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My Ex-nihilo Challenge

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plindboe

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I do, though, and so can you, if you'll look in the right place ---

[bible]Hebrews 11:3[/bible]

People of all faiths say that. The grand claims are rather unconvincing when there are billions of believers all claiming to be the select few in possession of the Truth, and their method for acquiring this certainty is always faith. That these countless beliefs usually contradict each other shows us two things:

1) It's in human nature to devote oneself to things that are not real.
2) Faith is a method of this self-deception.

The lessons are: Be careful of your own bias and use evidence to determine truth.

Peter :)
 
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Naraoia

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God created the earth and turned it over to us to use science to our advantage. That science He gave us is not meant to be used against Him. Therefore, I would expect any attempts to find God via scientific means to be unfruitful. This is why, in my opinion, no amount of searching is going to "dig up" anything. Trying to find God with electronic gadgetry is like trying to find a rubber ball with a magnet.
And a few posts earlier this same man told us to "keep looking". :scratch:
 
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MrGoodBytes

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And a few posts earlier this same man told us to "keep looking". :scratch:
That shouldn't come as a surprise to you, seeing how he simultaneously argues that evolution is impossible because this planet is only 6100 years old and takes offense in being called a YEC.
 
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Eudaimonist

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And a few posts earlier this same man told us to "keep looking". :scratch:

Whenever someone says "keep looking", they mean "keep looking until you see that I'm right".


eudaimonia,

Mark
 
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AV1611VET

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And a few posts earlier this same man told us to "keep looking". :scratch:

We're talking about finding God via electronic means; and it cannot be done. God is transcendent.
 
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AV1611VET

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Then what should we "keep looking" for? :confused:

Oh, a few things come to mind:
  • four-footed locusts
  • satyrs
  • behemoths
  • hares that chew their cud
  • fowled bats
  • a water canopy
  • an empty tomb
  • Sodom and Gomorrah
  • the ten-man Syrian chariot
  • the Sinai desert for artifacts
  • Cyrenius as governor of Syria in 4 BC
  • extra-Biblical references to Jesus
  • Noah's Ark
--- for starters.
 
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MrGoodBytes

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Oh, a few things come to mind:
  • four-footed locusts
Any suggestions where to start?

Same as above.

behemoths
What's a "behemoth"?

hares that chew their cud
Hares don't chew their cud, at least not the hares we know. If you have any information on hitherto undiscovered hares that show this behavior, let us know.

fowled bats
Where should we start the search?

a water canopy
Where should we start the search?

an empty tomb
That's easy. There are lots of empty tombs all over the world.

Sodom and Gomorrah
Where should we start the search?

the ten-man Syrian chariot
What's the significance of this?

the Sinai desert for artifacts
Any artifacts?

Cyrenius as governor of Syria in 4 BC
As far as I can see, there is little doubt that Cyrenius was governor at that time.

extra-Biblical references to Jesus
Where should we start the search?

Noah's Ark
Where should we start the search?
 
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Nathan Poe

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Oh, a few things come to mind:
  • four-footed locusts
  • satyrs
  • behemoths
  • hares that chew their cud
  • fowled bats
  • a water canopy
  • an empty tomb
  • Sodom and Gomorrah
  • the ten-man Syrian chariot
  • the Sinai desert for artifacts
  • Cyrenius as governor of Syria in 4 BC
  • extra-Biblical references to Jesus
  • Noah's Ark
--- for starters.

Don't forget the unicorns, AV!
 
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AV1611VET

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Any suggestions where to start?

In my honest opinion --- it's too late. We live in the latter days, and the chances of finding evidence of those are about as great as finding Judge Crater. You'll have to go on written Documentation as your evidence.
 
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Vene

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In my honest opinion --- it's too late. We live in the latter days, and the chances of finding evidence of those are about as great as finding Judge Crater. You'll have to go on written Documentation as your evidence.
Then where can we find extra-Biblical references to Jesus. After all, that is also written documentation.
 
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quatona

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That shouldn't come as a surprise to you, seeing how he simultaneously argues that evolution is impossible because this planet is only 6100 years old and takes offense in being called a YEC.
One thing I have always been wondering about the idea that the planet is 6k, 8k, or 10k old:
What about those animals that lived 100.000s of years ago? Did they have to wait until the earth came into being, and where did they wait?
^_^
 
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Nathan Poe

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In my honest opinion --- it's too late. We live in the latter days, and the chances of finding evidence of those are about as great as finding Judge Crater. You'll have to go on written Documentation as your evidence.

Cop-Out.
 
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AV1611VET

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Naraoia

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Oh, a few things come to mind:
four-footed locusts
Dr Heitler's lab here in St Andrews ^_^ Some of the poor experimental subjects inevitably lose a couple of legs when people start playing with them :p
Seriously, though, any ideas as to where one should look for them?
hares that chew their cud
Hmm, you might want to read this
fowled bats
What does this even mean? Feathered?
a water canopy
Where would that be? As far as I'm aware none of the satellites, space probes and other stuff we sent up there has ever encountered such a thing.
an empty tomb
Now, I suppose you mean one particular empty tomb. Provided we found it and conclusively showed that it was that tomb, what would that prove? There are many ways of emptying a tomb, how do you suggest we distinguish between ordinary tomb raiders and miracles 2000 years after the event?
Sodom and Gomorrah
Where woud they be?
the ten-man Syrian chariot
Ok, I don't know about this one.
the Sinai desert for artifacts
Oh, I'm sure it's full of them. :p
Cyrenius as governor of Syria in 4 BC
Was he? I'm not overeducated in ancient history, so to speak. But even if he was, what would that show us? That the Bible got one historical fact right?
extra-Biblical references to Jesus
Here's the only one I know of:
Annales of Tacitus said:
But all human efforts, all the lavish gifts of the emperor, and the propitiations of the gods, did not banish the sinister belief that the conflagration was the result of an order. Consequently, to get rid of the report, Nero fastened the guilt and inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class hated for their abominations, called Christians by the populace. Christus, from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus, and a most mischievous superstition, thus checked for the moment, again broke out not only in Judaea, the first source of the evil, but even in Rome, where all things hideous and shameful from every part of the world find their centre and become popular. (SOURCE)
Written several decades after Jesus's death and mentions him only because Nero blamed the burning of Rome on his followers.
Noah's Ark
I suppose it should be somewhere on Mt Ararat, no? Haven't people been trying to find it for ages, with no real success?
 
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Naraoia

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In my honest opinion --- it's too late. We live in the latter days, and the chances of finding evidence of those are about as great as finding Judge Crater. You'll have to go on written Documentation as your evidence.
So, let me understand this. You are saying that we won't find any evidence. You are also advising us to keep looking.

Why on earth should we keep looking if there's no real hope of finding anything?
 
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