One man, three wives

[EmmaCat]

Of course polygamy is wrong. Perhaps it can be glorified over movies and tv shows, yet it is wrong. I know of these things and choose NOT to see these or involve myself of these.

It is best not to entertain oneself of these issues, and best to look at good tv shows and movies which are uplifting and show the love of God.

All good things
Emmy

 

[Dave-W]

Why would you assume it holds a sexual meaning? There’s also a passage about taking care of widows...that doesn’t mean having sex with them.

It’s funny in a sad kind of way how people misinterpret the Bible for their own agenda.

I have no "agenda." I dislike the concept of polygamy.

But I have to go with what the Bible says and how it would have been understood by the original audience. How " I also gave you your master’s house and your master’s wives" would have been understood meant that they were now his wives. And if you go to the section on levirite marriage, if the surviving brother was already married, taking on a 2nd wife was COMMANDED.

Deuteronomy 25:5
“When brothers live together and one of them dies and has no son, the wife of the deceased shall not be married outside the family to a strange man. Her husband’s brother shall go in to her and take her to himself as wife and perform the duty of a husband’s brother to her.​

So even if I don't like it, it is there in the Bible. And I have to agree with the Bible.

 

[Dave-W]

That’s because God knows one wife putting up with the sexual demands of three husbands would mean she literally never gets anything done ever.

That is so backward to the understanding of the first century Jews.

Women were (still are in traditional Judaism) considered to have the higher drive. First century marriage contracts spelled out the MINIMUM amount of sexual satisfaction a wife should expect from her husband. In cases where his job was not too physically strenuous or involved travel, it was DAILY. There are also extant records of court proceedings where wives sued their husbands for not living up to the contract. In many cases it was to order him to change jobs so he could take care of her more frequently.

 

[Poppyseed78]

On a lighter note, who has the energy for more than one wife? I'm annoying enough, I don't think my husband needs more than one of me.

 

[Deidre32]

I have no "agenda." I dislike the concept of polygamy.

But I have to go with what the Bible says and how it would have been understood by the original audience. How " I also gave you your master’s house and your master’s wives" would have been understood meant that they were now his wives. And if you go to the section on levirite marriage, if the surviving brother was already married, taking on a 2nd wife was COMMANDED.

Deuteronomy 25:5
“When brothers live together and one of them dies and has no son, the wife of the deceased shall not be married outside the family to a strange man. Her husband’s brother shall go in to her and take her to himself as wife and perform the duty of a husband’s brother to her.​

So even if I don't like it, it is there in the Bible. And I have to agree with the Bible.

Perform the duty of a husband’s brother to her means she might have a title of wife, but God isn’t commanding him to sleep with more than one woman. That would be adultery and God doesn’t ordain sin. Sounds like God is telling him to take care of her.

 

[Dave-W]

Perform the duty of a husband’s brother to her means she might have a title of wife, but God isn’t commanding him to sleep with more than one woman.

Try on the next verse for size:

6 It shall be that the firstborn whom she bears shall assume the name of his dead brother, so that his name will not be blotted out from Israel.

You don't have a "first born" with out sleeping together.

You seem to be grasping at straws to find a way to make the text NOT support polygamy.

BTW: Ex 21.10 was taken to mean that no matter how many wives a man took, he had to keep them all sexually satisfied:

Exodus 21:10
If he takes to himself another woman, he may not reduce her food, her clothing, or her conjugal rights.​

And that was talking about a slave wife, not a free wife. The ancient sages reasoned this way: If God is that concerned with the libido of a slave woman, how much more a free wife? The word translated "conjugal rights" in the NASB is onah, and this is the only place it appears in the Hebrew biblical text. In modern usage it means sexual desire. And that is what the ancients believed it meant as well.

 

[Dave-W]

That would be adultery and God doesn’t ordain sin.

It may be adultery in our modern definition; but that is NOT how the original Hebrew language usage defined it.

A man and woman having sex where she is married to someone else.

 

[Deidre32]

It may be adultery in our modern definition; but that is NOT how the original Hebrew language usage defined it.

A man and woman having sex where she is married to someone else.

As Christians, we don’t live by ancient Jewish law since the new covenant with Christ.

I look at the OT stories as part of the bigger picture, not the entire picture. It’s just a story that leads to our Savior. Different times and a different culture, all trying to know and relate to God. But Jesus’ coming gives us a new life.

 

[Dave-W]

As Christians, we don’t live by ancient Jewish law since the new covenant with Christ.

That is another topic for another thread and folder.

But there is nothing in the New Testament that re-defines "adultery;" and there is no prohibition in the NT against polygamy EXCEPT for congregational leadership.

As much as we may not like that fact, (I certainly don't ) if we are to be true to the scriptures, then that is the way it is.

 

[Deidre32]

That is another topic for another thread and folder.

But there is nothing in the New Testament that re-defines "adultery;" and there is no prohibition in the NT against polygamy EXCEPT for congregational leadership.

As much as we may not like that fact, (I certainly don't ) if we are to be true to the scriptures, then that is the way it is.

You believe we should all be in polygamist relationships?

And Jesus IS the topic. He’s not a topic for another time.

 

[Dave-W]

I look at the OT stories as part of the bigger picture, not the entire picture. It’s just a story that leads to our Savior. Different times and a different culture, all trying to know and relate to God. But Jesus’ coming gives us a new life.

I would suggest that you read a book called "Torah Rediscovered" by Ariel Berkowitz. While I do not agree with his conclusions, his work on how covenants are renewed or replaced in the ancient world is excellent. It was NEVER a "start from scratch" method. In short - anything from the Oold not specifically deleted, altered or emphasized in the New gets carried over as-is.

 

[Deidre32]

I would suggest that you read a book called "Torah Rediscovered" by Ariel Berkowitz. While I do not agree with his conclusions, his work on how covenants are renewed or replaced in the ancient world is excellent. It was NEVER a "start from scratch" method. In short - anything from the Oold not specifically deleted, altered or emphasized in the New gets carried over as-is.

God always directs his people back to his original design. He created one man to be with one woman, in marriage. The fact that cultures did their own thing and God permitted it, doesn’t change that God always redirects us to the original design he had for us. Also, polygamy in the Bible and history led to many sociological problems and issues thus it shows what happens when we separate ourselves from God’s original design. I’m not Jewish. The Bible is enough.

 

[Dave-W]

You believe we should all be in polygamist relationships?

Not at all. While that was allowed, and in rare cases commanded, it was clearly NOT God's original intent.

In our modern western world, it is illegal. We are COMMANDED to follow the laws of the land insofar as they do not prevent us from obeying Christ. So from that point - it is disallowed. Polygamy is NEVER commanded except for a case where a Jew is in the Land of Israel and his brother dies childless. And that is for the purpose of land inheritance.

 

[Dave-W]

The fact that cultures did their own thing and God permitted it, doesn’t change that God always redirects us to the original design he had for us.

Be careful of that. Remember, ancient Jewish culture was shaped and formed by the Law and Prophets of Israel. It was unlike any other culture before or after.

Paul wrote this about the OT and what happened to the ancient Jews:

1 Corinthians 10:11
Now these things happened to them as an example, and they were written for our instruction, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.​

That includes their culture as well. We do not co-opt it for ourselves but we can glean a LOT from it.

 

[Deidre32]

Be careful of that. Remember, ancient Jewish culture was shaped and formed by the Law and Prophets of Israel. It was unlike any other culture before or after.

I know, and I like what you said above in the previous post. Well stated and that makes sense.

At first I thought you secretly desired to be a polygamist lol I mean, to each their own but...

 

[Dave-W]

At first I thought you secretly desired to be a polygamist lol I mean, to each their own but...

Don't take this the wrong way, and i loved my Mother in Law, (we got along great) ... but ...

TWO (or more) Mother in laws???????

 

[Deidre32]

Don't take this the wrong way, and i loved my Mother in Law, (we got along great)

TWO (or more) Mother in laws???????

Interestingly the show I’ve mentioned shows really unhappy women. Women that are neglected by their husband for the “betterment of the kingdom of God.” Lol

There’s never a shortage of charlatans out there who find women to believe their nonsense.

 

[Dave-W]

Interestingly the show I’ve mentioned shows really unhappy women. Women that are neglected by their husband for the “betterment of the kingdom of God.” Lol

And that is the EXACT OPPOSITE of what was portrayed in the Bible and in ancient Jewish culture.

 

[Deidre32]

And that is the EXACT OPPOSITE of what was portrayed in the Bible and in ancient Jewish culture.

Exactly. I get the reasons from a Biblical perspective. But in this show, it’s a gross display of male narcissism.

 

[Dave-W]

But in this show, it’s a gross display of male narcissism.

Oy. I hate that.