My flood water challenge

[Quartermaine]

And if you met Adam on the day he was created, how old would you think he was?

not 65 million

 

[Speedwell]

There is plenty of water to have covered the earth. It is now in the earth's mantle -
There’s as much water in Earth’s mantle as in all the oceans

BTW they also think it also accounts for earthquakes and tsunamis.
Study: Deep beneath the earth, more water than in all the oceans combined

But not in liquid form.

 

[AV1611VET]

Evidence of a global flood? no

That's because God cleaned up His mess.

Just like He closed up Adam's flesh, when He took Adam's rib out to make Eve.

No scars.

Note: I do believe He left two clues behind: white cliffs and meandering rivers, but that's neither here nor there at the moment. Everything else was cleaned up for sanitary and safety reasons. When Noah stepped off the Ark, he stepped off into a beautiful world the likes of the garden of Eden.

 

[AV1611VET]

not 65 million

So you want to play games and avoid answering me, don't you?

That's fine.

People accuse me of being ignorant, and that suits me just fine.

I'll admit it.

 

[Speedwell]

That's because God cleaned up His mess.

Just like He closed up Adam's flesh, when He took Adam's rib out to make Eve.

No scars.

Note: I do believe He left two clues behind: white cliffs and meandering rivers, but that's neither here nor there at the moment. Everything else was cleaned up for sanitary and safety reasons. When Noah stepped off the Ark, he stepped off into a beautiful world the likes of the garden of Eden.

Where does it say that in the Bible?

 

[AV1611VET]

Where does it say that in the Bible?

It doesn't.

But when a dove was sent out, then brought back an olive leave from a tree that would have taken years to grow, you don't have to be a Rhodes scholar to know what happened.

 

[Speedwell]

It doesn't.

But when a dove was sent out, then brought back an olive leave from a tree that would have taken years to grow, you don't have to be a Rhodes scholar to know what happened.

Either that, or the flood didn't drown all the olive trees. What you are basically saying is, "it must have been thus-and-so if the flood story is accurate literal history" which is baseless and unbiblical speculation.

 

[Running2win]

Water inside the earth under pressure? that is an understatement. If the voulume of wather sufficent to cause the biblical flood were under the earth's crust it would be under tremendous pressure, enough pressure to rib the crust of the earth off.

and the Canopy? A massive layer of ice and/or water vapor high above the atmosphere? it would have to be miles thick. so think that sunlight couldn't get through and so thing that the air pressure at the surface woudl be tens of thousands of pounds per square inch. and the trapped heat from this canopy would be well past the temperature needed to melt lead.


Evidence of a global flood? no

There have been at least six mass extinctions.

Flood myths are by no means universal.

evidence? no

Wow! Just noticed you were not an Atheist! Did you even read any of the links? Funny just discussing the Creeds of the Faith. The two earliest confirm God is maker of heaven and earth. I guess you did not get the memo? God in Job 38-42, had a lot to say about His creation. Check it out!

And God said He will not the destroy the earth with water again-made a covenant with us and the beasts of the earth, but will with fire. If it wasn't world wide, He would not of had to make a covenant with us. Right? "six mass extinctions", lol! Dude, you need to get into the word more.

8Then God spoke to Noah and to his sons with him, saying, 9“Now behold, I Myself do establish My covenant with you, and with your descendants after you; 10and with every living creature that is with you, the birds, the cattle, and every beast of the earth with you; of all that comes out of the ark, even every beast of the earth. 11“I establish My covenant with you; and all flesh shall never again be cut off by the water of the flood, neither shall there again be a flood to destroy the earth.” 12God said, “This is the sign of the covenant which I am making between Me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all successive generations; 13I set My bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a sign of a covenant between Me and the earth. 14“It shall come about, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow will be seen in the cloud, 15and I will remember My covenant, which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and never again shall the water become a flood to destroy all flesh. 16“When the bow is in the cloud, then I will look upon it, to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth.” 17And God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth.”

3Know this first of all, that in the last days mockers will come with their mocking, following after their own lusts, 4and saying, “Where is the promise of His coming? For ever since the fathers fell asleep, all continues just as it was from the beginning of creation.” 5For when they maintain this, it escapes their notice that by the word of God the heavens existed long ago and the earth was formed out of water and by water, 6through which the world at that time was destroyed, being flooded with water. 7But by His word the present heavens and earth are being reserved for fire, kept for the day of judgment and destruction of ungodly men.

8But do not let this one fact escape your notice, beloved, that with the Lord one day is like a thousand years, and a thousand years like one day. 9The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance.

 

[Running2win]

Either that, or the flood didn't drown all the olive trees. What you are basically saying is, "it must have been thus-and-so if the flood story is accurate literal history" which is baseless and unbiblical speculation.

It's just animals with the breath of life and spirit in them. I'm sure some plants and trees survived along with sea creatures that didn't need to breathe air.

21All flesh that moved on the earth perished, birds and cattle and beasts and every swarming thing that swarms upon the earth, and all mankind; 22of all that was on the dry land, all in whose nostrils was the breath of the spirit of life, died. 23Thus He blotted out every living thing that was upon the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky, and they were blotted out from the earth; and only Noah was left, together with those that were with him in the ark. 24The water prevailed upon the earth one hundred and fifty days

 

[eleos1954]

I'm not so sure Mt Everest existed at the time.

But for the sake of arguing, let's say it did.

However much water was needed, God sent it to Earth, along with making the earth chalk up water from inside her.

Genesis 7:11 In the six hundredth year of Noah's life, in the second month, the seventeenth day of the month, the same day were all the fountains of the great deep broken up, and the windows of heaven were opened.

Note here ...

Revelation 4:1a After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven:

And what did John see?

Revelation 4:6a And before the throne there was a sea of glass like unto crystal:

Windows of Heaven open up, and water rains down from a huge sea in Heaven proper, as well as from outer space, as well as coming up from the bowels of the earth.

Genesis 4:7

Seven days from now I will send rain on the earth. It will rain for 40 days and 40 nights. I will destroy from the face of the earth every living creature I have made.”

Genesis 8

8 But God showed concern for Noah. He also showed concern for all the wild animals and livestock that were with Noah in the ark.

So God sent a wind to sweep over the earth. And the waters began to go down.

2 The springs at the bottom of the oceans had been closed. The windows of the sky had also been closed. And the rain had stopped falling from the sky.

3 The water on the earth continued to go down. At the end of the 150 days the water had gone down.

4 On the 17th day of the seventh month, the ark came to rest on the mountains of Ararat. 5 The waters continued to go down until the tenth month. On the first day of that month, the tops of the mountains could be seen.

I recently got hit with a flash flood .... believe me ... the devastation from rain can be massive and in very short order ... unbelievably powerful and destructive.

 

[Quartermaine]

Wow! Just noticed you were not an Atheist! Did you even read any of the links? Funny just discussing the Creeds of the Faith. The two earliest confirm God is maker of heaven and earth. I guess you did not get the memo? God in Job 38-42, had a lot to say about His creation. Check it out!

And God said He will not the destroy the earth with water again-made a covenant with us and the beasts of the earth, but will with fire. If it wasn't world wide, He would not of had to make a covenant with us. Right? "six mass extinctions", lol! Dude, you need to get into the word more.

Ordovician-silurian Extinction: 440 million years ago.
Devonian Extinction: 365 million years ago.
Permian-triassic Extinction: 250 million years ago.
Triassic-jurassic Extinction: 210 million years ago.
Cretaceous-tertiary Extinction: 65 Million Years Ago.
And the one we are currently in the middle of

8Then God spoke to Noah and to his sons with him, saying, 9“Now behold, I Myself do establish My covenant with you, and with your descendants after you; 10and with every living creature that is with you, the birds, the cattle, and every beast of the earth with you; of all that comes out of the ark, even every beast of the earth. 11“I establish My covenant with you; and all flesh shall never again be cut off by the water of the flood, neither shall there again be a flood to destroy the earth.” 12God said, “This is the sign of the covenant which I am making between Me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all successive generations; 13I set My bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a sign of a covenant between Me and the earth. 14“It shall come about, when I bring a cloud over the earth, that the bow will be seen in the cloud, 15and I will remember My covenant, which is between Me and you and every living creature of all flesh; and never again shall the water become a flood to destroy all flesh. 16“When the bow is in the cloud, then I will look upon it, to remember the everlasting covenant between God and every living creature of all flesh that is on the earth.” 17And God said to Noah, “This is the sign of the covenant which I have established between Me and all flesh that is on the earth.”

So simple light refraction didn't happen before this?

 

[Quartermaine]

It's just animals with the breath of life and spirit in them. I'm sure some plants and trees survived along with sea creatures that didn't need to breathe air.

so were the flood waters fresh water? or salt? because salt water fish can't survive in fresh water and fresh water fish can't survive in salt water.

 

[driewerf]

The flood story is posed as a literal event involving the material earth, as moved by God to accomplish his purpose. He didn't need to create 'extra water' to drown everything "in whose nostrils was the breath of life". It wasn't necessary to cover Mt. Everest as there was no one up there to drown. And if any did climb above the "high hills" to escape the flood water they would quickly succumb to starvation or exposure.

Nope, all the mountains were covered:
17 For forty days the flood kept coming on the earth, and as the waters increased they lifted the ark high above the earth. 18 The waters rose and increased greatly on the earth, and the ark floated on the surface of the water. 19 They rose greatly on the earth, and all the high mountains under the entire heavens were covered. 20 The waters rose and covered the mountains to a depth of more than fifteen cubits.
Actually, has anyone an idea how mich a cubit is? For I just took the height of Mount Everest as shell to fill. It actually needs to be Everest+ 15 cubits.

 

[Sorn]

If Noah's flood was a mixture of natural and supernatural (ie miraculous) events then we will never be able to fully explain it by assuming purely natural processes.
The flood itself, if world wide, may have transformed many regions geologically.

There is also much about the planet we don't know and if those articles posted that lots of water exists in the mantle then who knows, it may all just be possible largely as written.

 

[SelfSim]

The flood itself, if world wide ..

Just how 'wide' was 'the world' when this flood happened?
Our 'world' nowadays, is very thoroughly explored and is thus very well known.
This clearly, was not the case back in the times we're talking about here(?)

 

[AppleCider]

.

 

[eleos1954]

so were the flood waters fresh water? or salt? because salt water fish can't survive in fresh water and fresh water fish can't survive in salt water.

We know salt water does not fall from the sky .... and the biblical account states water came from the heavens and also from the springs of the earth.

Where salt water comes from

Rain replenishes freshwater in rivers and streams, so they don’t taste salty. However, the water in the ocean collects all of the salt and minerals from all of the rivers that flow into it.

When fresh water and saltwater meet in an estuary, they do not always mix very readily. Because fresh water flowing into the estuary is less salty and less dense than water from the ocean, it often floats on top of the heavier seawater.

so ... since salt water is heavier than fresh water ... the ocean animals could have went deep (ie under the floating fresh water) ... on the flip side ... the fresh water fish could have been surviving near the top (floating fresh water)

Also there are fresh water springs in the ocean ... perhaps these areas when opened up by the flood were able to harbor some of the fresh water species as well.

Between the two ... survival of both .... certainly plausible and probable.

 

[driewerf]

No math needed. Just common sense.

Oh yes, math is needed. It just shows the scale of the problem.

Problem 1: We don't have enough water to cover Mount Everest. Impossible.

It's not a matter of "covering the Mout Everest", it's a matter of filling é shell with the radius of the earth and a thickness of Mount Everest. Filling a shell!

Problem 2: There is a water canopy above the Earth that flooded the whole Earth. LoOL

Is there? What is this shell?
Where is your evidence? And how much water does it contain?
And what caused to flood the earth all the sudden?
You're creating more problems than solving. Loll

Problem 3: There's so much water under the Earth that flooded the whole Earth. So, we have the ocean, the bottom of the ocean, then below the bottom of the ocean, there is "so much water under it", then, there's the molten layer, then the core. LoOL

The water in the oceans is not available, you need to fill the entire shell of 8 kilometers above sea level.
The "bottom of the ocean"? That's basaltic rock (1). Please explain how basaltic rock provides water.
<whzt molten layer, please explain? And the core, the Earth's core? That's a very hot ball in iron and nickel, no water (2).


(1) 10(p) Physiography of the Ocean Basins
(2) Why is the earth's core so hot? And how do scientists measure its temperature?

 

[Running2win]

Ordovician-silurian Extinction: 440 million years ago.
Devonian Extinction: 365 million years ago.
Permian-triassic Extinction: 250 million years ago.
Triassic-jurassic Extinction: 210 million years ago.
Cretaceous-tertiary Extinction: 65 Million Years Ago.
And the one we are currently in the middle of


So simple light refraction didn't happen before this?

In the clouds is key. Most likely it did not rain before the flood. The earth would of been like a big greenhouse. Water bubbled up as springs do today, so mist/fog, but maybe no rain clouds.

But all the things you list are just secular ways of explaining things-and only one theory, that unfortunately has taken root in the church. It brings in doubt upon the word of God and trust in the Scriptures.

We were not there, so who are you going to believe? The God of the Bible or modern man that didn't even invent the cars until about 100 tears ago. Evolution is a snow job by the evil one.

 

[Running2win]

We know salt water does not fall from the sky .... and the biblical account states water came from the heavens and also from the springs of the earth.

Where salt water comes from

Rain replenishes freshwater in rivers and streams, so they don’t taste salty. However, the water in the ocean collects all of the salt and minerals from all of the rivers that flow into it.

When fresh water and saltwater meet in an estuary, they do not always mix very readily. Because fresh water flowing into the estuary is less salty and less dense than water from the ocean, it often floats on top of the heavier seawater.

so ... since salt water is heavier than fresh water ... the ocean animals could have went deep (ie under the floating fresh water) ... on the flip side ... the fresh water fish could have been surviving near the top (floating fresh water)

Also there are fresh water springs in the ocean ... perhaps these areas when opened up by the flood were able to harbor some of the fresh water species as well.

Between the two ... survival of both .... certainly plausible and probable.

Yes, and Bull Sharks can survive in both. And adaptation would of been already programmed by God. It is the Macro that is bunk.