Only way?

[Tree of Life]

Where did you think CHRIST went after HE was crucified and descended to lead captivity captive?

Jesus came to earth as a man after he descended from heaven.

 

[Albion]

Abraham indeed had the revelation that he needed in order to embrace Jesus by faith. Abraham did embrace Jesus by faith. But he never knew him by name. And he did not have explicit knowledge of the cross.

My point is that it's possible to embrace Jesus by faith even if we have incomplete revelation.

It would be interesting to read a real explanation of how it would be possible to have faith in someone about whom you have absolutely no information.

 

[miknik5]

That is not exactly true. We know that many of the Old Testament patriarch's were imputed righteousness because of their faith.

So I'm not sure we can say for sure how Old Testament people will be judged or what God has in store for them since He will bring back His people (Hebrews/Israelite's) back to Himself, showing He is the Messiah at the second coming.

So, I would say we do not exactly know for sure, that is IMHO.

Abraham was imputed righteous by God though, because of his faith.


Romans 4:18-20
18Against all hope, Abraham in hope believed and so became the father of many nations, just as he had been told, “So shall your offspring be.”d 19Without weakening in his faith, he acknowledged the decrepitness of his body (since he was about a hundred years old) and the lifelessness of Sarah’s womb.

20Yet he did not waver through disbelief in the promise of God, but was strengthened in his faith and gave glory to God, 21being fully persuaded that God was able to do what He had promised. 22That is why “it was credited to him as righteousness.”e

23Now the words “it was credited to him” were written not only for Abraham, 24but also for us, to whom righteousness will be credited—for us who believe in Him who raised Jesus our Lord from the dead. 25He was delivered over to death for our trespasses and was raised to life for our justification.

abraham just like all those who were waiting for the fulfillment of all GOD's PROMISES know now that he was not made perfect without us. Without the GRACE which was to cone to us in CHRIST JESUS


But he and all those who prophecied and spoke about what was to come in lower and hidden signs and representations know now

 

[miknik5]

Jesus came to earth as a man after he descended from heaven.

And where did HE go after The vessel of HIS fleshly body lay in the tomb?

 

[Tree of Life]

It would be interesting to read a real explanation of how it would be possible to have faith in someone about whom you have absolutely no information.

Well I would say that Abraham had faith in God's promises which have their ultimate fulfillment in Christ. Abraham believed that God would give him a miraculous son who would be heir of the world and who would also have to be sacrificed. Abraham may've thought that this son was Isaac, and in a sense Isaac fits this description, but ultimately Abraham's promised son is Jesus Christ. As Abraham embrace this promise he embraced Christ.

 

[miknik5]

HE descended so as to ascend so as to fill all things so as to be over all things whether in heaven on earth or under the earth

The first in all things so as to have the Preeminence over all things

 

[Albion]

Well I would say that Abraham had faith in God's promises which have their ultimate fulfillment in Christ.

Which promises would those be?

Abraham believed that God would give him a miraculous son who would be heir of the world and who would also have to be sacrificed. Abraham may've thought that this son was Isaac, and in a sense Isaac fits this description, but ultimately Abraham's promised son is Jesus Christ. As Abraham embrace this promise he embraced Christ.

No, Issac is not Jesus.

 

[Tree of Life]

And where did HE go after The vessel of HIS fleshly body lay in the tomb?

I don't know.

 

[Tree of Life]

Which promises would those be?

Every promise. Miracle son, heir of the world, blessing to the nations.

No, Issac is not Jesus.

Isaac is a type of Christ.

 

[miknik5]

Well I would say that Abraham had faith in God's promises which have their ultimate fulfillment in Christ. Abraham believed that God would give him a miraculous son who would be heir of the world and who would also have to be sacrificed. Abraham may've thought that this son was Isaac, and in a sense Isaac fits this description, but ultimately Abraham's promised son is Jesus Christ. As Abraham embrace this promise he embraced Christ.

Abraham prophecied. Abraham when he was called to sacrifice his promised son did not fully understand that this "reenactment in lower visible signs of the promised son" was pointing forward to CHRIST

But he does now

Remember CHRIST said Abraham longed to see my day. He saw it and was glad of it

 

[miknik5]

I don't know.

Do you believe Peter 3:19(?)

 

[Albion]

Every promise. Miracle son, heir of the world, blessing to the nations.

I asked for actual promises.

Isaac is a type of Christ.

No, he isn't. Christ is GOD. Isaac was a mortal. Faith in Christ means faith in his redeeming work. Isaac didn't do that.

Even if there were some faint similarity, Abraham couldn't have faith in Christ by believing his own son to be God's gift. You might say that Abraham trusted God to do something such as turned out later to be the Incarnation, but that's far from Abraham having faith in Christ.

 

[Tree of Life]

Do you believe Peter 3:19(?)

I don't believe that 1 Peter 3:19 is talking about what Jesus did after he died. I believe it's talking about the spirit of Jesus prophesying in the days of Noah.

 

[miknik5]

I don't believe that 1 Peter 3:19 is talking about what Jesus did after he died. I believe it's talking about the spirit of Jesus prophesying in the days of Noah.

Sir do you believe in JESUS? Do you believe that there is only one SPIRIT of TRUTH/SPIRIT of GOD?

Whose SPIRIT was in all the prophets who spoke and pointed to CHRIST?

And whose SPIRIT was in CHRIST pre and post crucified?

is CHRIST separate from
THE FATHER?

 

[Tree of Life]

I asked for actual promises.

Here's one:

15 After these things the word of the Lord came to Abram in a vision: “Fear not, Abram, I am your shield; your reward shall be very great.” 2 But Abram said, “O Lord God, what will you give me, for I continue childless, and the heir of my house is Eliezer of Damascus?” 3 And Abram said, “Behold, you have given me no offspring, and a member of my household will be my heir.” 4 And behold, the word of the Lord came to him: “This man shall not be your heir; your very own son shall be your heir.” 5 And he brought him outside and said, “Look toward heaven, and number the stars, if you are able to number them.” Then he said to him, “So shall your offspring be.” 6 And he believed the Lord, and he counted it to him as righteousness.

The Holy Bible: English Standard Version. (2001). (Ge 15:1–6). Wheaton: Standard Bible Society.

Here God promises that a son will come from his body who will be Abraham's heir (heir of the promises - land of Canaan included) and will multiply to become an innumerable people.

This son, ultimately, is Jesus Christ. As Abraham "believed God" here he believed in Jesus Christ.

No, he isn't. Christ is GOD. Isaac was a mortal. Faith in Christ means faith in his redeeming work. Isaac didn't do that.

Even if there were some faint similarity, Abraham couldn't have faith in Christ by believing his own son to be God's gift.

Yes he is. Isaac prefigured Jesus as being the miracle son who must be sacrificed.

Let me ask you a question. If Abraham didn't believe in Christ, how can he be said to be saved?

 

[Tree of Life]

Sir do you believe in JESUS?

Yes.

Do you believe that there is only one SPIRIT of TRUTH/SPIRIT of GOD?

Huh? I believe there is only one God but I'm not sure what your language means here.

Whose SPIRIT was in all the prophets who spoke and pointed to CHRIST?

Yep.

 

[miknik5]

Who led captivity captive in HIS TRAIN and gave gifts to men?

Who continues today to give gifts to men?

And who will testify ?

 

[miknik5]

Yes.



Huh? I believe there is only one God but I'm not sure what your language means here.



Yep.

Whose SPIRIT was on all the prophets who spoke and pointed to CHRIST
Your response "tree of life": yep
Yep is not a complete answer

 

[Tree of Life]

Yep is not an answer

I misunderstood the question. The spirit of Jesus was in all the prophets who prophesied about him.

 

[miknik5]

Abraham will testify not of his son, Isaac

You do know this

In fact even the men of Nineveh will testify

And not of Jonah either


And Moses also will testify