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Please tell me if I'm wrong

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4Bear

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Here's the hard part. When I get tough and stand up for what I think is right... He gets cold and difficult. He doesn't support me when he knows it won't lead to our/his benefit.

...

And the problem is.... He's basically right. So they I go quiet... And back to trying to find ways to fix all of our problems.


HelpMe,
You appear to be agreeing with your husband that "our/his benefit" is strictly a matter of making money by any means- including writing erotica. Your problems will remain for as long as you continue to sell your soul for money.

Matt 16:24 Then Jesus said to His disciples, “If HelpMe desires to come after Me, let her deny herself, and take up her cross, and follow Me. 25 For whoever desires to save her life will lose it, but whoever loses her life for My sake will find it. 26 For what profit is it to HelpMe if she gains the whole world, and loses her own soul? Or what will HelpMe give in exchange for her soul?

1 Timothy 6:10
"For the love of money is a root of all kinds of evil, for which some have strayed from the faith in their greediness, and pierced themselves through with many sorrows."
 
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cactusrose

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Why I wonder then he rejects the suggestion of downsizing which is I thought also in part would be one thing working towards a solution ?And what about the fact he could offer to pick up a second part time job even 20 hours a week?I've met many couples that aren't even in debt but one or even both have to work full time + just to pay their basics.And give up some creature comforts as well .Live in smaller homes.Eat in .Their children are not in an expensive private school either.

It seems to me he's trying to keep a standard of living you can not afford unless you file bankruptcy and engage in a business in which you consider immoral .If the standard of living by the way stays the same even if you agreed to write what he calls 'smut' you will be back in the same position anyway.The plan isn't even long term.

Whats fueling the financial problems isn't you lack of writing from what you said its spending more money than you make and you have described that the two of you combined make a living that should enable you to live fine without you writing erotica.If you don't spend more than you make.That goes for everyone not just you and your husband.

I read something interesting one thing in common most self made millionaires have is they actually live a little below their means.They live in houses that are under what they can afford ,drive less expensive cars than they can afford,take less expensive vacations than they can afford etc..They dont spend every penny they make and then some on credit.

Just thought that was an interesting tid bit.
 
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cactusrose

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Its fair for you to ask him to downsize.And pick up a part time job .Get out of debt.Then change permanently your spending habits.Many people declare bankruptcy and wipe the slate clean but do not adjust their spending habits and in right back swallowed in debt all over again.Its not about not enough income for many.Its about not budgeting and spending more than you make.

I think its fair for you to ask him to do that.
 
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steve_bakr

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Without knowing more details, I would try to salvage your marriage, if possible, live within your means, and be firm as to your values. BTW, Perhaps erotica has its place, but you should only write according to the manner in which you are comfortable within your own conscience.
 
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4Bear

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No I don't agree that it's the way to go... But it's money and is it fair for me to tell HIM to go get a second job? I did last month and he threatened to go sweep floors overnight and a retailer or something. When I called his bluff, he just turned it back on me.

What is FAIR for me to ask of HIM?

If it was me, I'd stop turning to my husband for help, I would immediately stop violating my own conscience, and I would be praying hard for God to help me.

The following passage was a great comfort to me when we were struggling financially and I was worried about how we would survive. I have bolded where I think you should focus:

Do Not Worry

Matt 6:25 “Therefore I say to you, do not worry about your life, what you will eat or what you will drink; nor about your body, what you will put on. Is not life more than food and the body more than clothing? 26 Look at the birds of the air, for they neither sow nor reap nor gather into barns; yet your heavenly Father feeds them. Are you not of more value than they? 27 Which of you by worrying can add one cubit to his stature?

28 “So why do you worry about clothing? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they neither toil nor spin; 29 and yet I say to you that even Solomon in all his glory was not arrayed like one of these. 30 Now if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is, and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will He not much more clothe you, O you of little faith?

31 “Therefore do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ 32 For after all these things the Gentiles seek. For your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. 33 But seek first the kingdom of God and His righteousness, and all these things shall be added to you. 34 Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about its own things. Sufficient for the day is its own trouble.
 
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cactusrose

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I agree. That's why I asked him to do this last month. He won't. So it's all on me.

And downsizing would involve moving...and our cars are in the negative... We can't sell them. He won't do that. So it's all up to me.

I hate to say this if its all up to you then what do you need him for?And really by that I mean he refuses to do what is fair and reasonable that's sensible legal and moral, your suggestions.Then its up to you to agree to his suggestions and proceed in an unreasonable non sensible illegal and immoral way?

Im thinking more and more if that is truly the case that I would just separate from a husband that was O.K with that and actually in a standoff with me to get me to agree to it.You downsize you stop paying any of his living expenses and you if necessary get a part time job to pay off your debt.Or if need be you file for bankruptcy..Let him compromise his morals commit fraud or whatever hes willing to do to support himself.

If you aren't willing to separate and you aren't willing to do as he suggest and if he isn't willing to do what you suggest then I'm not sure what you would expect anyone else could tell you that would change that.I don't see anyone here however saying you don't have any real choice but to write the smut commit bankruptcy fraud sue your widowed mother and continuing to live beyond your means.

The only other option is to do nothing.Say no to all his suggestions continue living how you are and I'm assuming go deeper and deeper into debt until you can't pay everyone anymore and the creditors start coming after you your cars are being reposessed you're at risk of eviction etc.
 
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cactusrose

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A thought hit me.If my husband and I were in financial trouble and he asked for my help by spending less money moving to a smaller place and me working a few more hours.And I said no I refuse to do that.I don't want to move that's inconvenient I don't want to spend less money that's no fun and I already work 40 hours a week.I think a better solution if for you to go out and rob a bank.Should my husband say since my wife refuses to do what is honest reasonable moral and legal then its all up to me so she is right the only answer is I should go rob a bank.Even though I am risking going to prison I will have to live with the fact and the guilt I have stolen other peoples money and I pride myself in being honest and not labeled a thief but I guess I have no other choice.Right?
 
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cactusrose

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We're just getting one side of the story here.

Unless she is lying.Or he is joking when he makes these suggestions.In my view if that's not the case just a few of the suggestions hes made to her are completely wrong.There is really no other "side" that your husband would suggest for you to write erotica to get out of financial debt.There is no other side to the suggestion she lie to the bankruptcy court which as mentioned is a federal crime.Just those two suggestions like I said other than she is completely making that up or hes really joking which we can ask her has she asked him "are you joking' what other side to that could there be?

What could a mans defense to that possibly be other than I never suggested that or I was joking and I told her no way I was serious when I said that ?

I think its O.K to give advice with the qualifier assuming what you are stating is the truth and then the advice.Otherwise no advice would ever be appropriate because we would have to be under the assumption that its only one side and they may be leaving out something crucial including the fact this poster we don't even know for sure if its a woman in this situation or a man,if they are really even married or not.If its not right to get advice only getting one side.Why not take that further that we cant believe(assume) anything they say at all is the whole story or there is any truth to it at all.If you go with its only one side.You have already made assumptions that there are even two sides to begin with and this is a woman married to a man with one child in a financial crisis.How do you know that's even true?

I think taking what is said at face value unless there are obvious inconsistencies makes more sense than conjecture which could be depending endless on the other side.Including as I have mentioned this may not even be a true story at all even by one sides perspective.At some level the persons word has to be assumed true and accurate or else there is no reason to discuss the situation at all.
 
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ImaginaryDay

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The story is true and I often get chastised because I offer my husband's side. I don't do that to nullify the advice I receive but rather help give the whole picture. I want objective advice...

I think most here believe that. You have been given some pretty solid advice so far, I think, from your peers. Those that continue to trumpet the 'we don't know the whole story' line are really not interested in the whole story, but I think have more interest in convincing you that you are really not going through what you are going through. Don't let that happen to you. Stay strong in the Lord and continue to pray for repentance on the part of your husband.
 
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Romanseight2005

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I think most here believe that. You have been given some pretty solid advice so far, I think, from your peers. Those that continue to trumpet the 'we don't know the whole story' line are really not interested in the whole story, but I think have more interest in convincing you that you are really not going through what you are going through. Don't let that happen to you. Stay strong in the Lord and continue to pray for repentance on the part of your husband.
:thumbsup:
 
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LinkH

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I think most here believe that. You have been given some pretty solid advice so far, I think, from your peers. Those that continue to trumpet the 'we don't know the whole story' line are really not interested in the whole story, but I think have more interest in convincing you that you are really not going through what you are going through. Don't let that happen to you. Stay strong in the Lord and continue to pray for repentance on the part of your husband.


I take this as a dig at me. Earlier, I said that we are only getting one person's perspective. Helpme22, I have no reason to think that you are 'holding out' on us for important and relevant information. But no matter how fair you try to be, you are sharing what seems important from your perspective. We all do that, especially when it comes to something as complicated and emotionally involved as a marriage relationship.

In the past, we've had occasions where one poster came on and posted his perspective on a marital problem, and people gave him certain advice. Then his wife posted her perspective, and the advice took a 180. Recently, we had a wife post a marital problem, and then the husband came on and gave a completely different perspective. At least in one of these cases, I don't see any reason to assume either one of them had tried to be dishonest. We just have different perspectives, different things we notice, different things we consider important, and different blind spots.

For me the takeaway is that it is pretty foolish for someone to sit behind a monitor and give someone else advice to divorce, separate, etc. when they have only heard one side of the story, and that through an Internet conversation. Your husband may not want to go to counseling, but there may be a relative or priest (since you are both RCC) he would listen to outside of a formal counseling situation. If you want advice, at least go to someone who has seen both of you in the flesh.

My advice is not to divorce or separate based on advice you get from the Internet.

Certain posters on here seem to be willing to tell other people to separate at the drop of a hat. You have said that your husband works a full-time job and takes care of the family in various ways. He has been shutting down when faced with a serious crisis and lets you take over. I think of separation as something very serious (especially since I Corinthians 7 tells you not to do it), not something to be toyed with, especially not based on the advice of people who have never even met your husband.

IMO, there are a lot of things you could do without separating from your husband. I would imagine you could, in all good conscience, tell him you cannot write erotica and keep a clean conscience before God, and therefore decline to do it. You could get that second apartment like he asked you to, so when you can't pay rent on the one you are in, you will have a cheaper place lined up to move in to. You could also---in a non-pushy way-- tell him you are expecting him to come up with the plan to lead you out of the situation, and lovingly remind him that you are waiting on his answer and offer him any information that he needs.


<staff edit>
 
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mkgal1

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Certain posters on here seem to be willing to tell other people to separate at the drop of a hat.
This is *not* true. I don't believe I have *ever* seen that happen here..........besides HelpMe's issues are hardly....."a drop of a hat" kinds of issues. She is trying to redeem their family financially and spiritually (from the sounds of it). Separation may be her only choice in order for that to happen. One spouse cannot carry a marriage on their own.....especially when the other is sabotaging all efforts to restore what's left.
 
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mkgal1

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For me the takeaway is that it is pretty foolish for someone to sit behind a monitor and give someone else advice to divorce, separate, etc. when they have only heard one side of the story, and that through an Internet conversation. Your husband may not want to go to counseling, but there may be a relative or priest (since you are both RCC) he would listen to outside of a formal counseling situation. If you want advice, at least go to someone who has seen both of you in the flesh.
The other side is......going with that reasoning.....it would be equally as "foolish" to advice someone to hand over the finances to someone that's proved they aren't interested in doing the right thing.

Seeing both spouses "in the flesh" isn't a guarantee to a resolution. People can be deceptive in person. There is often a pattern to dishonesty and financial irresponsibility. It *is* possible for people (like HelpMe) to see situations from more than one side.......to explore how her husband may be perceiving things (maybe even more than he, himself, is aware of). IOW.....she may be able to offer a fuller picture (and more accurate) on her own, than if she were to go with him to counseling.
 
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Avniel

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I believe in prayer and giving your issues to God life's to short to leave the ones you love because of money. No money in the world can give life back remember that love is more important then anything. If you love him stay if you don't no one can judge you but God. Whatever you decide I hope it's His will not mine or anyone else's but His.
 
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LinkH

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The other side is......going with that reasoning.....it would be equally as "foolish" to advice someone to hand over the finances to someone that's proved they aren't interested in doing the right thing.

Hand over the finances? He's her husband.

The issue here is that he doesn't want to be involved in the finances.
 
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mkgal1

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Hand over the finances? He's her husband.

The issue here is that he doesn't want to be involved in the finances.

Which is fortunate......but, that's not keeping him from being resistant to getting their budget in order, either.
 
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