Peace

[Ran77]

Romans 12: 18

18. If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.


Can a person live this Bible principal and still find actively fault with others?


:o

 

[timewerx]

Romans 12: 18

18. If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.


Can a person live this Bible principal and still find actively fault with others?


:o

Maybe you are interpreting that verse incorrectly. Because there's quite a lot more verses that say otherwise.


Perhaps the peace that Paul is talking about is simply peace in the context of non-violence. And yet still expose the works of evil


Unbelievers will hate us for exposing that works of this world are evil even if they don't look evil in plainsight, not by tolerating worldly ways and most certainly not by participating in it:


Ephesians 5:11
Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

John 15:19
If you were of the world, the world would love you as its own; but because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you.

John 7:7
The world cannot hate you, but it hates me because I testify that its works are evil.

1 John 2:15
Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, the love of the Father is not in him.

James 4:4
You adulterous people,[a] don’t you know that friendship with the world means enmity against God? Therefore, anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God.

John 14:12
Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

Luke 6:22
Blessed are you when people hate you, when they exclude you and insult you and reject your name as evil, because of the Son of Man.

 

[Norah63]

If it be possible as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
Sort of like, in the world but not of the world.
The way a person lives in Christ reproves the world of sin, yet how can they find fault with freedom,
which all men want.

 

[Ran77]

If it be possible as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.
Sort of like, in the world but not of the world.
The way a person lives in Christ reproves the world of sin, yet how can they find fault with freedom,
which all men want.

I agree. Good post.

 

[Ran77]

Maybe you are interpreting that verse incorrectly.

And then again, I rather think that I am not.

Because there's quite a lot more verses that say otherwise.

Perhaps you are interpreting those verses incorrectly.

Perhaps the peace that Paul is talking about is simply peace in the context of non-violence. And yet still expose the works of evil

Ah, I love context. Here it is:

14. Bless them which persecute you: bless, and curse not.

15. Rejoice with them that do rejoice, and weep with them that weep.

16. Be of the same mind one toward another. Mind not high things, but condescend to men of low estate. Be not wise in your own conceits.

17. Recompense to no man evil for evil. Provide things honest in the sight of all men.

18. If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.

19. Dearly beloved, avenge not yourselves, but rather give place unto wrath: for it is written, Vengeance is mine; I will repay, saith the Lord.

20. Therefore if thine enemy hunger, feed him; if he thirst, give him drink: for in so doing thou shalt heap coals of fire on his head.

21. Be not overcome of evil, but overcome evil with good.


I find the last verse especially telling. "Overcome evil with good."


I plan to come back later and take a look at the verse you posted in context.

 

[clark thompson]

As long as God wills us we need to live peacefully for others Christ did not have peace with everyone standing for the word will bring those to ate us but we should not look to cause trouble.

 

[Ran77]

As long as God wills us we need to live peacefully for others Christ did not have peace with everyone standing for the word will bring those to ate us but we should not look to cause trouble.

Thank you.

Do you have any Bible verses to support that?

 

[Phantasman]

Romans 12: 18

18. If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.


Can a person live this Bible principal and still find actively fault with others?


:o

The peace Christ gives us is a witness of Christ within us.

Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.-John 14

Finding fault with others usually comes from their own fear because of lack of faith, IMO.

 

[Ran77]

The peace Christ gives us is a witness of Christ within us.

Peace I leave with you, my peace I give unto you: not as the world giveth, give I unto you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid.-John 14

Finding fault with others usually comes from their own fear because of lack of faith, IMO.

That sounds reasonable. Certainly there must be a reason for people doing it.

 

[Phantasman]

That sounds reasonable. Certainly there must be a reason for people doing it.

I know this post may offend some, but it is just my opinion.

When you expose the wolf in sheeps clothing it becomes hostile and attempts to do anything to devour you.

Just look up the definition of the word "crusade" and you will see the events of a church that killed many over "holy land". If you are a believer that God makes land Holy, fine. I don't. And crusades continue today in other ways over different things. A church that has become mammon while being(?) spiritual. Look up the "bishop of bling" and you will see where this teaching type goes.

Most church leaders are lawyers for the word of God. And we can see where the lawyers are taking things. Having their cake and eating it too.

Like I said, just my opinion.

 

[Ran77]

Ephesians 5:11
Have nothing to do with the fruitless deeds of darkness, but rather expose them.

In context:

Ephesians 5: 1-12

1. Be ye therefore followers of God, as dear children;

2. And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.

3. But fornication, and all uncleanness, or covetousness, let it not be once named among you, as becometh saints;

4. Neither filthiness, nor foolish talking, nor jesting, which are not convenient: but rather giving of thanks.

5. For this ye know, that no whoremonger, nor unclean person, nor covetous man, who is an idolater, hath any inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God.

6. Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.

7. Be not ye therefore partakers with them.

8. For ye were sometimes darkness, but now are ye light in the Lord: walk as children of light:

9. (For the fruit of the Spirit is in all goodness and righteousness and truth)

10. Proving what is acceptable unto the Lord.

11. And have no fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness, but rather reprove them.

12. For it is a shame even to speak of those things which are done of them in secret.


Verse 11, which you quoted, states that you should have no fellowship with unfruitful "works." All we need to do is look at what else has been discussed to understand what they are talking about when they mention unfruitful works.

Verse 3 speaks against fornication, uncleanliness, and covetousness. Verse 4 speaks against filthiness, foolish talking, and jesting. Verse 5 states that whoremongers, unclean persons, covetous men, and idolators have no place in heaven. I notice that is says nothing about finding fault with them. I feel that verse 7 is the key to what is being addressed in this chapter. It admonishes us to not to partake of these behaviors with these people. In other words, do not join with those who do evil. Nothing about finding fault with them. Verse 9 lets us know that the fruit of the spirit is goodness, righteousness, and truth. Verse 10 talks about what is acceptable to God. And that brings us to verse 11 which states that we should have no fellowship with unfruitful works of darkness. Verse 12 wraps it up by letting us know that we should not even speak of the things that are done in darkness.

This chapter addresses staying away from evil works/dark things. It does not make any mention what-so-ever of finding fault with others. In fact, Verse 2 tells us to walk in love. Verse 1 even compares us as "dear children." That image is given for a reason and I just don't picture a scene of critical children pointing fingers at others and telling them how wrong they are. I'm pretty sure that is not what God intended when that verse was written.


I will attempt to look at another verse when time permits. I love looking at scripture in context. I gain so much out of studying it that way.

 

[Ran77]

I know this post may offend some, but it is just my opinion.

When you expose the wolf in sheeps clothing it becomes hostile and attempts to do anything to devour you.

Just look up the definition of the word "crusade" and you will see the events of a church that killed many over "holy land". If you are a believer that God makes land Holy, fine. I don't. And crusades continue today in other ways over different things. A church that has become mammon while being(?) spiritual. Look up the "bishop of bling" and you will see where this teaching type goes.

Most church leaders are lawyers for the word of God. And we can see where the lawyers are taking things. Having their cake and eating it too.

Like I said, just my opinion.

I suspect that your statement will be unpopular with many people.


.

 

[Phantasman]

I suspect that your statement will be unpopular with many people.


.

I'm already unpopular with most of them.

 

[Ran77]

I'm already unpopular with most of them.

How odd. I find you to be quite reasonable. Not that I always agree with your point of view, but you certainly show an uncommon level of civility - in my opinion. Well, you're A-OK in my book.

 

[southcountry]

If someone walks up to me with info they want to share, should I set about to see if its correct or in err? I dont really classify this as "finding fault" with someone. You can worship however you want. I will not judge you for your religion. Who am I to do that? But I will judge your religion. Big difference. While there are many false religions out there, I dont wish any ill things towards any of their followers, what good would that accomplish?

I think one day God will say,"silly humans". "Just like in the OT, you really didnt have to do ANY of that crazy stuff".

 

[IchoozJC]

Romans 12: 18

18. If it be possible, as much as lieth in you, live peaceably with all men.


Can a person live this Bible principal and still find actively fault with others?


:o

A person can obey the bible while highlighting flaws in another's doctrine, yes. Should be acceptable on a debate forum. Its your choice whether to be offended or not.

 

[Ran77]

If someone walks up to me with info they want to share, should I set about to see if its correct or in err? I dont really classify this as "finding fault" with someone. You can worship however you want. I will not judge you for your religion. Who am I to do that? But I will judge your religion. Big difference. While there are many false religions out there, I dont wish any ill things towards any of their followers, what good would that accomplish?

I think one day God will say,"silly humans". "Just like in the OT, you really didnt have to do ANY of that crazy stuff".

First, allow me to point out that the OP is not restricted to fault finding as it pertains to religion only. People can find fault with their spouses, their children, their friends, their co-workers, and just about anyone or anything. The same principle should work regardless of the subject of our disagreement.

Secondly, there is a big difference between being approached with something that you wish to check for error and seeking someone out to actively express negative views about them or what they do. BIG difference.

Now back to the OP: Can you live peacefully with all men while actively finding fault with them?

 

[Ran77]

A person can obey the bible while highlighting flaws in another's doctrine, yes.

I notice that you have changed the wording of my question. Allow me to return to it once again. Can a person live peacefully with all men while finding fault with them?

I'd like to know how fault finding is a peaceful activity and what Bible verses you have to support your belief.

Should be acceptable on a debate forum.

Off topic.

Besides, when did the acceptable standards on a debate forum become the guideline for how Christians should live their lives? :o

Its your choice whether to be offended or not.

That's not the topic.

 

[southcountry]

First, allow me to point out that the OP is not restricted to fault finding as it pertains to religion only. People can find fault with their spouses, their children, their friends, their co-workers, and just about anyone or anything. The same principle should work regardless of the subject of our disagreement.

Secondly, there is a big difference between being approached with something that you wish to check for error and seeking someone out to actively express negative views about them or what they do. BIG difference.

Now back to the OP: Can you live peacefully with all men while actively finding fault with them?

No.

I dont see how one could live a peaceful life by constantly looking for fault in everyone. I dont think Jesus did that and I dont think we should.


1 Corinthians 4:5
Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.


James 5:9
Grudge not one against another, brethren, lest ye be condemned: behold, the judge standeth before the door.

1 Corinthians 2:
10 But God hath revealed them unto us by his Spirit: for the Spirit searcheth all things, yea, the deep things of God.
11 For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.




A couple lessons come to mind from the OT about this. One is when Shem and Japheth covered Noah while walking backwards with the sheet , and the other was when Jonah was boasting about Nineveh being destroyed. Both show that we are to not to humiliate others, even when they may be wrong, and are not to boast about Gods judgement, for such boasting is Gods alone.



Both of these agree with the way Jesus told us how to act and should be part of our character.

 

[IchoozJC]

I notice that you have changed the wording of my question. Allow me to return to it once again. Can a person live peacefully with all men while finding fault with them?

I'd like to know how fault finding is a peaceful activity and what Bible verses you have to support your belief.






Off topic.

Besides, when did the acceptable standards on a debate forum become the guideline for how Christians should live their lives? :o






That's not the topic.

So this thread has nothing to do with what you have seen on these forums?