My Gospel by Paul

[d taylor]

What does the first 4 verses say literally?

And your point.

 

[Guojing]

And your point.

You claim it has nothing to do with salvation, I am just checking whether you are reading the same bible as me.

 

[d taylor]

You claim it has nothing to do with salvation, I am just checking whether you are reading the same bible as me.

Show me where in 1 Corinthians (which was written to believers Moreover, brethren ) mentions faith/belief in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Verse 4 is a fact about something Jesus accomplished. And just like i said before, believing in facts about Jesus accomplishments, is not the same as believing in the person Jesus.

It is interesting how many people can simply not believe that it is belief/faith in Jesus that gives people Eternal Life. Even after at least 10+ verses plainly stating this/

 

[Guojing]

Show me where in 1 Corinthians (which was written to believers Moreover, brethren ) mentions faith/belief in Jesus for God's free gift of Eternal Life. Verse 4 is a fact about something Jesus accomplished. And just like i said before, believing in facts about Jesus accomplishments, is not the same as believing in the person Jesus.

It is interesting how many people can simply not believe that it is belief/faith in Jesus that gives people Eternal Life. Even after at least 10+ verses plainly stating this/

I am asking you to state the first 4 verses and tell me what it means to you literally.

But if you do not wish to do that, I am fine, we were deviating for the original clarifying question that I asked you anyway, which was

Can I conclude that, if I ask GES whether they ever said ""faith in something Jesus did does not give a person God's free gift of Eternal Life"

they will not necessarily agree with this statement you are making?

 

[Guojing]

It is interesting how many people can simply not believe that it is belief/faith in Jesus that gives people Eternal Life. Even after at least 10+ verses plainly stating this/

It is easy to understand why once you are willing to accept what Matthew 15:24 literally says.

So when you quote those 10+ verses from the gospel of John, recognize this, Jesus was not speaking to you.

It is like taking Genesis 6:14 and form a doctrine that "God commands me to build an ark". =)

 

[d taylor]

I am asking you to state the first 4 verses and tell me what it means to you literally.

But if you do not wish to do that, I am fine, we were deviating for the original clarifying question that I asked you anyway, which was

Can I conclude that, if I ask GES whether they ever said ""faith in something Jesus did does not give a person God's free gift of Eternal Life"

they will not necessarily agree with this statement you are making?

After several months of back and forths with you. really why does it matter how i view these verses. I have come to the belief that you are set in your beliefs. So really what point does it serve for me to spend time elaborating on verses.

Actually the only reason would be for someone reading this looking to learn about how rightly to use, the analogy of faith, in Bible study.

Here are several written views on the topic.
Another Look at 1 Corinthians 15:3-11 – Grace Evangelical Society

Does 1 Corinthians 15:1-11 Contradict John 3:16? – Grace Evangelical Society

What Should We Say to 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 Christians? – Grace Evangelical Society

 

[d taylor]

It is easy to understand why once you are willing to accept what Matthew 15:24 literally says.

So when you quote those 10+ verses from the gospel of John, recognize this, Jesus was not speaking to you.

It is like taking Genesis 6:14 and form a doctrine that "God commands me to build an ark". =)

Accept Matthew 15:24 accept it as what. If you are trying to say i accept it meaning that Jesus only offers Eternal Life to Jews. You are entirely wrong and are conforming what if have said, to fit your beliefs and are not able to understand my view.

Jesus came to offer the kingdom of God to the nation of Israel. That has absolutely nothing to do with anyone (Jew or gentile), who God has given the opportunity to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation. this free gift goes out to all who will believe in Jesus.

John was written for any person Jew or gentile
And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

 

[d taylor]

I am asking you to state the first 4 verses and tell me what it means to you literally.

But if you do not wish to do that, I am fine, we were deviating for the original clarifying question that I asked you anyway, which was

Can I conclude that, if I ask GES whether they ever said ""faith in something Jesus did does not give a person God's free gift of Eternal Life"

they will not necessarily agree with this statement you are making?

You want, email them and ask away.

ges@faithalone.org * faithalone7777@gmail.com

 

[Guojing]

After several months of back and forths with you. really why does it matter how i view these verses. I have come to the belief that you are set in your beliefs. So really what point does it serve for me to spend time elaborating on verses.

Actually the only reason would be for someone reading this looking to learn about how rightly to use, the analogy of faith, in Bible study.

Here are several written views on the topic.
Another Look at 1 Corinthians 15:3-11 – Grace Evangelical Society

Does 1 Corinthians 15:1-11 Contradict John 3:16? – Grace Evangelical Society

What Should We Say to 1 Corinthians 15:3-4 Christians? – Grace Evangelical Society

All of us are set in our own beliefs.

I was just checking whether the statement "faith in something Jesus did does not give a person God's free gift of Eternal Life" did you learn from them, or did you come up with it on your own.

It is fine to say its your own personal doctrine, I can respect that.

 

[Guojing]

Accept Matthew 15:24 accept it as what. If you are trying to say i accept it meaning that Jesus only offers Eternal Life to Jews. You are entirely wrong and are conforming what if have said, to fit your beliefs and are not able to understand my view.

Jesus came to offer the kingdom of God to the nation of Israel. That has absolutely nothing to do with anyone (Jew or gentile), who God has given the opportunity to receive God's free gift of Eternal Life salvation. this free gift goes out to all who will believe in Jesus.

John was written for any person Jew or gentile
And truly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God, and that believing you may have life in His name.

I am just interpreting what scripture says literally, without adding my own personal interpretation into it.

Given that you are unwilling to do the same for 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 and Luke 10:25–28 , I can understand why it is likewise for Matthew 15:24.

Like many covenant theologians, you simply "spiritualize" what it literally says, in order to make all these fit your doctrine

Nonetheless, my point is, if you are willing to ever understand literally, it will be easy for you to understand why there will be Christians who do not share your personal doctrines.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Do you realize Paul mentioned unto you at least 3 times in that Galatians passage that you are using here?

The basic principle in Bible interpretation is context, who are the you that Paul was referring to in that letter?

The letter to the Galatians is addressed to the Christians of Galatia. So presumably, "you" refers to the Galatians. This should be evident from the opening,

"Paul, an apostle--sent not from men nor by a man, but by Jesus Christ and God the Father, who raised Him from the dead--and all the brothers and sisters with me, to the churches in Galatia:" - Galatians 1:1-2

That's why it is Paul's Letter to the Galatians.

But since the Christian Church has, from ancient times, received this precious epistle of St. Paul into her Canon of Sacred Scripture, has been received as beneficial for our hearing and edification in matters pertaining to Christ and His Gospel, which is the case also of the rest of Holy Scripture. So that the whole Canon of Scripture, from Genesis to Revelation, has been received (with complications and disagreements along the way concerning certain books) as the Christian "Book", pertaining to Jesus Christ. That the follower of Jesus might, in these sacred pages, be strengthened in their faith in Christ, and directed in the way of Christ, and concerning the salvation they have in Christ.

That makes Galatians, while not written directly to us, or to anyone else besides the first century congregations in Galatia, nevertheless beneficial, edifying, and presenting the precious and holy word of God for our faith and salvation in Jesus Christ. Thus, Galatians is not written to us--this is obvious--it is for us, even as all Scripture is for us.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Guojing]

The letter to the Galatians is addressed to the Christians of Galatia. So presumably, "you" refers to the Galatians Christians.

But since the Christian Church has, from ancient times, received this precious epistle of St. Paul into her Canon of Sacred Scripture, has been received as beneficial for our hearing and edification in matters pertaining to Christ and His Gospel, which is the case also of the rest of Holy Scripture. So that the whole Canon of Scripture, from Genesis to Revelation, has been received (with complications and disagreements along the way concerning certain books) as the Christian "Book", pertaining to Jesus Christ. That the follower of Jesus might, in these sacred pages, be strengthened in their faith in Christ, and directed in the way of Christ, and concerning the salvation they have in Christ.

That makes Galatians, while not written directly to us, or to anyone else besides the first century congregations in Galatia, nevertheless beneficial, edifying, and presenting the precious and holy word of God for our faith and salvation in Jesus Christ. Thus, Galatians is not written to us--this is obvious--it is for us, even as all Scripture is for us.

-CryptoLutheran

When you say Galatians Christians, do you actually mean gentiles?

If not, then it will contradict the agreement Paul made with James, Peter and John in Galatians 2:7-9

 

[ViaCrucis]

When you say Galatians Christians, do you actually mean gentiles?

No. I mean Galatian Christians.

If not, then it will contradict the agreement Paul made with James, Peter and John in Galatians 2:7-9

I've no intention going over this again with you.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Strong in Him]

Covenant theologians central belief is this "There is only ONE Gospel", which you repeated a number of times throughout this thread.

Because Paul says there is only one Gospel; it's Scriptural.

Instead of being quick to give me a label, can you not just answer my question and the points I raised?
Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God - so did Paul.
Jesus showed what life in the Kingdom is like; sickness is healed, the poor are helped, the outcast welcomed - Paul healed people, raised someone from the dead and urged churches to help those in need.
Jesus spoke of his death and said that his blood would be shed for the forgiveness of sins, Matthew 26:28 - Paul said that we have forgiveness through the blood of Christ, Ephesians 1:7.
Jesus said that whoever came to him would receive eternal life, John 3:16, John 3:36, John 6:40 - Paul said that God's gift is eternal life through Christ, Romans 6:23.
Jesus foretold his resurrection - Paul preached the resurrection.
Jesus said that after he went away, he would send the Holy Spirit, who would live in us - Paul taught about the Spirit who lives in us and helps us in our Christian lives.
Jesus said that he would return one day - Paul preached the 2nd coming.

What is/are the difference/s between the 2 Gospels?

 

[Guojing]

Because Paul says there is only one Gospel; it's Scriptural.

Instead of being quick to give me a label, can you not just answer my question and the points I raised?
Jesus spoke of the Kingdom of God - so did Paul.
Jesus showed what life in the Kingdom is like; sickness is healed, the poor are helped, the outcast welcomed - Paul healed people, raised someone from the dead and urged churches to help those in need.
Jesus spoke of his death and said that his blood would be shed for the forgiveness of sins, Matthew 26:28 - Paul said that we have forgiveness through the blood of Christ, Ephesians 1:7.
Jesus said that whoever came to him would receive eternal life, John 3:16, John 3:36, John 6:40 - Paul said that God's gift is eternal life through Christ, Romans 6:23.
Jesus foretold his resurrection - Paul preached the resurrection.
Jesus said that after he went away, he would send the Holy Spirit, who would live in us - Paul taught about the Spirit who lives in us and helps us in our Christian lives.
Jesus said that he would return one day - Paul preached the 2nd coming.

What is/are the difference/s between the 2 Gospels?

Do you realize Paul mentioned unto you at least 3 times in that Galatians passage that you are using here?

The basic principle in Bible interpretation is context, who are the you that Paul was referring to in that letter?

 

[Strong in Him]

Do you realize Paul mentioned unto you at least 3 times in that Galatians passage that you are using here?

The basic principle in Bible interpretation is context, who are the you that Paul was referring to in that letter?

That doesn't answer any of my questions.
I take it that you cannot explain the differences between the "2 Gospels"?

 

[Guojing]

That doesn't answer any of my questions.
I take it that you cannot explain the differences between the "2 Gospels"?

I was addressing your very first statement with that.

 

[Guojing]

That doesn't answer any of my questions.
I take it that you cannot explain the differences between the "2 Gospels"?

People can explain the difference to you, but only you can understand it on your own.

 

[Strong in Him]

People can explain the difference to you, but only you can understand it on your own.View attachment 334941

I don't want a chart - the result of someone else s studies. I want answers to my points.
Jesus preached the kingdom of God, so did Paul. Jesus talked about his saving death and resurrection - so did Paul.

Yet you claim there are 2 Gospels.

 

[d taylor]

I am just interpreting what scripture says literally, without adding my own personal interpretation into it.

Given that you are unwilling to do the same for 1 Corinthians 15:1-4 and Luke 10:25–28 , I can understand why it is likewise for Matthew 15:24.

Like many covenant theologians, you simply "spiritualize" what it literally says, in order to make all these fit your doctrine

Nonetheless, my point is, if you are willing to ever understand literally, it will be easy for you to understand why there will be Christians who do not share your personal doctrines.

No what you are doing is ignoring easy straight forward verses from The Bible.

A good example of this is 1 Corinthians 15. You only take 4 verses from that chapter and build a belief around those 4 verses ignoring the other verses in the chapter especially verse 12 that clearly states what Paul is addressing in the first part of chapter 15 Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? Which is, there are believers saying the dead is not resurrected, that is why Paul states and that He was buried, and that He rose again the third day according to the Scriptures, and that He was seen by Cephas, then by the twelve. After that He was seen by over five hundred brethren at once, of whom the greater part remain to the present, but some have fallen asleep. After that He was seen by James, then by all the apostles. Then last of all He was seen by me also, as by one born out of due time.

You simply can not see and understand what 1 Corinthians 15 is saying because of your preconceived theological mind set. You think every time you read the word saved, that the writer is addressing Eternal Life salvation from the lake of fire (hell). But you fail to understand that there are in The Bible, other uses and meanings used of the word saved and that the word saved does not always mean in The Bible saved (salvation) from the lake of fire (hell). Many times saved is addressing the physical saving of believers from harm or God's discipline.

Is There a Difference Between Being Saved and Being Born Again? – Grace Evangelical Society

So do not come off with this innocent attitude that i am just doing so and so. When you are really cherry picking out verses to form your theology