest be his ever great name!
Long shall his blood, which was shed by assassins,
Stain Illinois* while the earth lauds his fame.

Great is his glory and endless his priesthood.
Ever and ever the keys he will hold.
Faithful and true, he will enter his kingdom,
Crowned in the midst of the prophets of old.

Sacrifice brings forth the blessings of heaven;
Earth must atone for the blood of that man.
Wake up the world for the conflict of justice.
Millions shall know "brother Joseph" again.

Chorus: Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

 

[fatboys]

Here is a Hymn from the Mormon Church Hymnal, written about Joseph Smith. Does anyone have any thoughts or comment about what this hymn says about Joseph Smith?

Praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!
Jesus annointed that Prophet and Seer.
Blessed to open the last dispensation,
Kings shall extol him, and nations revere.

Praise to his memory, he died as a martyr;
Honored and blest be his ever great name!
Long shall his blood, which was shed by assassins,
Stain Illinois* while the earth lauds his fame.

Great is his glory and endless his priesthood.
Ever and ever the keys he will hold.
Faithful and true, he will enter his kingdom,
Crowned in the midst of the prophets of old.

Sacrifice brings forth the blessings of heaven;
Earth must atone for the blood of that man.
Wake up the world for the conflict of justice.
Millions shall know "brother Joseph" again.

Chorus: Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

FB: It is one of my favorite hymns. It has a real catchy tune too.

 

[Serapha]

Here is a Hymn from the Mormon Church Hymnal, written about Joseph Smith. Does anyone have any thoughts or comment about what this hymn says about Joseph Smith?

Praise to the man who communed with Jehovah!
Jesus annointed that Prophet and Seer.
Blessed to open the last dispensation,
Kings shall extol him, and nations revere.

Praise to his memory, he died as a martyr;
Honored and blest be his ever great name!
Long shall his blood, which was shed by assassins,
Stain Illinois* while the earth lauds his fame.

Great is his glory and endless his priesthood.
Ever and ever the keys he will hold.
Faithful and true, he will enter his kingdom,
Crowned in the midst of the prophets of old.

Sacrifice brings forth the blessings of heaven;
Earth must atone for the blood of that man.
Wake up the world for the conflict of justice.
Millions shall know "brother Joseph" again.

Chorus: Hail to the Prophet, ascended to heaven!
Traitors and tyrants now fight him in vain.
Mingling with Gods, he can plan for his brethren;
Death cannot conquer the hero again.

Hi there!



and that famous martyr.... what were his last words?

~serapha~

 

[Toms777]

Hi there!



and that famous martyr.... what were his last words?

~serapha~

Joseph Smith's last words were the first four words of the Masonic distress call:

"Oh, Lord my God".

 

[Talyn]

Great!! Now I'm gonna have that song stuck in my head for the rest of the day.

 

[ZoneChaos]

Joseph Smith's last words were the first four words of the Masonic distress call:

"Oh, Lord my God".

I thought he just said "Oh my God!"


though some seem to think he may also have said.. "My God, its full of stars!" but at best that is rumor, and not to be trusted...

 

[emerald Dragon]

The hymn honors the Prophet Joseph Smith for the glorious work he was called to do-help to bring to pass the restoration of the Gospel of Jesus Christ in this era. We do not put him above Christ, but honor above many men, and put him on the same field as such men as Adam, Noah, Moses, and Isaiah. We honor him as a great man and a Prophet of God.

 

[arizona_sunshine]

The hymn honors the Prophet Joseph Smith for the glorious work he was called to do-help to bring to pass the restoration of the Gospel of Jesus Christ in this era. We do not put him above Christ, but honor above many men, and put him on the same field as such men as Adam, Noah, Moses, and Isaiah. We honor him as a great man and a Prophet of God.

I agree.

 

[skylark1]

For LDS:

On a typical Sunday, does your worship service include more songs that praise Jesus Christ, or more songs that praise Joseph Smith and the "restored gospel?" This is a sincere question.

Also, I was told by someone that Amazing Grace is not found in LDS Hymnals. Is this true, and why?

Thanks.

 

[arizona_sunshine]

For LDS:

On a typical Sunday, does your worship service include more songs that praise Jesus Christ, or more songs that praise Joseph Smith and the "restored gospel?" This is a sincere question.

Also, I was told by someone that Amazing Grace is not found in LDS Hymnals. Is this true, and why?

Thanks.

Every Sunday we sing a hymn before we partake of the Sacrament (communion). This content of this hymn concentrates on Christ's atonement only, and we have several from which to select. During the Sacrament service, which lasts a little over an hour, hymns of different subject matter may be sung... and often they relate to the topics chosen for the meeting. The Sacrament song, however, is specific to Christ's Atonement and is the only one during the service which is completely consistant.

I have no doubt that we sing of Christ's Atonement regularly because of its absolute importance.

I love the hymns we sing which celebrate our Savior.

I love the hymns we sing in thanks for our leaders, for our fellowship, our ability to serve and do good as well as other topics.

If Amazing Grace is not in our Hymnbooks, I am not aware. However, I dont recall singing it in our church meetings. I am not a decision maker as to the content of our hymnbooks, so I dont know why that piece was or was not selected.

 

[fatboys]

Joseph Smith's last words were the first four words of the Masonic distress call:

"Oh, Lord my God".

FB: This is the most silly point. Joseph Smith had been a mason and spent three days at meetings when he joined. Three days. Now if you saw your brother take a bullit to the head and other friends shot up, let see what you would yell as you jump out a two story window with mobs below with no hope of escape. I am a bit angry that you would try and insinuate that there was some sort of secret cry to masons. Some of the mobbers had been members of the church and had been Joseph Smiths close friends. Do you think it would matter if there were some masons in the mob? Joseph Smith knew before he was arrested as to what would happen to his life when he was to be arrested. It is totally offensive that you place some fault on Joseph Smith for his own murder. He had done nothing to warrent being murdered. Nothing. Yet you make these little jabs that have been made by many anti mormons. I heard this same comments 30 years ago when I was on my mission. I Say a BIG "SO WHAT".

 

[Toms777]

The hymn honors the Prophet Joseph Smith for the glorious work he was called to do-help to bring to pass the restoration of the Gospel of Jesus Christ in this era. We do not put him above Christ, but honor above many men, and put him on the same field as such men as Adam, Noah, Moses, and Isaiah. We honor him as a great man and a Prophet of God.

Note that many of these attributes given to Joseph apply only to Jesus, for example:

1) The song refers to his great name. This is similar to what scripture says about Jesus name being above all names. throughout scripture, the term "great name" is used primarily to apply to God:

Example:

Josh 7:8-9
8 O Lord, what shall I say when Israel turns its back before its enemies? 9 For the Canaanites and all the inhabitants of the land will hear it, and surround us, and cut off our name from the earth. Then what will You do for Your great name?"
NKJV

2) "Kings shall extol him and nations rever him" refers to Smith in the song, but the Bible uses the term extol solely to apply to God, for example:

Ps 68:4
4 Sing to God, sing praises to His name;
Extol Him who rides on the clouds,
By His name YAH,
And rejoice before Him.
NKJV

3) "Great is his glory" refers to Smith in the song, but the Bible says:

Luke 21:27-28
27 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
NKJV

4) "..and endless his priesthood" refers to Smith's priesthood in the song:

Heb 7:21
"The LORD has sworn
And will not relent,
'You are a priest forever
According to the order of Melchizedek' "),
NKJV

This refers to Jesus in the Bible.

5) "Ever and ever the keys he will hold. " refers to Smith in the song.

In the Bible, it is Jesus who holds the keys:

Rev 1:18-19
18 I am He who lives, and was dead, and behold, I am alive forevermore. Amen. And I have the keys of Hades and of Death.
NKJV

6) "Faithful and true, he will enter his kingdom," in this song speaks of Smith's kingdom. In the Bible, the kingdom belongs to God.

2 Tim 4:1-2
4:1 I charge you therefore before God and the Lord Jesus Christ, who will judge the living and the dead at His appearing and His kingdom:
NKJV

7) "Earth must atone for the blood of that man"

Jesus Christ alone died for the sins of man. This is a denial of the true gospel in scripture.

Heb 2:17-18
17 Therefore, in all things He had to be made like His brethren, that He might be a merciful and faithful High Priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people.
NKJV

8) "Mingling with Gods".

This of course is contrary to the Bible:

Isa 44:8
Is there a God besides Me?
Indeed there is no other Rock;
I know not one.'"
NKJV

The song therefore attempts to elevate Joseph Smith to equivalency with God.

 

[arizona_sunshine]

The song therefore attempts to elevate Joseph Smith to equivalency with God.

Jesus Christ is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. We believe in His Atonement. He is our advocate with the Father; He is the Only Begotten.

This is what I believe. This is what I have been taught from childhood by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Please do not try to tell me that I believe differently, because you are mistaken.

 

[calgal]

Jesus Christ is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. We believe in His Atonement. He is our advocate with the Father; He is the Only Begotten.

This is what I believe. This is what I have been taught from childhood by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Please do not try to tell me that I believe differently, because you are mistaken.

That's funny, the gatekeeper of heaven according to the Institute (UVSC) and Gospel Doctrine (ironic name this) classes was NOT Christ but Joseph Smith. Now why would this be?

 

[arizona_sunshine]

That's funny, the gatekeeper of heaven according to the Institute (UVSC) and Gospel Doctrine (ironic name this) classes was NOT Christ but Joseph Smith. Now why would this be?

I am sorry, calgal, I was not familiar with this irrelevant morsel.

I am certain we believe Joseph Smith will play some role in the hereafter; what it consists of I am not so certain.

Regardless, "gatekeeper" (with no clue as to what you think this title means) was not a characteristic to which I attributed Christ exclusively. I used:

Author and Finisher of Our Faith

Our Advocate with the Father

The Only Begotten

 

[Toms777]

Jesus Christ is the Author and Finisher of our Faith. We believe in His Atonement. He is our advocate with the Father; He is the Only Begotten.

This is what I believe. This is what I have been taught from childhood by The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints.

Please do not try to tell me that I believe differently, because you are mistaken.

I am telling you what you believe. I am telling you what the Mormon church teaches, and it is clear from the hymn.

 

[Toms777]

I am sorry, calgal, I was not familiar with this irrelevant morsel.

I am certain we believe Joseph Smith will play some role in the hereafter; what it consists of I am not so certain.

Regardless, "gatekeeper" (with no clue as to what you think this title means) was not a characteristic to which I attributed Christ exclusively. I used:

Author and Finisher of Our Faith

Our Advocate with the Father

The Only Begotten

"I have taught for thirty years, and still teach, that he that believeth in his heart and confesseth with his mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that Joseph Smith is his Prophet to this generation, is of God; and he that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fulness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is antichrist. All who confess that Joseph Smith is sent of God in the latter days, to lay the foundation of his everlasting kingdom no more to be thrown down, and will continue to keep his commandments, are born of God." (J.D. 9:312)



In the October General Conference of 1859 Brother Brigham spelt out the eternal significance of Joseph Smith: "Joseph Smith holds the keys of this last dispensation, and is now engaged behind the vail in the great work of the last days. I can tell our beloved brother Christians who have slain the Prophets and butchered and otherwise caused the death of thousands of Latter-day Saints, the priests who have thanked God in their prayers and thanksgiving from the pulpit that we have been plundered, driven, and slain, and the deacons under the pulpit, and their brethren and sisters in their closets, who have thanked God, thinking that the Latter-day Saints were wasted away, something that no doubt will mortify them - something that, to say the least, is a matter of deep regret to them - namely, that no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith. From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are - I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent. He holds the keys of that kingdom for the last dispensation - the keys to rule in the spirit-world; and he rules there triumphantly, for he gained full power and a glorious victory over the power of Satan while he was yet in the flesh, and was a martyr to his religion and to the name of Christ, which gives him a most perfect victory in the spirit-world. He reigns there as supreme a being in his sphere, capacity, and calling, as God does in heaven. Many will exclaim - "Oh, that is very disagreeable! It is preposterous! We cannot bear the thought!"

Source: http://messenger.mormonfundamentalism.org/keys.htm

 

[arizona_sunshine]

"I have taught for thirty years, and still teach, that he that believeth in his heart and confesseth with his mouth that Jesus is the Christ and that Joseph Smith is his Prophet to this generation, is of God; and he that confesseth not that Jesus has come in the flesh and sent Joseph Smith with the fulness of the Gospel to this generation, is not of God, but is antichrist. All who confess that Joseph Smith is sent of God in the latter days, to lay the foundation of his everlasting kingdom no more to be thrown down, and will continue to keep his commandments, are born of God." (J.D. 9:312)



In the October General Conference of 1859 Brother Brigham spelt out the eternal significance of Joseph Smith: "Joseph Smith holds the keys of this last dispensation, and is now engaged behind the vail in the great work of the last days. I can tell our beloved brother Christians who have slain the Prophets and butchered and otherwise caused the death of thousands of Latter-day Saints, the priests who have thanked God in their prayers and thanksgiving from the pulpit that we have been plundered, driven, and slain, and the deacons under the pulpit, and their brethren and sisters in their closets, who have thanked God, thinking that the Latter-day Saints were wasted away, something that no doubt will mortify them - something that, to say the least, is a matter of deep regret to them - namely, that no man or woman in this dispensation will ever enter into the celestial kingdom of God without the consent of Joseph Smith. From the day that the Priesthood was taken from the earth to the winding-up scene of all things, every man and woman must have the certificate of Joseph Smith, junior, as a passport to their entrance into the mansion where God and Christ are - I with you and you with me. I cannot go there without his consent. He holds the keys of that kingdom for the last dispensation - the keys to rule in the spirit-world; and he rules there triumphantly, for he gained full power and a glorious victory over the power of Satan while he was yet in the flesh, and was a martyr to his religion and to the name of Christ, which gives him a most perfect victory in the spirit-world. He reigns there as supreme a being in his sphere, capacity, and calling, as God does in heaven. Many will exclaim - "Oh, that is very disagreeable! It is preposterous! We cannot bear the thought!"

Source: http://messenger.mormonfundamentalism.org/keys.htm

These teachings do not support the idea that Joseph Smith is robbing Christ of three (of many) exclusive roles Christ plays in our salvation:

Author and Finisher of Our Faith

Our Advocate with the Father

The Only Begotten of The Father

Furthermore, the understanding I have from this is that Joseph Smith will be on the side of Christ, supporting the decisions being made and supporting those faithful followers of Christ who will inherit eternal life.

Those who have not accepted Joseph Smith as a prophet of God have not accepted the fullness of the Gospel; the fullness of the Gospel of Christ.

This is what we believe, and there is an open invitation to all now as well as later.

 

[Doc T]

For LDS:

On a typical Sunday, does your worship service include more songs that praise Jesus Christ, or more songs that praise Joseph Smith and the "restored gospel?" This is a sincere question.

Also, I was told by someone that Amazing Grace is not found in LDS Hymnals. Is this true, and why?

Thanks.

Doc: Hi, Skylark. No, Amazing Grace is not found in the LDS Hymnal and to be honest with you I don't know why. Though I do know that the Mormon Tabernacle Choir as well as our local ward choirs sing it.

I did look in the back of the Hymnal under Topics and there are well over 100 hymns about Jesus Christ, while there are only 7 under the topic of Joseph Smith. I would say on the average we may sing one of those 7 hymns about 4-5 times a year out of a rough estimate of 350 to 400 hymns we may sing at various meetings.


~

 

[TOmNossor]

I am telling you what you believe. I am telling you what the Mormon church teaches, and it is clear from the hymn.

Toms777:

I am telling you what you believe. I am telling you what the Mormon church teaches, and it is clear from the hymn.



TOm:

As I said to you the last time you said this, you cannot tell me, Arizona_Sunshine, or any LDS what we believe.

I am the world authority on what I believe. No man knows more about my beliefs than me.

Arizona_Sunshine is the world authority on what she believes.



Also, since every single LDS who had every interacted with you (to my observation) has told you that you are wrong, I think it is safe to say that LDS do not believe this as well.



Do you believe we are lying to you? Do you believe that we secretly hold Joseph Smith higher than Jesus? What exactly do you believe?



You may attack a religion that I do not hold all day long and get nowhere with me. You may be able to fool others into thinking that this is true of LDS, but they would be misinformed by you if you are successful. You have been repeatedly told that you do not understand what LDS believe and yet you continue to claim that we believe something we do not.



I hope one day you will realize that of all your positions this is the least effective.



Charity, TOm