Physics and the Immortality of the Soul

[Elias526]

So you are going to use science to tell us that science cannot show whether a soul exists or not.

Of course there is a soul. When people die they weigh less because the soul has left the body. Did you see that movie Ghost with Patrick Swayze[FONT=arial, sans-serif] & [/FONT]Demi Moore. That pretty much explains the whole thing there.

 

[Non sequitur]

Whatever. I seems like a silly and unrelated issue at this point.

YES, FOR ONCE, I AGREE WITH YOU

 

[createdtoworship]

Don't you burn a disk? That means the weight should be less because you vaporized some of the disk.

technically you are not burning a hole in a cd when you "burn it" thats just the term for using light to write data on the cd.

secondly, even if some remnant of the cd was vaporized, it has a translucent cover on it so as none of it would escape. So it would still settle back and be the same weight. But I am fairly sure plastic isn't vaporized by a cd burner, but correct me if I am wrong.

 

[createdtoworship]

So you are going to use science to tell us that science cannot show whether a soul exists or not.

Sounds to me like someone is just making this stuff up as they go along (not you personally, as you have linked to where you got the info from )

Bottom line - the soul looks exactly the same whether it is beyond time or non-existant. You have failed to show why it could be a completely made-up concept, and that could be why there is no evidence for it.

Time needs mass to operate, because time varies with mass, acceleration, and gravity.

so since the soul has no mass, the soul is outside of time.

By default the soul HAS to be eternal.

Hell must be eternal as well.

 

[ExpoTheo]

the soul has no mass.

If the soul is pure energy, then how can pure energy store memory?

 

[Non sequitur]

Time needs mass to operate, because time varies with mass, acceleration, and gravity.

so since the soul has no mass, the soul is outside of time.

By default the soul HAS to be eternal.

Hell must be eternal as well.

Interestingly enough, it's properties are non-existent, yet you posit it exists, because of these properties. The non-existent ones.

 

[createdtoworship]

Interestingly enough, it's properties are non-existent, yet you posit it exists, because of these properties. The non-existent ones.

information is massless, hence wifi

this is what I mean. Code is all the soul is. It's the signature of the brain. When someone dies they weigh the same amount as when they were alive. Thats because when the soul leaves it's massless.

 

[createdtoworship]

If the soul is pure energy, then how can pure energy store memory?

it's not energy, it's info

 

[Non sequitur]

information is massless, hence wifi

this is what I mean. Code is all the soul is. It's the signature of the brain. When someone dies they weigh the same amount as when they were alive. Thats because when the soul leaves it's massless.

Again, you posit a soul exists, because of it's non-existent properties.

Think of yourself in a courtroom:


You - "I have this list of properties that a soul has and wou-"

Judge - "Ok. Before I allow these properties to be given, what evidence do you have for this 'soul'?"

You - "You honor, I'd like to enter no evidence for a soul, to establish that there is a soul."

Judge - "I'm afraid I cannot all-"

You - "Sir, there are many people who agree with me."

Judge - "Well, that's fine and dandy, but you have shown no ev-"

You - "Well, that's the problem with our current technology. We just don't know how to (and can't) detect it."

Judge - "Seeing how you have not est-"

You - "If I can be frank, your honor... I was hoping it wouldn't come down to this, but... I know there's a soul; I read it in a book, someone/thing told me and, most importantly, I feel it. And, if need be, I can repeat myself for as long as needed. I rest my case."

This seems quite reasonable to you?

 

[createdtoworship]

Again, you posit a soul exists, because of it's non-existent properties.

Think of yourself in a courtroom:


You - "I have this list of properties that a soul has and wou-"

Judge - "Ok. Before I allow these properties to be given, what evidence do you have for this 'soul'?"

You - "You honor, I'd like to enter no evidence for a soul, to establish that there is a soul."

Judge - "I'm afraid I cannot all-"

You - "Sir, there are many people who agree with me."

Judge - "Well, that's fine and dandy, but you have shown no ev-"

You - "Well, that's the problem with our current technology. We just don't know how to (and can't) detect it."

Judge - "Seeing how you have not est-"

You - "If I can be frank, your honor... I was hoping it wouldn't come down to this, but... I know there's a soul; I read it in a book, someone/thing told me and, most importantly, I feel it. And, if need be, I can repeat myself for as long as needed. I rest my case."

This seems quite reasonable to you?

evidence for the soul? What you dont' believe in the soul or what?

 

[createdtoworship]

Again, you posit a soul exists, because of it's non-existent properties.

Think of yourself in a courtroom:


You - "I have this list of properties that a soul has and wou-"

Judge - "Ok. Before I allow these properties to be given, what evidence do you have for this 'soul'?"

You - "You honor, I'd like to enter no evidence for a soul, to establish that there is a soul."

Judge - "I'm afraid I cannot all-"

You - "Sir, there are many people who agree with me."

Judge - "Well, that's fine and dandy, but you have shown no ev-"

You - "Well, that's the problem with our current technology. We just don't know how to (and can't) detect it."

Judge - "Seeing how you have not est-"

You - "If I can be frank, your honor... I was hoping it wouldn't come down to this, but... I know there's a soul; I read it in a book, someone/thing told me and, most importantly, I feel it. And, if need be, I can repeat myself for as long as needed. I rest my case."

This seems quite reasonable to you?

evidence for the soul? What you dont' believe in the soul or what?

well I would believe that the soul is existence because we have a conscience that is higher than our conduct.

for example let me give an illustration:

in LAX airport you have people from all different cultures standing in long lines waiting to go on a flight. What if you decided to cut in front of someone who's nationality is from india? Do you think that in india they have basic moral codes as well? YES! It is this moral code that we attest to that is called by CS Lewis as the "natural law." Also what if you decided to torture babies for fun, and giggled at it? Wouldn't you think that in any culture this would be wrong? Again it is the natural law we are attesting to. Some cultures may kill infants or burn them or torture them, but certainly not giggle at it! again this is the natural law, universal law we are attesting to.

and we break this law many times a day,

because we have a consciousness that is higher than our conduct means we have a soul of conscience.

 

[Non sequitur]

evidence for the soul? What you dont' believe in the soul or what?

Why would I? There has been no evidence presented for one, yet you keep repeating it, as if it has been proven/evidenced.

I can just replace "souls" with "thetans" and apparently "thetans" and all that is entailed about and with them, is 100% true.

Now you're in quite a pickle...

or example let me give an illustration:

in LAX airport you have people from all different cultures standing in long lines waiting to go on a flight. What if you decided to cut in front of someone who's nationality is from india? Do you think that in india they have basic moral codes as well? YES! It is this moral code that we attest to that is called by CS Lewis as the "natural law." Also what if you decided to torture babies for fun, and giggled at it? Wouldn't you think that in any culture this would be wrong? Again it is the natural law we are attesting to. Some cultures may kill infants or burn them or torture them, but certainly not giggle at it! again this is the natural law, universal law we are attesting to.

and we break this law many times a day,

because we have a consciousness that is higher than our conduct means we have a soul of conscience.

Sorry, subjectivity and interpretation is not evidence.

Again, what you are referring to are thetans, not a soul.

 

[createdtoworship]

Why would I? There has been no evidence presented for one, yet you keep repeating it, as if it has been proven/evidenced.

I can just replace "souls" with "thetans" and apparently "thetans" and all that is entailed about and with them, is 100% true.

Now you're in quite a pickle...



Sorry, subjectivity and interpretation is not evidence.

Again, what you are referring to are thetans, not a soul.

thetans are scientology's version of the soul, so yes thats what it is ....if I were a scientologist, but I am not. So it's a soul...Why?


well I would believe that the soul is existence because we have a conscience that is higher than our conduct.

for example let me give an illustration:

in LAX airport you have people from all different cultures standing in long lines waiting to go on a flight. What if you decided to cut in front of someone who's nationality is from india? Do you think that in india they have basic moral codes as well? YES! It is this moral code that we attest to that is called by CS Lewis as the "natural law." Also what if you decided to torture babies for fun, and giggled at it? Wouldn't you think that in any culture this would be wrong? Again it is the natural law we are attesting to. Some cultures may kill infants or burn them or torture them, but certainly not giggle at it! again this is the natural law, universal law we are attesting to.

and we break this law many times a day,

because we have a consciousness that is higher than our conduct means we have a soul of conscience.

 

[Non sequitur]

well I would believe that the soul is existence because we have a conscience that is higher than our conduct.

for example let me give an illustration:

in LAX airport you have people from all different cultures standing in long lines waiting to go on a flight. What if you decided to cut in front of someone who's nationality is from india? Do you think that in india they have basic moral codes as well? YES! It is this moral code that we attest to that is called by CS Lewis as the "natural law." Also what if you decided to torture babies for fun, and giggled at it? Wouldn't you think that in any culture this would be wrong? Again it is the natural law we are attesting to. Some cultures may kill infants or burn them or torture them, but certainly not giggle at it! again this is the natural law, universal law we are attesting to.

and we break this law many times a day,

because we have a consciousness that is higher than our conduct means we have a soul of conscience.

Why are you giving me the same illustration, twice? Again, that doesn't evidence a soul.

All you are saying is, "I can't see how something that I interpret is something other than what I've been told and heard is the answer. Therefore, nothing else is viable."

Again, what you are talking about are thetans. I'm sorry you are confused. This should help alleviate your confusion.

 

[Non sequitur]

thetans are scientology's version of the soul, so yes thats what it is ....if I were a scientologist, but I am not. So it's a soul...Why?

No, your "soul" is a version of Scientology's thetans.

Are you aware of where your thetan (you call it a soul) goes, after death?

 

[createdtoworship]

No, your "soul" is a version of Scientology's thetans.

Are you aware of where your thetan (you call it a soul) goes, after death?

it goes to the creator

 

[Non sequitur]

it goes to the creator

Ooooo, yeah, no. That's not what happens, I'm sorry

It goes to the planet Venus, where the thetan is re-implanted and told lies about its past life and its next life. The Venusians take the thetan, "capsule" it, and send it back to Earth to be dumped into the ocean off the coast of California.

Did you not know that this is the truth or are you denying the truth?

(By the way, there is an insurmountable amount of evidence by the non-evidence not given by anybody.)

 

[createdtoworship]

Ooooo, yeah, no. That's not what happens, I'm sorry

It goes to the planet Venus, where the thetan is re-implanted and told lies about its past life and its next life. The Venusians take the thetan, "capsule" it, and send it back to Earth to be dumped into the ocean off the coast of California.

Did you not know that this is the truth or are you denying the truth?

(By the way, there is an insurmountable amount of evidence by the non-evidence not given by anybody.)

prove it

 

[Non sequitur]

prove it

I did. You have offered no evidence for it not being true.

Unless you have evidence??

 

[NailsII]

for example let me give an illustration:

in LAX airport you have people from all different cultures standing in long lines waiting to go on a flight. What if you decided to cut in front of someone who's nationality is from india? Do you think that in india they have basic moral codes as well? YES! It is this moral code that we attest to that is called by CS Lewis as the "natural law." Also what if you decided to torture babies for fun, and giggled at it? Wouldn't you think that in any culture this would be wrong? Again it is the natural law we are attesting to. Some cultures may kill infants or burn them or torture them, but certainly not giggle at it! again this is the natural law, universal law we are attesting to.

and we break this law many times a day,

because we have a consciousness that is higher than our conduct means we have a soul of conscience.

OK, so we have a conciousness, we have a 'moral law' orcode of conduct which is pretty much universal (give or take a few changes betweeen cultures, so whether or not it is primarily cultural or 'in-built' is debatable) - so where does the soul come from?
Why is it so elusive, if it has such a measurable effect on our thoughts and behaviour?

Morality has nothing to do with a soul, because if it did there would be no need for a written, god-given universal set of laws.