• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.
  6. We are no longer allowing posts or threads that deny the existence of Covid-19. Members have lost loved ones to this virus and are grieving. As a Christian site, we do not need to add to the pain of the loss by allowing posts that deny the existence of the virus that killed their loved one. Future post denying the Covid-19 existence, calling it a hoax, will be addressed via the warning system.

Featured Other Sheep

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by gomerian, Jun 20, 2018.

  1. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    I had asked you....

    "Before Christianity, what was the thought of Jews regarding "the" messiah, as the disciples for example, were expecting? ....that is the mold that the Antichrist must fill....while he is in that role."

    .... the answer is the promised great King of Israel.

    John 12:12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

    13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

    If a person doesn't know that, then they cannot understand the role of the Antichrist - to be instead of and against Jesus, "the" Christ. The Antichrist comes in his own name - someone that God did not send to be their king.
     
  2. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

    +1,984
    New Zealand
    Pentecostal
    Married
    Jesus will fill that role when He Returns, as the King of the world.
    There is no false Jewish Messiah, that idea is just another theory made to suit the rapture lie.
    Right; The AC comes in his own name, he doesn't make out to be the Messiah, he sits in the Temple and declares himself to be god! Matthew 24:13
     
  3. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Keras, you don't understand that the Jews rejected Jesus of being their King, which is what "the" messiah was supposed to be.....

    The Antichrist, to be the Antichrist, must be anointed the King of Israel (by the false prophet).

    The person who becomes the Antichrist is also of the bloodline of the Julio-Claudians, i.e. the Caesar family. Comes from Revelation 17:10, the seven kings. And from Daniel 7, the little horn of the fourth empire.
     
  4. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

    +1,984
    New Zealand
    Pentecostal
    Married
    Jesus came as a suffering servant, so they failed to recognize Him. His Return will be as KING.
    ...must be...? Your personal opinion, an idea not found in scripture.
    Revelation 11:11-13 says the AC will be worshipped by the world, not anointed the king of Israel at all.
    Quite possibly, but not necessarily so.
     
  5. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    If you believe those parts I underlined are already fulfilled, then you are being deceived.

    The ten tribes majority have never returned, for that is to occur only... on the day of Jesus' coming. What we are seeing today, since 1948, is the return of many Jews of the "house of Judah", and also those who became Jews at some point in history. The ten tribes were never known as Jews.

    The Jewish historian Josephus said the title of Jew originated from the sole tribe of Judah, and was put for those who returned from the 70 years Babylon captivity, and even for the strangers who converted and lived in Judea. Only the tribe of Benjamin joined with Judah at the split of 1 Kings 11 forward. And when Jeroboam, king of northern Israel setup golden calf idol worship, a remnant of the ten tribes refused and went south to join with Judah. But the majority of the ten tribes remained in the north under king Jeroboam of the tribe of Ephraim. Because of the idols, the tribe of Levi also left the north and joined with Judah.

    When the northern kingdom "house of Israel" went captive to Assyria and the lands of the Medes, only the tribes of Judah, Benjamin, Levi, and those living in Judea in the south were left in the holy land. Those left were the Jews. And about 120 years later, they would go captive to Babylon for 70 years, and only a small remnant of those Jews would return to Jerusalem from Babylon. The rest of them, the majority of Jews, remained in Babylon, and were further scattered in the countries. It's those mainly, and the ones scattered by the Romans in 70 A.D. that have been returning.

    Josephus (100 A.D.) said in his day, the ten tribes were a great number, too many to be counted, and were still scattered beyond Euphrates.

    You should study the Book of Hosea, because it's specifically about God's anger against the ten tribed northern kingdom of the "house of Israel" under Ephraim. God made Jeroboam (of Ephraim) king over them in the north (1 Kings 11). One of the main differences in Hosea is where God said He would scatter the ten tribes and they would lose knowledge of the feasts, new moons, and sabbaths. Did the Jews lose that heritage? NO! That's why the ten tribes are not the Jews of the house of Judah.
     
  6. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Also, I don't think any believer in the Church confuses certain differences between Jewish converts to Christ vs. Gentile believers. There's still some notable differences with Jewish converts, most of the time. Jewish converts still may adhere to the health laws in the OT more rigorously, or may still observe feasts that we Gentiles don't. There's no NT requirement that they must quit observing things like circumcision or eating per God's health law, etc. They are just not to use that in place of being saved by God's grace through His Son Jesus Christ.

    My point is, the Jews recognize their heritage of Israel. The Hosea prophecy was that the ten tribes would lose their heritage as being of Israel.

    The following is God speaking through Hosea to the "house of Israel" after the split of 1 Kings 11 with God separating old Israel into two separate kingdoms (see Hosea 1 first). In Hosea, God is revealing how He is going to take the house of Israel (ten tribes) away ending their northern kingdom:

    Hos 2:6-13
    6 Therefore, behold, I will hedge up thy way with thorns, and make a wall, that she shall not find her paths.
    7 And she shall follow after her lovers, but she shall not overtake them; and she shall seek them, but shall not find them: then shall she say, 'I will go and return to my first husband; for then was it better with me than now.'
    8 For she did not know that I gave her corn, and wine, and oil, and multiplied her silver and gold, which they prepared for Baal.
    9 Therefore will I return, and take away My corn in the time thereof, and My wine in the season thereof, and will recover My wool and My flax given to cover her nakedness.
    10 And now will I discover her lewdness in the sight of her lovers, and none shall deliver her out of Mine hand.
    11 I will also cause all her mirth to cease, her feast days, her new moons, and her sabbaths, and all her solemn feasts.

    12 And I will destroy her vines and her fig trees, whereof she hath said, 'These are my rewards that my lovers have given me': and I will make them a forest, and the beasts of the field shall eat them.
    13 And I will visit upon her the days of Baalim, wherein she burned incense to them, and she decked herself with her earrings and her jewels, and she went after her lovers, and forgat Me, saith the LORD.

    KJV

    That literally happened to the ten tribed "house of Israel" after God sent the kings of Assyria to take them captive to the lands of Assyria and the Medes. They lost... their heritage as part of Israel. That's the real meaning of the idea of their being 'lost'. In the days of Apostle James, and even in Josephus' day of 100 A.D., the Jews still knew the ten tribes were scattered beyond Euphrates.

    But over time, the ten tribes lost their heritage. They became as Gentiles, worshiping idols like Gentiles of old, just as God had revealed would happen in Hosea 2.

    The ten tribes will remain 'lost' all the way up to the day of Jesus' return. That is when they will be told about their lost heritage as part of Israel. But for Judah, God did not do this to them:

    Hos 1:6-7
    6 And she conceived again, and bare a daughter. And God said unto him, 'Call her name Lo-ruhamah: for I will no more have mercy upon the house of Israel; but I will utterly take them away.'

    7 But I will have mercy upon the house of Judah, and will save them by the LORD their God, and will not save them by bow, nor by sword, nor by battle, by horses, nor by horsemen.
    KJV



    This was for after God had removed the ten tribed northern kingdom of Israel:

    2 Kings 17:18
    18 Therefore the LORD was very angry with Israel, and removed them out of His sight: there was none left but the tribe of Judah only.
    KJV


    The next verses in 2 Kings 17 are about Judah's later rebellion and captivity to Babylon.

    So it's important to understand Bible history about the difference between the house of Israel, and the house of Judah (Jews), and their separate histories with each going into their own specific captivities.
     
  7. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    But they rejected Jesus of being their King of Israel. "The" messiah is the role of being the promised great King of Israel - who will lead Israel and the world into the messianic age of peace and safety, among other things. Which is why when the Jews embrace the Antichrist, thinking he is the promised great King of Israel - they will be saying peace and safety - until he betrays them and claims to be God.


    The idea that "the" messiah is the promised great King of Israel - is saturated in the bible. The Antichrist will be another, other than Jesus, the Jews will embrace as their King of Israel. In
    Revelation 11:11-13 ? Are you sure you have the right reference? I think you might mean something in Revelation 13. The person is no longer the Antichrist - when he becomes the beast.

    The person will be on two tracks...
    1. How he becomes the Antichrist, the King of Israel (illegitimate).

    2. How he becomes the King of the Roman Empire, the 7th and 8th king, that is the little horn and later the beast.

    If you don't understand that and keep the two tracks separate in your thought process - you cannot understand the end times events.

    If you think of the end times arch villain - in one dimension, as "the Antichrist" in all his evil ways, you are going to have errors in your eschatology. He is the Antichrist while he is the King of Israel. He is the little horn and beast while he is the King of the Roman Empire.

    In Revelation, the person is mostly in the role of being the beast, the King of the Roman empire. The EU in whatever the final form looks like, will be his Kingdom, given to him by the ten leaders of the EU at the time. Comes from Revelation 17:17.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  8. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    At the time of Jesus, all of the 12 tribes were intermingled together. It was the southern two tribes that came back en-masse. The northern ten tribes did not. Jesus did not say, I have come to save the lost sheep of Judah - but of Israel.

    And as such, all tribes were also ncluded when they went in captivity in the first century, to the nations - for rejecting Jesus. And a large portion of all the tribes accordingly have been brought back into the land..

    Parts of Ezekiel 37 have been fulfilled. The nation over there right now is one nation again. The land of Israel is no longer two different kingdoms. You can google the maps of the two kingdoms, and compare to the map of present day Israel.

    The prophecies in Ezekiel 38, speak specifically to "the land of Israel" which highlights that they are no longer northern and southern kingdoms even regarding the geography.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  9. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    .
     
  10. gomerian

    gomerian Other Sheep

    490
    +76
    United States
    Seeker
    Private
    Jesus was speaking to the nation that lived in Jerusalem. That either means Benjamin which owned the land, or Judah-Benjamin that was separated from the 10-North/Israel at the division of the kingdom.

    And those palm leaves show up in Revelation when the remnant believe.

    God says he that chooses them is an abomination, in Isaiah 41:24-25. There is no turning back once they've believed the against-Christ. There is no Scripture to the contrary. Once they've accepted his mark, they belong to him, forever.

    And once the entire 144k have the seal of God, they will not change their minds, either. God has already 'made it impossible', by telling you beforehand: Matthew 24:24 plus Matthew 7:22-23 ...... versus Revelation 9:21.

    And Satan has made it impossible for those marked by his scorpions to change their minds. God will never accept them, after that point. There is no turning back. Just like there was no hope for Judas, even though he'd changed his mind. Some choices cannot be undone.

    Most of the seals act like a preview of coming events. Obviously, the black horse happens when the beast has made his mark on those who can buy and sell. Jesus isn't visible to those on earth during the time He begins to open the seals... in fact, two of those seals have been opened for over 2000 years. Between the second and the third seals, Jesus has certainly not been standing before the throne.

    It helps to remember Zachariah's horses, and know that the horses themselves belong to God. The rider on the white horse is the Holy Spirit, IMHO [because conquering to conquer is as multiplying I will multiply]; and the rider on the war horse is Jesus, IMHO [because Jesus came to set mothers against daughters]... as of today, this is what I think. The rider on the black horse must be the false prophet, since he causes famine by his demands... [which is another reason why the against-Christ people won't be accepted by God: 'Thou shalt have no other gods before Me' is nulified by the statuary they'll have. In fact, the Law of Moses gets trampled upon rather pointedly by the against-Christ.]

    The pale horse carries Death, with whom Jerusalem has made a covenant... followed by Sheol, with whom Jerusalem is in agreement. At that point in time, Jerusalemites cannot be redeemed because of Isaiah 28:15, alone. [Which is why believers are told to flee. If they don't, they'll be compelled to join that covenant, by default. All of which carries the same meaning as "Come out of her, My people"] And that whole chapter tells us why the stick (of Ezekiel 27) is taken out of the hand of Ephraim, and given (back) to Joseph... and that's why Joseph, not (the drunkards of) Ephraim, is listed among the sealed of Revelation 7.

    They'll be the wise virgins, rather than the bride/queen of Psalm 45:9-14. It matters when a person believes, as to where his place will be. The marriage will have honored guests and companions as well as the bride. If they're not willing to be humbled by their Lost Sheep-relations who were sought for and found, they'll be foolish virgins, standing on the wrong side of the door. Which seems appropriate, when we see Jesus having to stand outside the door to a church that only pretends to live. At some point, you must stop eating foods that will kill you; but after that point, it won't matter what you do. Choose you this day, whom ye will serve.

    __________
    When you put your verses in those boxes, they don't show up for the people who are replying to you. Either there's a way around that (which I have yet to find), or you should think about cut&paste, rather than whatever it is you did to the post I'm replying to.
    ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  11. gomerian

    gomerian Other Sheep

    490
    +76
    United States
    Seeker
    Private
    I see where a 3rd of a prophet's beard gets taken through the flame. Does that mean the entire third are redeemed? Jesus tells them to buy from Him gold tried in the fire, but that doesn't mean they all will.
    ...
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  12. gomerian

    gomerian Other Sheep

    490
    +76
    United States
    Seeker
    Private
    Conquerers don't leave the land vacant so that wild animals increase, nor do they stop wanting the farmers to farm. The armies and rich people would have been hauled off, along with the ruling class and priesthood. Poor people were left in the land as slaves.

    Yikes! I completely forgot about Levi... which makes Matthew 23:37-38 even more of a problem.

    Josephus seems to be paraphrasing Esdras... some of which I find extremely hinky. But Jesus sent the Revelation letters to the churches of Asia, not across the Euphrates.
     
  13. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    gomerian, the land of Israel at the time of Jesus was not a nation, neither north, nor south. The land of Israel was made up of three occupied regions of Galilee, Samaria, Judea.

    The requirement to take the mark of his name, the number of his name, or his name comes after the person is done with with being the Antichrist. The person will have become the beast, when people worship him.

    Here is the role timeframes of the person...


    (initial role) The little horn, leader of the EU - before Gog/Magog takes place.

    Gog/Magog takes place.

    As the prince who shall come - following Gog/Magog.

    (new role) As the Antichrist, anointed King of Israel - starts the 7 years.

    (role change)
    Becomes the revealed man of sin - somewhere around 3 years 3 months into his reign. ends his time as the Antichrist, anointed King of Israel

    (new role) he becomes the beast. The ten kings give him their kingdom.

    The abomination of desolation, statue image of him made.

    Requirement to take the mark, the number, or his name begins.

    _________________________________________________________

    So, the Jews will think the person is the messiah, King of Israel between day1 of the 7 years and for around 3 years 3 months into his reign. When he betrays them and claims to be God - they will impeach him from continuing as their King. And turn to believe upon Jesus.

    No longer the King of Israel pseudo Jewish messiah, the person becomes the beast and the world buys into his claim of being the God - most likely he will claim to have achieved God-hood. He goes on the rampage for the second half of the 7 years.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2018
  14. gomerian

    gomerian Other Sheep

    490
    +76
    United States
    Seeker
    Private
    What do you think Nation, in Matthew 28:20, means?
    In the OT, it's goyim.
    In the NT, it's Ethnos.
    They both can't be right.

    All kidding aside, whenever I say a nation, I mean ethnology.
    The Law of Moses was given to cleanse the land of Israel, for the purity of both the land and its people. They don't keep the Law. Maybe they would if Israel came home. But I highly doubt it. They're more likely to go back to burning people for Molech, with Israel as their 'volunteers.'

    That's waaaay too complicated for me. I understand that the little horn is injured, the little horn casts down 3 of the horns that got him to power. I see the beast as being a confederation, rather than a single person. Maybe the little horn was killed a long time ago. Or maybe he gets killed in these latter days, but it seems to me that the little horn is what most people are calling the anti-christ... when really, there have been scores of against-Christ people since John first wrote about them. To me, it doesn't matter what their pecking order turns out to be, since they're all the bad guy... a whole confederacy of bad guys, trying to make us sit at their feet.

    It's also hard to tell how many would-be gods there are in the world, since Satan tempted Eve with that mythology. For all I know, every Shirley Maclaine follower is the teenist 'i am', and every ommm is trying to raise the beast from out of the pit... they repented not of their sorceries. It's nice to think that you could impeach Satan, if you could get your head screwed on straight, but I don't think it'll happen that way.
    ...
     
  15. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    That's not quite correct. The ten tribes in majority were still scattered to Assyria and the lands of the Medes even to the days of the Jewish historian Josephus (100 A.D.), as he said they were still beyond Euphrates and were a great number, too many to be counted. Only a remnant of the northern ten tribes sided with Judah when the calf idols in the north were instituted by Jeroboam (2 Chronicles 11:13-17).

    Concerning our Lord Jesus' mention that He was not sent but unto the house of Israel, that was true, because the Jews in majority rejected Him, and thus like Apostle Paul said in Romans 11, Israel in part was blinded so the Gospel would go to the Gentiles. Even while in Rome Paul still tried to get his brethren Jews to accept Jesus, but they still refused and Paul then knew the prophecy of their rejection was very real (Acts 28). And thus The Gospel went to the ten scattered tribes among the Gentiles, and many of both would believe and become Christ's Church. And that is how it would be fulfilled that Ephraim's seed would become "a multitude of nations", meaning the Christian nations of history that accepted The Gospel after the Jews in Jerusalem rejected it.

    I can tell you really haven't studied enough of the matter, because you're simply following a 'line' of tradition and not what the actual Scriptures reveal. When God split old Israel in the days of Solomon's son Rehoboam, He gave Jeroboam of the tribe of Ephraim to be king over the ten tribes that lived in the north. Two separate kingdoms were created, the "kingdom of Judah" in the south at Jerusalem, and the "kingdom of Israel" in the north at Samaria. They had war against each other, that's how separate they were after the split. And they each went into their 'own' separate captivity, and at different times.

    THE TWO CAPTIVITIES:
    Around 611 B.C. -
    the kings of Assyria removed the ten northern tribes of the "kingdom of Israel" and it was no more a kingdom as God had forewarned in the Books of His prophets. They were carried away into Assyria and into the cities of the Medes, and in majority are still scattered to this day (2 Kings 17). Only the southern "kingdom of Judah" (Jews) was left in the land.

    Around 480 B.C. -
    The king of Babylon (Nebuchadnezzar) came upon the "kingdom of Judah" at Jerusalem and took them captive to Babylon for 70 years (Book of Jeremiah).

    Those were two separate captivities of the two separate houses by different kings with about 130 years between them. In the first captivity example, it was only involving the ten tribes in the northern kingdom. In the second captivity example, it was only involving the southern kingdom of Judah, made up of the tribes Judah, Benjamin, and Levi (and some small remnants of the northern tribes that left to side with Judah in Jeroboam's days).

    Per Ezra 2, only a small remnant of the tribes of Judah and Benjamin returned to Jerusalem after their 70 years Babylon captivity. Ezra even had to send back to Babylon to get Levite priests, because he didn't find them among the people returning (Ezra 8). The majority of the house of Judah of 3 tribes remained in Babylon of their own choice, because God promised He would take care of them while captive to Babylon, and He did. Their numbers even increased, as they built houses, planted vineyards. They got comfortable in Babylon, so they didn't want to go back to Jerusalem. Only a remnant of the Jews did. And that's who made up the Jews in Judea during the time of Jesus' 1st coming. None of the ten tribes are mentioned returning by Ezra.

    Ezekiel 37 is still yet to be fulfilled today. Even the early example of the bones being raised is a symbolic metaphor for the time of the resurrection on the day of Jesus' 2nd coming. The two sticks representing the two houses of God's people are still not put back together today. The ten tribes lost their heritage and never were Jews. The Jews of the house of Judah never lost their heritage as part of Israel. Yet that's all they are today, still just Israel in part.
     
  16. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    Really? I am almost 70 and have studied the end times prophecies for 47 years, nearly all of my adult life. I am an expert on the topic - because God has made me an expert. I can tell that you are not.

    There are still descendants of the ten tribes and the two tribes in the nations. That was never the point.

    You are telling me things I was well aware of 40 years ago. I don't mind, but there is no reason to degrade me in sharing your position - for knowledge wise you are not on my level. We have too much of that sort of comments going on in this forum. I wish it would stop.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2018
  17. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Your response is not very clear; that shows you haven't yet decided on the matter.

    The kings of Assyria after having removed the ten tribes, instead placed peoples from five areas of Babylon into the northern lands of Israel instead. That was one the king's modus operandi for conquering and controlling a people. Those became the Samaritans in Jesus' day.

    When the house of Judah was carried away captive in Jeremiah's day, it's true there was left a small poor remnant in the land. That only goes to show God's Word as the truth, because God promised in 1 Kings 11 that He would always leave one tribe in Jerusalem for sake of His servant David and for Jerusalem's sake.

    As for the Churches in Asia, it was actually Asia Minor, in the areas we today call Turkey. The seven Churches formed a circle pattern by their geographical locations.

    In the time of Apostle James, he showed how the 12 tribes were still scattered in the very first verse of his Epistle. So why shouldn't Josephus be believed? I know the Jews don't like Josephus because of some supposed escape of suicide he let other soldiers take, but at the last he refused to do upon himself.
     
  18. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    There's plenty of Scripture proof in the OT prophets to show that the ten lost tribes of Israel have yet to be gathered, because the prophecies about their gathering is linked with the last day of this present world. So in your 47 years, you have obviously missed that, and I say that because of something else... you've likely been listening to or heeding. And it's because those Scriptures I speak of are very obvious to their time of gathering.

    Isa 60:8-11
    8 Who are these that fly as a cloud, and as the doves to their windows?

    9 Surely the isles shall wait for Me, and the ships of Tarshish first, to bring thy sons from far, their silver and their gold with them, unto the name of the LORD thy God, and to the Holy One of Israel, because He hath glorified thee.

    10 And the sons of strangers shall build up thy walls, and their kings shall minister unto thee: for in My wrath I smote thee, but in My favour have I had mercy on thee.

    11 Therefore thy gates shall be open continually; they shall not be shut day nor night; that men may bring unto thee the forces of the Gentiles, and that their kings may be brought.
    KJV



    Jer 23:3-8
    3 And I will gather the remnant of My flock out of all countries whither I have driven them, and will bring them again to their folds; and they shall be fruitful and increase.

    4 And I will set up shepherds over them which shall feed them: and they shall fear no more, nor be dismayed, neither shall they be lacking, saith the LORD.

    5 Behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that I will raise unto David a righteous Branch, and a King shall reign and prosper, and shall execute judgment and justice in the earth.

    6 In his days Judah shall be saved, and Israel shall dwell safely: and this is his name whereby he shall be called, THE LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS.


    7 Therefore, behold, the days come, saith the LORD, that they shall no more say, 'The LORD liveth, which brought up the children of Israel out of the land of Egypt;
    8 But, The LORD liveth, Which brought up and which led the seed of the house of Israel out of the north country, and from all countries whither I had driven them; and they shall dwell in their own land.'

    KJV

    The time of the great gathering of both houses of Israel is at Jesus' return. That is Who that "LORD OUR RIGHTEOUSNESS" is there reigning at that time. Until then, we are only seeing a remnant of Judah returning today. And most important... Jesus is not reigning there in Jerusalem, for those Jews still reject Him today. During the time of these Scriptures, they will have accepted Jesus as Lord and King. If you had truly studied 47 years without heeding traditions of men, you should know this.
     
  19. Douggg

    Douggg anytime rapture, non-dispensationalist, futurist

    +2,330
    United States
    Non-Denom
    Private
    For me, that sort of commentary is what is tiring, from posters who want to act like they are so smart and knowledgeable. I haven't been following any prophecy guru's. Please just stop, and present your position.

    The joining of the two sticks back into one nation took place in May 14:1948. Israel, the single nation again over there is a fact of life. It was born in a single day fulfilling Isaiah 66:5-6.

    No-body is saying that all of the southern two tribes or the northern ten tribes have returned. It is not going to be all at one time. There will be some brought back at Jesus's return, yes, Matthew 24:31. But it is not as you thinking as the fulfillment of joining the two sticks - that part has been fulfilled already.

    Gog/Magog will take place before Jesus returns - so the joining of the two sticks into one nation has to be before Gog/Magog. Which it has taken place, and the participants to attack Israel are moved closer to position in recent years.
     
  20. Davy

    Davy Well-Known Member Supporter

    +708
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Fine.

    Not true. Per Bible history and secular history, the ten scattered tribes LOST their heritage as part of Israel. Judah (Jews) did not.

    It is impossible for the ten lost tribes to even know... to return, since they are NOT Jews, and lost their heritage as Israel. I covered this point in an earlier post from Hosea 2 where God said they would lose their heritage of the feast days, new moons, and sabbaths. Why have you denied His Word about that?
     
Loading...