One of The STRONGEST Arguments for The Sabbath ~

[pasifika]

No, the Sabbath rest is not called "today" God literally spelled that out for us and we should not add to His Words.

Exodus 20:8 “Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. 9 Six days you shall labor and do all your work, 10 but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord your God. In it you shall do no work: you, nor your son, nor your daughter, nor your male servant, nor your female servant, nor your cattle, nor your stranger who is within your gates. 11 For in six days the Lord made the heavens and the earth, the sea, and all that is in them, and rested the seventh day. Therefore the Lord blessed the Sabbath day and hallowed it.

"Today" means if you hear His voice don't harden your heart and says nothing about that being the Sabbath day. You seem to be adding what you want to these clear scriptures.

We will have to agree to disagree.

Hello,
Notice, Exodus 20:8-10 never state that the 7th day is the Sabbath day for man...

7th day is the Sabbath Day for God...Not Man...(Israer rest on that day as a memorial to God)

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Hello,
Notice, Exodus 20:8-10 never state that the 7th day is the Sabbath day for man...

7th day is the Sabbath Day for God...Not Man...(Israer rest on that day as a memorial to God)

It’s a commandment to man from God. God is not commanding Himself to do something, He is commanding us to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy and to do all of our work in six days. God wants us to keep holy the same day that is holy to God.

If you have any confusion with this very easy to read commandment Exodus 20:8-11 written and spoke by God, Jesus tells us the Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27 and man was made on the sixth day Genesis 1:26 before the very first Sabbath with God present. Genesis 2:1-3. When Jesus comes back we will once again be celebrating and worshipping God on His chosen Sabbath day Isaiah 66:23 that has never ended and is still a commandment that Jesus tells us-you break the least of God’s commandments, you will be least in heaven. Matthew 5:19. Least in heaven does not sound like you will be there, not a risk I’m willing to taking especially since the Sabbath is such a delight. We are told BLESSED are those that DO His commandments. Revelations 22:14

 

[pasifika]

It’s a commandment to man from God. God is not commanding Himself to do something, He is commanding us to keep the seventh day Sabbath holy. God wants us to keep holy the same day that is holy to God.

If you have any confusion with this very easy to read commandment Exodus 20:8-11 written and spoke by God, Jesus tells us the Sabbath was made for man Mark 2:27 and man was made on the sixth day Genesis 1:26 before the very first Sabbath with God present. Genesis 2:1-3. When Jesus comes back we will once again be celebrating and worshipping God on His chosen Sabbath day that has never ended and is still a commandment that Jesus tells us-you break the least of God’s commandments, you will be least in heaven. Matthew 5:19. Least in heaven does not sound like you will be there. We are told BLESSED are those that DO His commandments. Revelations 22:14

Hello
Commandment to the children of Israel to keep as a "memorial" of their God..(which separate them from the gods of other nations)...

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Hello
Commandment to the children of Israel to keep as a "memorial" of their God..(which separate them from the gods of other nations)...

Are you saying there are two God’s now, two gospels, two truths? Israel has always been synonymous for “God’s people”. We are one if we are in Christ. Gal 3:28

 

[pasifika]

Are you saying there are two God’s now, two gospels, two truths? Israel has always been synonymous for “God’s people”. We are one if we are in Christ. Gal 3:28

One God, one Gospel, one Truth...and One rest (Sabbath Rest)
The rest in which God enter into on the 7th day, and we (man) will enter into on "today"...

I think you see the Sabbath Rest as a physical Rest where you sleep, sitting doing nothing, worship, eating etc...every 7th day.

I see the Sabbath Rest as a "spiritual" rest...rest of the soul from sin and all kinds of wickedness that put us to death from God's wrath, once you free from sin you will then find rest for your soul..

So I think we interpret or understand "Sabbath Rest" differently..

 

[klutedavid]

If we love God and our neighbor, then we will not commit adultery, idolatry, theft, murder, breaking the Sabbath, an so forth for all of the other laws that God has given.

You may have made a mistake in your post Soyeong?

You seem to be quoting from Exodus 20, "adultery, idolatry, theft, murder, breaking the Sabbath".

Here Soyeong, read the following two quotations.

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

Matthew 5:28
But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Obviously, Jesus is not talking about the literal reading of Exodus 20.

Please explain.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

One God, one Gospel, one Truth...and One rest (Sabbath Rest)
The rest in which God enter into on the 7th day, and we (man) will enter into on "today"...

I think you see the Sabbath Rest as a physical Rest where you sleep, sitting doing nothing, worship, eating etc...every 7th day.

I see the Sabbath Rest as a "spiritual" rest...rest of the soul from sin and all kinds of wickedness that put us to death from God's wrath, once you free from sin you will then find rest for your soul..

So I think we interpret or understand "Sabbath Rest" differently..

You’re repeating yourself and without making your argument though scripture. Yes, I interpret it the way God wrote so clearly which never says ”today” but says the seventh day. You’re free to believe what you want, but this is a commandment of God, so I think getting it right instead of doing what fits ones lifestyle would be important.

Psalm 40:8 I delight to do Your will, O my God, And Your law is within my heart.”

We will have to agree to disagree.

 

[klutedavid]

To me, one of the strongest arguments, not just for the Sabbath, but for the entire law, is Matthew 5:17--"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law." {NIV}

To make it even clearer and stronger, in my mind at least, Jesus then basically repeated Himself--"I have not come to abolish [it].

Unfortunately... because He then finishes that second statement with the declaration--"I have come to fulfill them," most Christians interpret that to be ultimately saying--HE DID COME TO ABOLISH THE LAW.

To me, that's a horrible twisting of Christ's words.

How can he twice say He had not come to abolish the law, and then abolish the law?

When He said He came to "fulfill" them, He was saying He came to obey them.

"I have kept my Father's commandments." {John 15:10}

P.S.--He then went on to say: Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.” {vs 19}

(These words weren't even written and published till long after His death. They make absolutely no sense at all if Christ abolished the law at His death.)

One interpretation states that Jesus was talking about the new commandments, which fulfill the ten commandments anyway.

1 John 3:23-24
This is His commandment, that we believe in the name of His Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, just as He commanded us. The one who keeps His commandments abides in Him, and He in him. We know by this that He abides in us, by the Spirit whom He has given us.

Another interpretation states it is the ten commandments (moral law) plus 1 John 3:23-24.

Yet another interpretation lists the moral law, which is the nine commandments plus 1 John 3:23-4. The sabbath is not a moral commandment hence, the sabbath is excluded.

Yet another interpretation sees the law in a spiritual way, see Matthew 5, hence the literal reading is misleading. For example below.

1 Timothy 5:18
For the Scripture says, “You shall not muzzle the ox while he is threshing,” and “The laborer is worthy of his wages.”

Paul uses the Old Testament frequently but often not in a literal way.

The interpretations shown are some of the interpretations that I have seen.

 

[klutedavid]

Are you saying there are two God’s now, two gospels, two truths? Israel has always been synonymous for “God’s people”. We are one if we are in Christ. Gal 3:28

Which Israel are you referring too?

The descendants of Abraham, i.e. genetic descendants or the spiritual descendants of the seed of Abraham?

The promises given to Abraham, i.e. seed, land, and blessing. Are usually understood in a spiritual way.

The seed of Abraham became the Christ.

The land of milk and honey was really the land above.

The blessing was ultimately the reconciliation we have in Christ.

The Old Testament is overflowing with symbols, types, and rarely the literal interpretation.

 

[Soyeong]

You may have made a mistake in your post Soyeong?

You seem to be quoting from Exodus 20, "adultery, idolatry, theft, murder, breaking the Sabbath".

Here Soyeong, read the following two quotations.

Matthew 5:22
But I say to you that everyone who is angry with his brother shall be guilty before the court; and whoever says to his brother, ‘You good-for-nothing,’ shall be guilty before the supreme court; and whoever says, ‘You fool,’ shall be guilty enough to go into the fiery hell.

Matthew 5:28
But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lust for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Obviously, Jesus is not talking about the literal reading of Exodus 20.

Please explain.

Sorry, it's not clear to me what you think my mistake was. I referenced a few commandments as examples of what we will do if we love God and our neighbor, but the same is true for the other commandments that God has given, not just the ones given in Exodus 20. In Matthew 19:17, we are told not to hate our brother, so Matthew 5:22 is in accordance with the OT. Likewise, the commandment not to look at a woman with lust in our hearts is just the correct application of the 7th and 10th Commandments against adultery and against coveting in our hearts. So everything that Jesus taught in Matthew 5 and everything else that he taught for that matter was rooted in the OT.

 

[honestal]

One interpretation states that Jesus was talking about the new commandments, which fulfill the ten commandments anyway... Another interpretation states it is the ten commandments (moral law)... Yet another interpretation sees the law in a spiritual way, see Matthew 5, hence the literal reading is misleading... The interpretations shown are some of the interpretations that I have seen.

Hi klutedavid (nice to meet you),

I believe the passage itself gives us the answer as to which "law" Jesus was referring to.

In verses 17-19 He said, "I have not come to abolish the law... Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (vs. 19)

After saying that, He then made it unmistakably clear as to what "law" and what "commandments" He was referring to by bringing up the sixth and seventh commandments: "Thou shalt not murder" (vs. 21) & "Thou shalt not commit adultery." (vs. 27)

(In the doing of that He explained those two commandments more clearly and deeply than the Jews commonly understood and applied them.)

 

[klutedavid]

Hi klutedavid (nice to meet you),

I believe the passage itself gives us the answer as to which "law" Jesus was referring to.

In verses 17-19 He said, "I have not come to abolish the law... Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (vs. 19)

After saying that, He then made it unmistakably clear as to what "law" and what "commandments" He was referring to by bringing up the sixth and seventh commandments: "Thou shalt not murder" (vs. 21) & "Thou shalt not commit adultery." (vs. 27)

(In the doing of that He explained those two commandments more clearly and deeply than the Jews commonly understood and applied them.)

So are you saying that the simple, literal reading of the law is incorrect. That there is a much deeper instruction within the law below the literal reading?

Perhaps a spiritual interpretation of the law?

You shall not muzzle the oxen while it is threshing. Is definitely not a literal law according to Paul. You shall not muzzle the evangelist or the minister is the correct interpretation. Not muzzling the oxen is not one of the ten commandments, but Paul is applying this verse to the Corinthians.

So how do you read the Old Testament?

 

[honestal]

So are you saying that the simple, literal reading of the law is incorrect. That there is a much deeper instruction within the law below the literal reading?

Perhaps a spiritual interpretation of the law?

You shall not muzzle the oxen while it is threshing. Is definitely not a literal law according to Paul. You shall not muzzle the evangelist or the minister is the correct interpretation. Not muzzling the oxen is not one of the ten commandments, but Paul is applying this verse to the Corinthians.

So how do you read the Old Testament?

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying and what you're asking... but Jesus in Matthew 5 gave a clearer and deeper explanation and understanding of the sixth and seventh commandments.

Yes, it most certainly means what it says--"thou shalt not commit adultery." But Jesus went farther and said to even look on a woman with lust was a violation of the seventh commandment--"hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. (vs. 28)

As for "how I read the Old Testament"--I'll quote something from both Martin Luther and John Wesley:

“23. How many kinds of laws did God give in the Old Testament? Three kinds: The ceremonial church law; The civil law; The moral law. 24. Which of these laws is still in force? The moral law, which is contained in the Ten Commandments.” {Explanation of Martin Luther’s Small Catechism, pgs. 6, 7}

“The moral law contained in the Ten Commandments, and enforced by the prophets, He [Christ] did not take away… The moral law stands on an entirely different foundation from the ceremonial or ritual law.” {John Wesley, “On the Sermon of the Mount,” Discourse 6, pgs. 75, 76}

As for your understanding that the Sabbath is not a moral law.

All I know is that God Himself chose to make it a part of the moral law.

And Jesus Himself, after saying, twice, that He had not come to abolish the law, then added:

"Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments shall be called least (worst) in the kingdom of heaven, and whosoever keeps them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (vs. 19)

 

[HIM]

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying and what you're asking... but Jesus in Matthew 5 gave a clearer and deeper explanation and understanding of the sixth and seventh commandments.

Yes, it most certainly means what it says--"thou shalt not commit adultery." But Jesus went farther and said to even look on a woman with lust was a violation of the seventh commandment--"hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. (vs. 28)

As for "how I read the Old Testament"--I'll quote something from both Martin Luther and John Wesley:

“23. How many kinds of laws did God give in the Old Testament? Three kinds: The ceremonial church law; The civil law; The moral law. 24. Which of these laws is still in force? The moral law, which is contained in the Ten Commandments.” {Explanation of Martin Luther’s Small Catechism, pgs. 6, 7}

“The moral law contained in the Ten Commandments, and enforced by the prophets, He [Christ] did not take away… The moral law stands on an entirely different foundation from the ceremonial or ritual law.” {John Wesley, “On the Sermon of the Mount,” Discourse 6, pgs. 75, 76}

As for your understanding that the Sabbath is not a moral law.

All I know is that God Himself chose to make it a part of the moral law.

And Jesus Himself, after saying, twice, that He had not come to abolish the law, then added:

"Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments shall be called least (worst) in the kingdom of heaven, and whosoever keeps them shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (vs. 19)

What is the result of being called least, small (worst) in the Kingdom of Heaven?
They won't be called at all because they won't be there.

Matt 5:20 For I say unto you, That except your righteousness shall exceed the righteousness of the scribes and Pharisees, ye shall in no case enter into the kingdom of heaven.

 

[Bob S]

Hi klutedavid (nice to meet you),

I believe the passage itself gives us the answer as to which "law" Jesus was referring to.

In verses 17-19 He said, "I have not come to abolish the law... Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven: but whosoever shall do and teach them, the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven." (vs. 19)

After saying that, He then made it unmistakably clear as to what "law" and what "commandments" He was referring to by bringing up the sixth and seventh commandments: "Thou shalt not murder" (vs. 21) & "Thou shalt not commit adultery." (vs. 27)

(In the doing of that He explained those two commandments more clearly and deeply than the Jews commonly understood and applied them.)

I am wondering how you can derive that Jesus was referring to the 10 commandments when He also mentioned commands from the oral laws such as an eye for an eye, divorce, oaths and love enemies?

Seems to me that He came to fulfill all the law, if not then we are missing the boat by not keeping all of the 613 rules Israel was to live under.

 

[Bob S]

Of course Jesus didn't "abolish" the Law. Israel had already accomplished this act over and over again. They broke the covenant, they are responsible for abolishing those laws. A covenant is only as good as both parties living up to the requirements of said covenant. The covenant given at Sinai was a true "if" covenant. If you do I will.........