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The verses I quoted clearly indicate that not everyone maintains “eye contact” with the Holy Spirit.
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Ah yes, of course not. How silly of me! (maintaining eye contact and slowly walking backwards)
The usual UR-ite out-of-context proof text.It looks like someone (not too far from here) doesn't know their Corinthians 12:3
Therefore I want you to understand that no one speaking by the Spirit of God ever says “Let Jesus be cursed!” and no one can say “Jesus is Lord” except by the Holy Spirit.Tut, tut
Please see my [post #63]Thank you for the replies, everyone. For me, Christian Universalism, is like a journey. It's something that everyone must walk themselves. It's similar to the journey one goes through to believe in Jesus and be saved through faith alone. That journey of, thinking and understanding. I think that's why God created this life on Earth before Heaven. Everyone has to voluntarily choose of their own free will to be saved by Jesus Christ. If someone is born and in a happy heaven paradise forever already, they might not appreciate the truth if they didn't see the other side.
2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.
1 Corinthians 13:4 Love is patient and kind
Though, of course, I wish that everyone could just attain that happiness already. But as shown with the Garden of Eden, God tried that and we rejected it by disobeying His will. But God does not give up! It was His original intention to have us in that perfect state, so He will make us into that, no matter how many times we try to disobey Him. Further, His patience and perseverance in saving us is evidence in how grateful and kind
Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned
Romans 5:15 But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!
LOLI was born into a Christian household. We were in an extremely fundamentalist legalistic church, but we escaped. ...
Surprisingly, I agree with that statement. Here's why...All of these statements contradict the idea of universal reconciliation.
Reminds me of this...Our Father ABBA has an outcome to any punishment of His wayward children. It is NOT unending torment but change & transformation.
The steadfast love of the Lord NEVER ceases!
All those things need to be true.Then everyone who says to Christ Lord Lord will enter Heaven? Matthew 7:21-23
Everyone who blasphemes the Holy Spirit will be forgiven? Luke 12:10
It would not have been better for Judas if he had never been born? Matthew 26:24
This reminds me of my rather long, and somewhat complete, explanation.Obviously!
The declarations of Yah in both testaments are a complete picture of His purposes in the Lord Jesus Christ.
Every knee bowing in union within His Name in worship.
The bible is very clear that there is eternal torment for the wicked. They will have a conscious existence in the afterlife. The Bible alone is why I reject the heretical teaching known as universalism.
Saint Steven said:
I will address each one of these out-of-context proof texts separately. Mark 9:49, Malachi 3:2 and Ezekiel 22:17-22Reminds me of this...
Mark 9:49
Everyone will be salted with fire.
Saint Steven said:
I will address each one of these out-of-context proof texts separately. Mark 9:49, Malachi 3:2 and Ezekiel 22:17-22Reminds me of this... Mal 3:2...
Saint Steven said:
Yet another out-of-context proof passage.Reminds me of this...
The Refining Furnace
Then the word of the LORD came to me, saying, 18 “Son of man, the house of Israel has become dross to Me. All of them are copper, tin, iron, and lead inside the furnace; they are but the dross of silver. 19 Therefore this is what the Lord GOD says: ‘Because all of you have become dross, behold, I will gather you into Jerusalem. 20 Just as one gathers silver, copper, iron, lead, and tin into the furnace to melt with a fiery blast, so I will gather you in My anger and wrath, leave you there, and melt you. 21 Yes, I will gather you together and blow on you with the fire of My wrath, and you will be melted within the city. 22 As silver is melted in a furnace, so you will be melted within the city. Then you will know that I, the LORD, have poured out My wrath upon you.’ ” Ezekiel 22:17-22 (Berean Study Bible).
When Paul wrote to the church at Rome do you suppose he forgot what he wrote to the churches at Corinth, Galatia and Ephesus?Thank you for the replies, everyone. For me, Christian Universalism, is like a journey. It's something that everyone must walk themselves. It's similar to the journey one goes through to believe in Jesus and be saved through faith alone. That journey of, thinking and understanding. I think that's why God created this life on Earth before Heaven. Everyone has to voluntarily choose of their own free will to be saved by Jesus Christ. If someone is born and in a happy heaven paradise forever already, they might not appreciate the truth if they didn't see the other side.
2 Peter 3:9 The Lord is not slow to fulfill his promise as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance.
1 Corinthians 13:4 Love is patient and kind
Though, of course, I wish that everyone could just attain that happiness already. But as shown with the Garden of Eden, God tried that and we rejected it by disobeying His will. But God does not give up! It was His original intention to have us in that perfect state, so He will make us into that, no matter how many times we try to disobey Him. Further, His patience and perseverance in saving us is evidence in how grateful and kind
Romans 5:12 Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all people, because all sinned
Romans 5:15 But the gift is not like the trespass. For if the many died by the trespass of the one man, how much more did God’s grace and the gift that came by the grace of the one man, Jesus Christ, overflow to the many!
Steve: If we understand what it means to be in Christ, we are on our way to knowing what the confession of every being in every dimension of Father's world means..
Anyone who has knees to bow and a tongue to speak, in heaven and on earth and under the earth (in the realm of the dead), will whole-heartedly, and without reservation, acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord. No one can say that “Jesus is Lord,” except by the Holy Spirit.
What do you like best about hell? (since you are fighting tooth and nail to preserve it)The bible is very clear that there is eternal torment for the wicked. They will have a conscious existence in the afterlife. The Bible alone is why I reject the heretical teaching known as universalism.
These three references seem to contradict each other. So, which is it?Jude 4-7, 12-13
4 For certain men whose condemnation was written about long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord.
5 Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that the Lord delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe. 6 And the angels who did not keep their positions of authority but abandoned their own home — these he has kept in darkness, bound with everlasting chains for judgment on the great Day. 7 In a similar way, Sodom and Gomorrah and the surrounding towns gave themselves up to sexual immorality and perversion. They serve as an example of those who suffer the punishment of eternal fire.
12 These men are blemishes at your love feasts, eating with you without the slightest qualm — shepherds who feed only themselves. They are clouds without rain, blown along by the wind; autumn trees, without fruit and uprooted — twice dead. 13 They are wild waves of the sea, foaming up their shame; wandering stars, for whom blackest darkness has been reserved forever.
Revelation 21:8
8 But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars — their place will be in the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death."
Revelation 19:20-21
20 But the beast was captured, and with him the false prophet who had performed the miraculous signs on his behalf. With these signs he had deluded those who had received the mark of the beast and worshiped his image. The two of them were thrown alive into the fiery lake of burning sulfur.
Saint Steven said:
Wrong! Totally wrong. You just copy stuff from a website without bothering to check if it is correct. Except for Matt 25:46 where aionios is correctly translated "eternal" The Greek word "aionios" does NOT occur in any of the listed vss. above. The correct word for each vs. Matt 13:22, "aion," Rom 12:2, "aion." 1 Cor 2:8, "aion.", Eph 2:2, "kosmos," Gal 1:4-5 "aion." Luk 18:29-30 "aion."What do you like best about hell? (since you are fighting tooth and nail to preserve it)
What is heretical really? Holding a position contrary to the "orthodox" position. (heterodox)
By definition, Jesus was a heretic. Seems that we're in pretty good company.
In reference to "eternal torment" being biblical, consider this. Thanks.
Aionios mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46.
All these verses below use the same NT Greek word, "aionios", the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in Matthew 25:46. See bold below. This shows that "aionios" cannot mean eternal or everlasting.
Matthew 13:22
The seed falling among the thorns refers to someone who hears the word, but the worries of this life and the deceitfulness of wealth choke the word, making it unfruitful.
Romans 12:2
Do not conform to the pattern of this world, but be transformed by the renewing of your mind. Then you will be able to test and approve what God’s will is—his good, pleasing and perfect will.
1 Corinthians 1:20
Where is the wise person? Where is the teacher of the law? Where is the philosopher of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?
1 Corinthians 2:8
None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
Ephesians 2:2
in which you used to live when you followed the ways of this world and of the ruler of the kingdom of the air, the spirit who is now at work in those who are disobedient.
Galatians 1:4-5 KJV
Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Galatians 1:4-5 KJV
Who gave himself for our sins, that he might deliver us from this present evil world, according to the will of God and our Father:
5 To whom be glory for ever and ever. Amen.
Compare: Matthew 12:32; Mark 10:30; Luke 18:30; Luke 20:35; Ephesians 1:21
Luke 18:29-30
“Truly I tell you,” Jesus said to them, “no one who has left home or wife or brothers or sisters or parents or children for the sake of the kingdom of God 30 will fail to receive many times as much in this age, and in the age to come eternal life.”
Aionios, the Greek word mistranslated as "eternal" and "everlasting" in the Bible (eternal hell?)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_kfKQJfT0C8&t=770s
Saint Steven said:
If YHWH can make a bush burn without being consumed and protect 3 Hebrew slaves from being harmed in a furnace heated to 7 times usual which killed the soldiers outside the furnace, I'm sure He can make all the above happen when and where He wanted it to. Can't your God do that?These three references seem to contradict each other. So, which is it?
- the furnace of fire?
- blackest darkness? (wandering stars in Jude 4:13) ???
- eternal fire?
- outer darkness?
- lake of fire? (doesn't sound dark)
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