Of course you know about the religious right...

[Hazelelponi]

You'd have to ask someone who feels they need those changes.

How can you say they don't need the changes if you're not them?

-- A2SG, remember Horatio...

I notice your avoiding the main of my point completely.

 

[Nithavela]

You're taking the rarest of mental health exceptions, we are talking really rare exceptions, taken those exceptions into the public sphere and are wanting to tell little kids in kindergarten - not that they can have any career they choose when they grow up and encourage thinking towards adulthood nooo... They want to teach them they can be any gender?

Really? No... Just no.

That's stupid quackery... And far more dangerous to kids than snake oil.

Telling children that they can have any career they want seems less realistic than telling them that they can be any gender.

 

[A2SG]

I notice your avoiding the main of my point completely.

That being...?

-- A2SG, though, I hope you got my point...

 

[BCP1928]

I notice your avoiding the main of my point completely.

Your main point was vacuous.

 

[QvQ]

Vanity of Vanities!
"I want to look pretty" Nose Jobs
"I want to look young " Face Lifts
"I want to look like a different skin color" Tattoo
"I want to look like Marilyn Monroe" Gender surgery
" I want to look like a Hunky Guy" Gender surgery

It is Cosmetic Surgery
All about "looking" not about being.
What you "be" is what you Is.

 

[Bradskii]

What was John Wayne's gender? What was Paul Lynde's gender?

They were biologically male. Now are the terms effeminate and macho familiar to you?

 

[Bradskii]

View attachment 342817

Why did you post that picture?

 

[ozso]

They were biologically male. Now are the terms effeminate and macho familiar to you?

Yeah they're personality traits.

 

[ozso]

Why did you post that picture?

Because someone who doesn't know anything about the Duke, might easily say the guy in the picture looks effeminate.

 

[Bradskii]

Because someone who doesn't know anything about the Duke, might easily say the guy in the picture looks effeminate.

He looks effeminate to you? But that wasn't his personality. You think that there was a contradiction between how he appeared in that photo and his biological sex? You think he was exhibiting 'feminine qualities untypical of a man'?

You think that wearing shorts like that makes you less masculine? How about a frilly shirt? Heels. Silk scarf. Makeup. Are those indications of someone who is macho or effeminate? One of my children wears them. The other doesn't. Do you think you could tell their biological sex using to that information?

Nah, of course you can't. But you could tell which one was more masculine and which was more feminine.

 

[BCP1928]

Yeah they're personality traits.

What about yours? Did you choose them? Or did they develop naturally?

 

[ozso]

He looks effeminate to you?

That picture is widely circulated because it doesn't fit his on screen image.

But that wasn't his personality.

So gender is just another word for personality.

You think that there was a contradiction between how he appeared in that photo and his biological sex?

Nope.

You think he was exhibiting 'feminine qualities untypical of a man'?

Nope.

You think that wearing shorts like that makes you less masculine?

It looks less masculine than the apex of masculinity you're using him as an example of.

How about a frilly shirt? Heels. Silk scarf. Makeup. Are those indications of someone who is macho or effeminate?

They're indications of a man pretending to be a woman (if you're talking about a man in wearing women's clothing and make up)

One of my children wears them. The other doesn't. Do you think you could tell their biological sex using to that information?

A man disguising himself as a woman is just that; a disguise.

Nah, of course you can't. But you could tell which one was more masculine and which was more feminine.

Those are personality traits. You're basically arguing the whole way that gender is being used as another word for personality.

 

[ozso]

What about yours? Did you choose them? Or did they develop naturally?

A little bit of both. But are you also saying "gender" means "personality"?

 

[Bradskii]

Those are personality traits. You're basically arguing the whole way that gender is being used as another word for personality.

So if someone feels comfortable wearing frilly shirts and silk scarves and makeup then do you think that person's personality aligns with what you consider to be male or female?

 

[BCP1928]

A little bit of both. But are you also saying "gender" means "personality"?

Personality is certainly part of gender. There is a range of personality types, some of them more often associated with biological females, some more with biological males. But not always.

 

[ozso]

So if someone feels comfortable wearing frilly shirts and silk scarves and makeup then do you think that person's personality aligns with what you consider to be male or female?

I'm a little lost here. It seems you're saying gender is defined by personality and taste in clothing.

This is Macho Man Randy Savage:

 

[Bradskii]

I'm a little lost here. It seems you're saying gender is defined by personality and taste in clothing.

You do seem a little lost. I'm just describing certain preferences and personality traits that people have. That are often associated with either males or females. Quite often they align with the sex of the person who exhibits them. Sometimes not.

So if the Duke, for example, was found to enjoy wearing frilly dresses and silk scarves and makeup in the privacy of his own home, then I wouldn't have a problem with it. Would that be a problem for you? Would it be feminine or masculine behaviour as you see it?

 

[ozso]

You do seem a little lost. I'm just describing certain preferences and personality traits that people have. That are often associated with either males or females. Quite often they align with the sex of the person who exhibits them. Sometimes not.

So if the Duke, for example, was found to enjoy wearing frilly dresses and silk scarves and makeup in the privacy of his own home, then I wouldn't have a problem with it. Would that be a problem for you? Would it be feminine or masculine behaviour as you see it?

Going by what you're saying the word "gender" is just another way of saying "style" and "personality".

 

[Bradskii]

Going by what you're saying the word "gender" is just another way of saying "style" and "personality".

'Just' another way? No. Don't jump to conclusions. I'll ask the question again:

So if the Duke, for example, was found to enjoy wearing frilly dresses and silk scarves and makeup in the privacy of his own home, then I wouldn't have a problem with it. Would that be a problem for you? Would it be feminine or masculine behaviour as you see it?

 

[ozso]

Personality is certainly part of gender. There is a range of personality types, some of them more often associated with biological females, some more with biological males. But not always.

So is it being said that a person who doesn't dress and or act like a typical male isn't a male?