My Goliath Challenge

[Tiberius]

Yo, Jazer, I have a question for you.

When I said:

"And in reading the passage, it looks to me like it was the sling, not his face, that got the job done!"​

you replied:

"Then according to science it should be no problem for you to duplicate and get the same results." ​

I said:

"What, I should be able to use a slingshot to whack a stone into another guy's forehead and kill him?

Well, yeah, I suppose I could if I wanted to, but I don't really fancy the idea of hurting or killing someone.

Do you think that I wouldn't be able to do it? That I could smack a stone into someone's face and it wouldn't harm them?"​

So I gotta ask, did you have a point to make with that?

 

[razeontherock]

I'm not Jazer but you're overlooking the obvious. The army David wasn't even qualified to be part of, (he was basically the water boy) had 700 experts with a sling. ALL far more experienced.

Why couldn't they do it?

This story is all about Faith, not the sling. It is all about how Faith is more reliable than what we perceive w/ our senses, and is the root of all the "_____ can take a hike" that we see cropping up all over the place here lately.

 

[Tiberius]

Except that Goliath dropped dead only because he was hit in the forehead by a rock! Sling launches rock, rock hits hard enough to kill. The story is quite clear.

 

[AV1611VET]

Except that Goliath dropped dead only because he was hit in the forehead by a rock! Sling launches rock, rock hits hard enough to kill. The story is quite clear.

You might want to read that story over, chief; with emphasis on how Goliath really died.

The story is quite clear.

 

[pgp_protector]

Except that Goliath dropped dead only because he was hit in the forehead by a rock! Sling launches rock, rock hits hard enough to kill. The story is quite clear.

You might want to read that story over, chief; with emphasis on how Goliath really died.

The story is quite clear.

Yep.

49 Reaching into his bag and taking out a stone, he slung it and struck the Philistine on the forehead. The stone sank into his forehead, and he fell facedown on the ground.

50 So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.

 

[AV1611VET]

Yep.

49 Reaching into his bag and taking out a stone, he slung it and struck the Philistine on the forehead. The stone sank into his forehead, and he fell facedown on the ground.

50 So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him.

1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

 

[pgp_protector]

1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

Yes, he cut the head of a dead person.
The stone killed him (or do you disagree with what was written? )

So David triumphed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone; without a sword in his hand he struck down the Philistine and killed him

 

[AV1611VET]

Yes, he cut the head of a dead person.
The stone killed him (or do you disagree with what was written? )

Do I disagree with what was written?

-- That's an understatement.

I would be moderated if I called the NIV what I wanted to call it -- (and not for foul language, either).

 

[pgp_protector]

Do I disagree with what was written?

-- That's an understatement.

I would be moderated if I called the NIV what I wanted to call it -- (and not for foul language, either).

Ok here it is in the KJV

49 Then David put his hand in his bag and took out a stone; and he slung it and struck the Philistine in his forehead, so that the stone sank into his forehead, and he fell on his face to the earth. 50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. But there was no sword in the hand of David.

Do you also disagree with the KJV ?

 

[AV1611VET]

Ok here it is in the KJV

49 Then David put his hand in his bag and took out a stone; and he slung it and struck the Philistine in his forehead, so that the stone sank into his forehead, and he fell on his face to the earth. 50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and a stone, and struck the Philistine and killed him. But there was no sword in the hand of David.

Do you also disagree with the KJV ?

Nice try --

 

[pgp_protector]

Nice try --

Was that a yes or no?

 

[AV1611VET]

Was that a yes or no?

Get a KJV and read it yourself, PGP -- or are you just trying to rile me?

Here, I'll do it for you:

1 Samuel 17:48 ¶ And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came and drew nigh to meet David, that David hasted, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine.
1 Samuel 17:49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.
1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

Show me the word "killed", you keep using.

 

[pgp_protector]

Get a KJV and read it yourself, PGP -- or are you just trying to rile me?

Here, I'll do it for you:

1 Samuel 17:48 ¶ And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came and drew nigh to meet David, that David hasted, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine.
1 Samuel 17:49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.
1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

Show me the word "killed", you keep using.

Semantics again AV? Really ?

Strong's Hebrew Definition for # 07819

Slew-
07819 // jxv // shachat // shaw-khat' //

a primitive root; TWOT - 2362

AV - kill 42, slay 36, offer 1, shot out 1, slaughter 1; 81

v
1) to kill, slaughter, beat
1a) (Qal)
1a1) to slaughter
1a1a) beast for food
1a1b) sacrifice
1a1c) person in human sacrifice
1a1d) beaten, hammered (of shekels)
1b) (Niphal) to be slaughtered, be slain (of food or sacrifice)

n f
2) (BDB) slaughtering
2a) word doubtful

 

[AV1611VET]

Semantics again AV? Really ?

Strong's Hebrew Definition for # 07819

Slew-
07819 // jxv // shachat // shaw-khat' //

a primitive root; TWOT - 2362

AV - kill 42, slay 36, offer 1, shot out 1, slaughter 1; 81

v
1) to kill, slaughter, beat
1a) (Qal)
1a1) to slaughter
1a1a) beast for food
1a1b) sacrifice
1a1c) person in human sacrifice
1a1d) beaten, hammered (of shekels)
1b) (Niphal) to be slaughtered, be slain (of food or sacrifice)

n f
2) (BDB) slaughtering
2a) word doubtful

Once again, chief:

1 Samuel 17:48 ¶ And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came and drew nigh to meet David, that David hasted, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine.
1 Samuel 17:49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.
1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

David killed him twice, did he?

 

[pgp_protector]

Once again, chief:

1 Samuel 17:48 ¶ And it came to pass, when the Philistine arose, and came and drew nigh to meet David, that David hasted, and ran toward the army to meet the Philistine.
1 Samuel 17:49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.
1 Samuel 17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
1 Samuel 17:51 Therefore David ran, and stood upon the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw their champion was dead, they fled.

David killed him twice, did he?

Nope, Slew him then cut off his head.

 

[Tinker Grey]

Obviously, David killed Goliath and then killed him again.

(Gotta love when the story's author contradicts himself in the space of a sentence.)

 

[razeontherock]

Get a KJV and read it yourself

Here, I'll do it for you:

1 Samuel 17:48 and slang it

Show me the word "killed", you keep using.

Hey I thought you said this was KJV, what's slang doing in it?



It uses "slingers" too (hey watch it, no funny jokes) which is a town near here.

Anyway guys, either Goliath died twice or we don't really know when he died.
Cutting off his head SHOWED his compadres that he was dead. That's what the story says. Before that, how would you be sure? Apparently David wasn't waiting around to find out.

Also note, his armor bearer mysteriously disappears from the scene ...

 

[AV1611VET]

Hey I thought you said this was KJV, what's slang doing in it?

Hey! That's pretty good!

Anyway guys, either Goliath died twice or we don't really know when he died.

I believe God subdued Goliath for David, then allowed David the kill shot.

Just my opinion, though.

 

[razeontherock]

NEW TWIST: embedded ...

 

[Tiberius]

You might want to read that story over, chief; with emphasis on how Goliath really died.

The story is quite clear.

17:49 And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead, that the stone sunk into his forehead; and he fell upon his face to the earth.
17:50 So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.​

Yes it is.

A sling and a stone. Quite clear indeed.