Panentheism

[Gxg (G²)]

Bishop Kallistos Ware, in the Orthodox Way, covers this issue. Orthodox theology is 100% panentheistic, as it goes hand-in-hand with the Essence/Energies distinction. All is sustained by God through his energies, and God is ever-present and "fills all things" through his energies, and one could say that everything is "within" the energies. Despite this, everything remains forever separate from the essence - thus God remaining transcendent and panentheistic..

In many ways, in light of Psalm 139 where DAvid said "Where can I flee from your prescence?", one could see it like being in an Ocean. Every creature/object (i.e. coral reefs, rocks, etc) is consumed by the water of the seas.....and the sea fills everything, even though the animal/objects do not become the ocean itself and are still distinct from it. The ocean doesn't need them to survive since it was already there--and there's a level above the ocean which takes it to differing places that the sea creatures/objects can never go (if taking into account evaporation, rain and storms..the Hydrologic Cycle). The sea does not need anything in it to survive since it is seperate from them and the one that gives life..but all the creatures within it NEED the water in order to continue on.

 

[Gxg (G²)]

To look at the issue from a purely etymological perspective:

Pantheism = All things are God / God is all things, or all things are part of God
Panentheism = God is in all things.

That is a considerable distnction, and the latter is quite Orthodox, being the entire point of the Incarnation.

 

[OliverC]

Hello Seekingfreedom
I am glad to have come across a post on Panentheism. This addresses my view on our relationship with God and overcomes some of the more fundamental issues raised by atheists or agnostics in my opinion. I am trying to find a way to balance my conviction of Panentheism with Christianity so would be interested if you have made more progress with your study in this field since opening this thread in April? Do you know if any denominations have more panentheistic leanings?

Thanks.

 

[Knee V]

Hello there, Aum:

I'm not sure whether other churches/denominations view the christian faith this way. If you want a better answer to that question, you could try posting in General Theology http://www.christianforums.com/f80/ or in Denomination-specific Theology http://www.christianforums.com/f451/, although I might recommend Denomination-specific Theology, as GT may turn into a horrible mess.

 

[MKJ]

.

 

[OliverC]

Thanks for your help Knee-v.
I will ask in a more general DIR, I was aiming to see if I could learn from Seekingfreedom's research.

 

[Knee V]

I was aiming to see if I could learn from Seekingfreedom's research.

I see. Sorry for misunderstanding (not that you seem offended).

 

[RobNJ]

.

I'll quote you on that!

 

[MKJ]

I'll quote you on that!

 

[Faithful Skeptic]

Sorry to somewhat re-rezz this thread, but this topic is very interesting to me. I discovered the Orthodox understanding of panentheism while writing a paper for my Christian Theology class last semester. Both Bishop Kallistos Ware and Dr. Alexei Nestoruk were included in the Eastern section of the book that I found. At the time that I found the book on Google books, the sections of both of them were mostly intact. Now it looks like neither are included in the preview anymore. :\ Here is a link to the book in question: In Whom We Live and Move and Have Our Being: Panentheistic Reflections on ... - Philip Clayton, Arthur Robert Peacocke - Google Books

After searching the title of Nestoruk's paper in the book, I came across a book of his own with a section bearing the same title. I found that on Google books as well, but only one page of it is viewable--it's the last page: Light from the East: Theology, Science, and the Eastern Orthodox Tradition - Alexei V. Nesteruk - Google Books

If you open Amazon's preview for the book and search for "The meaning of the term hypostatic" (which is the first sentence of the section), the first page isn't available, but the next few pages are. Light from the East (Theology and the Sciences) (Theology & the Sciences): Alexei V. Nesteruk: 9780800634995: Amazon.com: Books

If you do the same for Amazon's preview of the other book I mentioned earlier, you can squeeze out a few more pages: http://www.amazon.com/Whom-Live-Mov...9782/ref=reg_hu-rd_add_1_dp#reader_0802809782

His work on the topic is really, really interesting (though a bit difficult), and I'm probably going to be getting his book on it soon. Bishop Ware's piece was also very interesting, and I think that it might have been written especially for that book. I think that an important thing to note about the distinction between an Orthodox panentheistic interpretation and any other is to be found in the Online Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophies entry on panentheism: "Peacocke and Eastern Orthodox thinkers (Louth 2004, 184; Nesteruk 2004, 173–176; Ware 2004, 167) respond by affirming a weak form of emergence in which the world does not affect God."

 

[Faithful Skeptic]

Sorry to somewhat re-rezz this thread, but this topic is of great interest to me. I discovered the Orthodox understanding of panentheism while writing a paper for my Christian Theology class last semester. Both Bishop Kallistos Ware and Dr. Alexei Nesteruk were included in the Eastern section of the book that I found. At the time that I found the book on Google books, the sections of both of them were mostly intact. Now it looks like neither are included in the preview anymore. :\ Here is a link to the book in question: In Whom We Live and Move and Have Our Being: Panentheistic Reflections on ... - Philip Clayton, Arthur Robert Peacocke - Google Books

After searching the title of Nesteruk's paper in the book, I came across a book of his own with a section bearing the same title. I found that on Google books as well, but only one page of it is viewable--it's the last page of the preview, but the first page of the paper: Light from the East: Theology, Science, and the Eastern Orthodox Tradition - Alexei V. Nesteruk - Google Books

If you open Amazon's preview for the book and search for "The meaning of the term hypostatic" (which is the first sentence of the section), the first page isn't available, but the next few pages are. Click on the link that says "Page 113 ..." to get to them: Light from the East (Theology and the Sciences) (Theology & the Sciences): Alexei V. Nesteruk: 9780800634995: Amazon.com: Books

If you do the same for Amazon's preview of the other book I mentioned earlier, you can squeeze out a few more pages: In Whom We Live and Move and Have Our Being: Panentheistic Reflections on God's Presence in a Scientific World: Philip Clayton,Arthur Peacocke: 9780802809780: Amazon.com: Books

His work on the topic is really, really interesting (though a bit difficult), and I'm probably going to be getting his book on it soon. Bishop Ware's piece was also very interesting, and I think that it might have been written especially for that book. I think that an important thing to note about the distinction between an Orthodox panentheistic interpretation and any other is to be found in the Online Stanford Encyclopedia of Philosophy's entry on panentheism: "Peacocke and Eastern Orthodox thinkers (Louth 2004, 184; Nesteruk 2004, 173–176; Ware 2004, 167) respond by affirming a weak form of emergence in which the world does not affect God."

 

[OliverC]

Hello Faithful
Thanks for this, this topic is very interesting for me too. I am interested in how these concepts fit in with the Eastern Orthodox theology.

 

[Touma]

oh yes i wasn't implying that, i just thought it was necessary to point that out in case some lurkers might get the wrong impression

I was totally getting the wrong impression and was about to write up a LONG response.

 

[bibledoctor]

The ancient Greeks had a Pantheon of gods and deities ... Polytheism.

 

[Faithful Skeptic]

The ancient Greeks had a Pantheon of gods and deities ... Polytheism.

What does that have to do with the topic at hand? Did you miss the rest of the thread?