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Noah's Flood

toolmanjantzi

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Split Rock said:
I think its kind of funny that you actually think you understand what shapes the geological column better than geologists do. So, geologists don't understand that floods erode rocks, huh? Hilarious! ^_^

You should see the hole in the rock, the road, the car the tree that the flood created when it rained really hard the other day.

I find it very odd that your world always involves floods that erode rocks. It's amazing that your own bathtub doesn't erode away with ever shower you might take.

The Grand Canyon must be the product of a flood.

When New Orleans was flooded, did Geologist run to see the holes in the rock there?
 
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toolmanjantzi

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Split Rock

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You should see the hole in the rock, the road, the car the tree that the flood created when it rained really hard the other day.

I find it very odd that your world always involves floods that erode rocks. It's amazing that your own bathtub doesn't erode away with ever shower you might take.

The Grand Canyon must be the product of a flood.

When New Orleans was flooded, did Geologist run to see the holes in the rock there?

Are you playing some weird Devil's Advocate game?

Yes, water can erode rocks. In fact, Niagra Falls will eventually erode itself away (right now it is slowly eroded the rocks underneath it and is moving backward). That doesn't mean that the flood could have created the Grand Canyon. Oh, and btw, a rain shower isn't a flood (I can't believe I need to explain that).

Nothing to say about how I exposed all the stories you made up in your previous post?
 
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toolmanjantzi

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Split Rock said:
Are you playing some weird Devil's Advocate game?

Yes, water can erode rocks. In fact, Niagra Falls will eventually erode itself away (right now it is slowly eroded the rocks underneath it and is moving backward). That doesn't mean that the flood could have created the Grand Canyon. Oh, and btw, a rain shower isn't a flood (I can't believe I need to explain that).

Nothing to say about how I exposed all the stories you made up in your previous post?

My story was for Avet. Because now that its all dealt with we can move onto new truths.

I believe your smart enough to not assume every flood will erode the rock.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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I think its kind of funny that you actually think you understand what shapes the geological column better than geologists do. So, geologists don't understand that floods erode rocks, huh? Hilarious! ^_^

I didn't say that. I made a true statement about floods.

Where are these 'source' areas? They must be clearly identifiable.

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia


Sedimentary rocks are types of rock that are formed by the deposition of material at the Earth's surface and within bodies of water. Sedimentation is the collective name for processes that cause mineral and/or organic particles (detritus) to settle and accumulate or minerals to precipitate from a solution. Particles that form a sedimentary rock by accumulating are called sediment. Before being deposited, sediment was formed by weathering and erosion in a source area, and then transported to the place of deposition by water, wind, ice, mass movement or glaciers which are called agents of denudation.
 
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Split Rock

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My story was for Avet. Because now that its all dealt with we can move onto new truths.

I believe your smart enough to not assume every flood will erode the rock.

What "truths?" More stories you made up from whole cloth? More history revisionism?
 
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essentialsaltes

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What is the origin of the sedimentary layers?

Millions of years of deposition.

In parts of the canyon, there are discontinuities in the layers where the angle of the layers changes, or where volcanic rock intrudes into them. These and other evidences show that these layers did not form 'quickly'.
 
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OldWiseGuy

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Millions of years of deposition.

In parts of the canyon, there are discontinuities in the layers where the angle of the layers changes, or where volcanic rock intrudes into them. These and other evidences show that these layers did not form 'quickly'.

How is it that there is millions of years of deposition of one type of material, followed by millions of years of a different type of material. Where did these materials come from, what 'source'? And why the sudden change in materials?
 
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essentialsaltes

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How is it that there is millions of years of deposition of one type of material, followed by millions of years of a different type of material. Where did these materials come from, what 'source'? And why the sudden change in materials?

Over millions of years, the situation changes. The land rises and falls. Growing mountains make layers tilt. The seas come in and the seas go out. This leads to different sources for the material in the sediments. Silt on a river bottom looks different from sand on a beach. I noted already that volcanic layers in testify to volcanic eruptions at particular times. I'm not a geologist, but the Wikipedia page on the Geology of the Grand Canyon has a huge amount of information about all the specific layers. Just a random sample:

Metamorphic and igneous basement

ash, mud, sand, and silt were laid down in a shallow marine basin adjacent to an orogenic belt

Grand Canyon Supergroup
The oldest section of the supergroup is the Unkar Group. It accumulated in a variety of fluvial, deltaic, tidal, nearshore marine, and offshore marine environments
the Cardenas Basalt is the youngest formation in the Unkar Group.[16] It is made of layers of dark brown basaltic rocks that flowed as lava up to 1,000 feet (300 m) thick

Tapeats Sandstone averages 525 million years old and is made of medium- to coarse-grained sand and conglomerate that was deposited on an ancient shore

Redwall is composed of thick-bedded, dark brown to bluish gray limestone and dolomite with white chert nodules mixed in.[32] It was laid down in a retreating shallow tropical sea near the equator

Supai Group formations in the western part of the canyon contain limestone, indicative of a warm, shallow sea, while the eastern part was likely a muddy river delta

Coconino Sandstone formed about 275 million years ago as the area dried out and sand dunes made of quartz sand invaded a growing desert

Different situations produced different kinds of rock.
 
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Split Rock

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How is it that there is millions of years of deposition of one type of material, followed by millions of years of a different type of material. Where did these materials come from, what 'source'? And why the sudden change in materials?

What are the materials? Soil, rock, sand, mud, etc. Where did they come from? Rivers, streams, swamps, erosion, etc. Why the "sudden" changes? In most cases, they were not "sudden."

For example, take the Williston basin in North Dakota. The Williston basin has been sinking, on and of, for about 600 million years. This has allowed run off from rivers, glacial melt, chalk from sea life, etc. to accumulate over time. At one point, it was the floor of an inland sea, at another it was part of a river system, at another it was swamp, at another it was prairie. The evidence is the rocks and fossils found in the rocks:
AAPG Datapages/Archives: Spatial variation of Bakken or Lodgepole oils in the Canadian Williston Basin
http://explorationgeology.com/public_html/Images/WY Strat Nomenclture web.jpg
http://web.mnstate.edu/colson/est/est2b4.html
 
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OldWiseGuy

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What are the materials? Soil, rock, sand, mud, etc. Where did they come from? Rivers, streams, swamps, erosion, etc. Why the "sudden" changes? In most cases, they were not "sudden."

For example, take the Williston basin in North Dakota. The Williston basin has been sinking, on and of, for about 600 million years. This has allowed run off from rivers, glacial melt, chalk from sea life, etc. to accumulate over time. At one point, it was the floor of an inland sea, at another it was part of a river system, at another it was swamp, at another it was prairie. The evidence is the rocks and fossils found in the rocks:
AAPG Datapages/Archives: Spatial variation of Bakken or Lodgepole oils in the Canadian Williston Basin
http://explorationgeology.com/public_html/Images/WY Strat Nomenclture web.jpg
Earth Science Today

Based on the sheer amount of organic matter and calciferous material (shells of organisms) in the geologic column there must have been a huge amount of 'life' on earth from the beginning. How does this square with evolution?
 
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Split Rock

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Based on the sheer amount of organic matter and calciferous material (shells of organisms) in the geologic column there must have been a huge amount of 'life' on earth from the beginning. How does this square with evolution?

There has been a lot of life on earth since 3 billion years ago, yes. In the case of algae producing chalk, there was millions of years of them. Are you suggesting that a global flood could produce more chalk in one year??
 
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toolmanjantzi

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essentialsaltes said:
Over millions of years, the situation changes. The land rises and falls. Growing mountains make layers tilt. The seas come in and the seas go out. This leads to different sources for the material in the sediments. Silt on a river bottom looks different from sand on a beach. I noted already that volcanic layers in testify to volcanic eruptions at particular times. I'm not a geologist, but the Wikipedia page on the Geology of the Grand Canyon has a huge amount of information about all the specific layers. Just a random sample:

Metamorphic and igneous basement

ash, mud, sand, and silt were laid down in a shallow marine basin adjacent to an orogenic belt

Grand Canyon Supergroup
The oldest section of the supergroup is the Unkar Group. It accumulated in a variety of fluvial, deltaic, tidal, nearshore marine, and offshore marine environments
the Cardenas Basalt is the youngest formation in the Unkar Group.[16] It is made of layers of dark brown basaltic rocks that flowed as lava up to 1,000 feet (300 m) thick

Tapeats Sandstone averages 525 million years old and is made of medium- to coarse-grained sand and conglomerate that was deposited on an ancient shore

Redwall is composed of thick-bedded, dark brown to bluish gray limestone and dolomite with white chert nodules mixed in.[32] It was laid down in a retreating shallow tropical sea near the equator

Supai Group formations in the western part of the canyon contain limestone, indicative of a warm, shallow sea, while the eastern part was likely a muddy river delta

Coconino Sandstone formed about 275 million years ago as the area dried out and sand dunes made of quartz sand invaded a growing desert

Different situations produced different kinds of rock.

At what rate is Mount Everest growing? Please tell me which mountain is the youngest know mountain to grow.
 
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essentialsaltes

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At what rate is Mount Everest growing?

I've seen various estimates from 4mm to a couple cm per year. The USGS notes that the Himalayas "rise more than 1 cm a year".

Please tell me which mountain is the youngest know mountain to grow.

I don't knnow.
 
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AV1611VET

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I've seen various estimates from 4mm to a couple cm per year.
Why don't all the mountains in a mountain chain grow at the same rate?

If these mountains are growing because they are being pushed up by tectonic plates, it seems to me that all the mountains on the same plate should grow at the same rate.
 
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toolmanjantzi

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AV1611VET said:
Why don't all the mountains in a mountain chain grow at the same rate?

If these mountains are growing because they are being pushed up by tectonic plates, it seems to me that all the mountains on the same plate should grow at the same rate.

They are on separate plates. Don't you know how evolution works.
 
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essentialsaltes

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Why don't all the mountains in a mountain chain grow at the same rate?

If these mountains are growing because they are being pushed up by tectonic plates, it seems to me that all the mountains on the same plate should grow at the same rate.

If the Indian subcontinent hit Asia at an angle, rather than perfectly at 90 degrees, then we might expect rates to differ at one end of the Himalayas from the other.

More generally, I can't see any reason why mountain forming processes would necessarily be at exactly the same rate. Different underlying geologies, different stresses... I mean, this is like saying that when two cars crash, their hoods must buckle at exactly the same rate. Why would anyone assume such a thing?
 
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