Ok, I'm sorry. I was upset and frustrated at your statements, which I frankly strongly disagree with and find to be VERY inaccurate and untrue. No, I don't plan on elaborating, because I'm not an expert and debating people.
No need for you to elaborate -- and your apology is accepted, appreciated, and reciprocated.
Now that we've both cooled off....
It's just that:
1. I don't want Christianity's history to be painted as "this stupid thing we once believed in, thank goodness we don't take it seriously now". That's too broad and generalizing.
And I've certainly never tried to paint it as such, and I apologize to anyone who got the mistaken impression that I did. Christianity, like any religious faith, can be a productive and uplifting societal tool, but it can be misused -- particularly for social and political power.
Christianity has been misused as such in the past; I believe Islam is currently being misused as such in the Middle East.
Christianity is, according to its followers, a personal relationship with God -- key word:
personal. It is its own reward, and should not be used as a means to an Earthly end. Most Christians realize that, I think -- a few forget, or worse, ignore it. Like any shameful part of history, it must be acknowledged and remembered so that it is not repeated.
In time, Islam will, I believe and hope soon, be in a similar situation... at the moment, however, there are too many people using it as a means to their own selfish ends. (You'll notice that for all their talk of martyrdom, you never see the terrorist leaders blowing
themselves up, do you?)
2. I don't want to have to feel guilty about what other people who claimed to be Christians did in the past.
I don't want to feel guilty about the Trail of Tears, the internment of the Japanese during WWII, McCarthyism, or the abuses at Abu Ghraib and GITMO. And I don't; why should I? I didn't do it...
But as an American and a human being with a conscience, I want to remember these incidents and see to it they don't happen again. Also, while I am not responsible for the atrocities of the past, I know that I am, at least in my own small part, responsible to do my best to prevent similar atrocities in the future.
Were they genuine Christians or not, only God knows, and to you secular people there's no difference.
God only knows if
anyone -- yourself and myself included --are genuine Christians. You say you are; they say they are -- and at least on this forum, I cannot argue against anyone making such a claim.
And most Christians can't tell them apart, either, and it just leads to that stupid Scotsman's fallacy, so if you're going to use it to tell me that a "true Christian" is purely subjective, please don't. I'm not in the mood, and I have my own ideas of what a true Christian is. It's just not very defined right now (and it's not like some specific doctrinal things, like you're not a Christian if you don't believe X, Y and Z).
And herein lies the problem. There's no practical difference between a "true" Christian and a practicing or professed Christian. We're dealing with people who are sincere in their beliefs and are acting on them -- that's the unfortunate reality of the past and the present. So even if you were willing to explain the difference, doing so to
me would make no difference... you'd have to explain it to
them, and I sincerely doubt your proclamation of "you're doing it wrong," will have any impact whatsoever on their behavior.
My point is, I'm sorry I put words in your mouth and let myself think that I just had to say something. I've sinned by letting myself get so pointlessly worked up and deliberately allowing myself to fill my brain with hatred. I apologize.
Apology accepted -- and I apologize for not being clearer; Jesus never gave any orders to kill, oppress, enslave, or subjugate others, but that hasn't stopped people, and indeed entire institutions, from doing so in his name.
He is blameless; His followers (and I mean those who actually committed these acts), not so much.
I just don't like people insulting my faith and saying that Christianity's past is entirely filled with atrocities.
And I don't blame you -- neither I nor Obama said "entirely," however.
Personally, I say
any atrocities are too many, and to say that there have been
some atrocities committed in the name of Christianity is not an insult, but a historical fact.
I used to feel very guilty about that and wondered how on Earth Christians would be able to mend all of this stuff. Frankly I love my faith and don't want it to be "phased out" by secularism or Islam or anything else.
That would be impossible -- it's
your faith. Neither secularism nor Islam can crawl inside your mind and sever the relationship with Christ you believe you have.
It might happen -- maybe in 50 years, maybe in 500 years, maybe never -- that your faith will no longer be the most popular one on the planet, but so what? You don't need your faith to be popular in order for you to keep loving it, right?
Besides, these things tend to happen in cycles.... witness Iceland:
Iceland to build first temple to Norse gods since Viking age | World news | The Guardian
I really don't see why I can't just believe in what I do in peace.
I don't see why not, either. My remarks didn't shake your faith in any way, shape, or form, and had you said nothing, you would've remained unaffected.
My beliefs aren't harming anyone, and neither is me airing them. Remarks like yours just trigger me too much, and quite honestly I think you're grossly inaccurate.
And you are, as always, free to believe as you wish, regardless of what others think.
...as am I.