[PERMANENTLY CLOSED] A problem at the bottom of reason

[Chriliman]

Please read my sig. If you're unable to discuss your assertions without getting your feelings hurt, then grow a thicker skin or recuse yourself?

My feelings are not hurt at all, I'm simply stating facts. I have nothing against you

 

[HitchSlap]

My feelings are not hurt at all, I'm simply stating facts. I have nothing against you

Ok.

So, how would you know if you were wrong?

 

[Chriliman]

Ok.

So, how would you know if you were wrong?

How would I know if I was wrong about God?

I assume if God did not exist, and I lived a life believing in him and then died, I would never find out that he existed and life would have no point because eventually everyone is going to die and entropy will have its full effect on the universe, essentially causing nonexistence. Do you like to believe that nonexistence will be the ultimate truth of our universe?

On the flip side if I assume God does not exist and I believe all my life that he does not exist, then when I die and find out He does exist, I'm pretty certain I will be judged harshly for the life of unbelief that I lived.

God has revealed evidence to me of His existence, simply because I believe in Him, therefore I will never not believe in Him.

 

[HitchSlap]

How, would I know if I was wrong about God?

I assume if God did not exist, and I lived a life believing in him and then died, I would never find out that he existed and life would have no point because eventually everyone is going to die and entropy will have its full effect on the universe, essentially causing nonexistence. Do you like to believe that nonexistence will be the ultimate truth of our universe?

On the flip side if I assume God does not exist and I believe all my life that he does not exist, then when I die and find out He does exist, I'm pretty certain I will be judged harshly for the life of unbelief that I lived.

God has revealed evidence to me of His existence, simply because I believe in Him, therefore I will never not believe in Him.

Pascal's wager is weak-sauce.

I'm asking generally, how would you know if you were wrong or not, about anything.

 

[ScottA]

NVM.

?

 

[madera23]

Well, that's a first. Why don't you believe me?

If you have a way of discerning who is a true Christian and who is not, please use it on me to determine the truth.

Because your reply was from what is written word for word not from yourself.
Also too religious is what is dominant here.
Almost like playing a part.

 

[dlamberth]

As for the reality of the Kingdom of God which supersedes all other realities...it is NOT true at all.

As to the Kingdom of God, even between Christians there are different realities of what that is.

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[madera23]

It seems way more rational and full of truth to me than does some ancient mental concepts that are based on the doctrine of fixed nature of things.

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I agree with what you are saying.
you are not religious, but spiritual.
Am I right?

 

[Chriliman]

Because your reply was from what is written word for word not from yourself.
Also too religious is what is dominant here.
Almost like playing a part.

Jesus quoted scripture word for word when tempted by satan. Should I not guard myself from evil with the truth of scripture and the power of Jesus?

 

[dlamberth]

If you are correct about listening to the heart of Christ, then why doesn't Christ say anything about his heart in the Bible?

You bring up an area I have wondered about for some time. The Catholics and Orthodox have all sorts of icons of Christ holding His heart or in some way having His heart out there in front where a person has to consider it in their contemplation. And one reads about the Heart of Christ in their literature. But it's a total unknown in the Protestant community. I don't understand that. I ask myself, why limit the knowing of Christ? Personally, I'm unable to think of a deeper or fuller way of communion with Christ than by putting myself in His Heart and seeing what I see there. I believe that's what we are invited to do when He asks us to follow Him. So He may not of utwardly have said anything about His heart in the Bible, what He did say becomes fuller in meaning and understanding through His Heart. And He certainly did operate from His heart, so I'd think any true lover of God would consider exploring that aspect of Christ.

Edited to add: Google "Heart_of_Christ"

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[dlamberth]

I agree with what you are saying.
you are not religious, but spiritual.
Am I right?

That's probably pretty true. Though I am tied to a spiritual path.

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[dlamberth]

Jesus quoted scripture word for word when tempted by satan. Should I not guard myself from evil with the truth of scripture and the power of Jesus?

Because your a Christian, you should do exactly what you feel that you need to do as a Christian.

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[dlamberth]

The world looks to many gods, but only One has revealed himself to men, first to the Jews and then to the gentiles.

That which is created is not God, but God who created it.

That's not totally true. God has also revealed Himself to many others in other spiritual paths. He is way too big to fit into any single religion. God is very alive and vibrant with in folks who follow different spiritual paths. There is no way to contain God and any longer I think it ridiculous when people try. I used to do that in my Christian days, not any longer though.

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[dlamberth]

Notice how I'm backing everything I say with scripture? I wouldn't say it if I couldn't back it with scripture.

Honestly, I'd give what you say a lot more acceptance with out the use of scripture. That's just the way I roll. I guess it's because the only Holy Scripture that I recognize as coming directly from God can only be found with in life itself. That's because I see life and this creation is directly written by the hand of God and has not passed through the hand of man as it was pinned.

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[True Scotsman]

When one has an experience that can only be explained by applying the truths represented in the Bible, then one can affirm their beliefs that the Bible is the inherent word of God. If they continue to trust in God, God will continually reveal more truth to them, which strengthens their faith even more. Not all evidence needs to be physical evidence in order to represent truth. After all, truth itself is not evident, it must be discovered. The question then becomes, what makes truth inevident? Lies.

I've never had those experiences but millions of others have had experiences and they are positive that some other religious text is the best explanation and they have strong faith in their religious beliefs. They can't all be right and I'm sure that you yourself would say that they are all wrong. So faith is not a means to knowledge. At the very best it is unreliable.

Some truths are self evident, such as the axioms and the primacy of existence. My world view begins with these self evident truths and does not accept any form of the non-objective as evidence or as knowledge.

 

[madera23]

That's probably pretty true. Though I am tied to a spiritual path.

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That is the path I am on, that is what I saw in your posts.
I found the mystery of the spiritual path in psalms, it is "be still and know".
Not study and know for it fills the mind with word and chapter and the mind is too busy to be still in order to know.
I am sure you are on a similar path.


This is my valid reply
But there is nothing wrong with scripture if one perceives it. Simple scanning is different than studying it.

 

[madera23]

What is a non valid message?

 

[Chriliman]

I've never had those experiences but millions of others have had experiences and they are positive that some other religious text is the best explanation and they have strong faith in their religious beliefs. They can't all be right and I'm sure that you yourself would say that they are all wrong. So faith is not a means to knowledge. At the very best it is unreliable.

Some truths are self evident, such as the axioms and the primacy of existence. My world view begins with these self evident truths and does not accept any form of the non-objective as evidence or as knowledge.

You do realize science requires faith right? If scientists didn't have faith that there is some objective truth to be realized they wouldn't be so driven to find it. It does matter what you put your faith in.

 

[Chriliman]

Honestly, I'd give what you say a lot more acceptance with out the use of scripture. That's just the way I roll. I guess it's because the only Holy Scripture that I recognize as coming directly from God can only be found with in life itself. That's because I see life and this creation is directly written by the hand of God and has not passed through the hand of man as it was pinned.

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So what do you think the purpose of the Holy Spirit is?

 

[Chriliman]

That's not totally true. God has also revealed Himself to many others in other spiritual paths. He is way too big to fit into any single religion. God is very alive and vibrant with in folks who follow different spiritual paths. There is no way to contain God and any longer I think it ridiculous when people try. I used to do that in my Christian days, not any longer though.

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As a Christian myself, I do not claim to be religious, in fact I hate religion. I claim to have a personal relationship with Jesus the Messiah. I battle the temptations of sin everyday and the only way I defeat them is by giving them over to Jesus to fight my battles for me. I am nothing without Jesus.