MP-EP updates?

[☦Marius☦]

I can't seem to find any kind of updates on the current status of the schism. Does anyone know what is going on? Are there any plans for talks or a synod? I was hoping this schism would be about as short as the 96' MP-EP schism but clearly it will not be.

 

[AMM]

this is the most I've seen recently, and it's not even that much of an update. I heard the Antiochians addressed it at their convention in July but I'm not sure

Greek Holy Synod reportedly to deal with Ukrainian issue at current session, likely to recognize OCU

 

[☦Marius☦]

I imagine the Antiochians were fairly supportive of the MP? Looks like the Synod officially backed the EP. Unfortunate. This will be of greater consequence now.

 

[ArmyMatt]

we'll see where this goes. Lord have mercy!

 

[AMM]

I imagine the Antiochians were fairly supportive of the MP? Looks like the Synod officially backed the EP. Unfortunate. This will be of greater consequence now.

I think they supported MP but didn't sever communion with EP. But not sure, I couldn't find any transcripts or records of the discussion or its conclusions

and where do you see that the Synod backed the EP? That article just says they hadn't discussed it yet but that was a couple days ago... did you find an update?

 

[☦Marius☦]

Greek Orthodox Church backs independence of Ukrainian Church | Kathimerini

Synod in Greece rules Ukraine Church autocephaly "canonical"

Not sure how reliable but I'll wait for the official Announcement to make a judgement

 

[buzuxi02]

Probably the schism will become permanent over time.

 

[buzuxi02]

Greek Orthodox Church backs independence of Ukrainian Church | Kathimerini

Synod in Greece rules Ukraine Church autocephaly "canonical"

Not sure how reliable but I'll wait for the official Announcement to make a judgement

That Kathemerini article is bizarre to say the least. It makes no sense:

"He presented a decree of independence to the head of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine in January "...

Huh??? The head of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine is Met. Onufry, there is no other. The Phanar bishop never met with him. Other than the church presided over by Met. Onufru there exists no other Orthodox church in Ukraine to give autocephaly too.

 

[☦Marius☦]

That Kathemerini article is bizarre to say the least. It makes no sense:

"He presented a decree of independence to the head of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine in January "...

Huh??? The head of the Orthodox Church of Ukraine is Met. Onufry, there is no other. The Phanar bishop never met with him. Other than the church presided over by Met. Onufru there exists no other Orthodox church in Ukraine to give autocephaly too.

I think they are referring to the schismatic group that was led by "Patriarch" Filaret

 

[ArmyMatt]

Probably the schism will become permanent over time.

hopefully not, stuff like this has happened before without a permanent schism.

 

[☦Marius☦]

Probably the schism will become permanent over time.

Most of the long lasting schisms were over a major doctrinal issue. This is more geopolitical though I do have concerns for the spiritual state of the Greek Church because of all this. The EP seems to be seperating himself further and further from the rest of Orthodoxy. With only a few thousand parishioners in his jurisdiction it may well be close to the end for the EP, not that I would really care. In my opinion it's a role no longer necessary, and in my mind always too much about status.

 

[buzuxi02]

This is more geopolitical though I do have concerns for the spiritual state of the Greek Church because of all this. The EP seems to be seperating himself further and further from the rest of Orthodoxy

The EU loving Orthodox countries are separating themselves further and further from Orthodoxy. These countries all have something in common in that they are also all NATO members or are dying to enter the alliance. They are all sympathetic to the new calendar and for European unity (against the world). Most of the major schisms had a geopolitical component, same thing played out with Rome and Constantinople as new military alliances were forged. .

If Greece folds which it seems it will, it's just another domino to drop. Romania will follow and we all know Montenegro will then be targeted, as the Greeks are now saying each new nation state deserves their own autocephalous church (hint hint)

 

[buzuxi02]

I think they are referring to the schismatic group that was led by "Patriarch" Filaret

Yes, but he never headed the Ukranian Orthodox Church just a vagante spurious sect. Which is the entire point, no one can declare autocephaly to a structure that does not exist. By the way what's funny is if he personally recieved this autocephaly then the current sect is null and void as Filaret has schismed away from this new creation like a week ago and took some parishes who support him along.

 

[Antoni]

It appears this Synod kicked the can down the road and is punting recognition back to the Primate of the Greek Church. Worsening crisis averted.. for now.

Lord, Your will be done!

 

[☦Marius☦]

Yes, but he never headed the Ukranian Orthodox Church just a vagante spurious sect. Which is the entire point, no one can declare autocephaly to a structure that does not exist. By the way what's funny is if he personally recieved this autocephaly then the current sect is null and void as Filaret has schismed away from this new creation like a week ago and took some parishes who support him along.

Yeah, it was such a strange decision to make by Bartholomew. Why pick one of the two schismatic groups to give autocephaly to?Without even giving them some kind of discipline for all the terrorism! Utterly rediculous but of course the US government has to give its opinions. Who really controls the EP?

 

[Not David]

Is the conflict based on Russophobia? Because everyone who is in favor of the EP mentions how evil Russians are.

 

[AMM]

Is the conflict based on Russophobia? Because everyone who is in favor of the EP mentions how evil Russians are.

I hadn't noticed that, except potentially in the ecclesiastical sense, like "the Russian Church is evil because it's resisting the EP who is the head of the church" (but not a McCarthy-esque "evil russians!" type thing). But even that, I don't think I've heard too much

 

[AMM]

Greek Church recognizes Phanar’s right to grant autocephalies, stops short of recognizing OCU

 

[RobNJ]

Is the conflict based on Russophobia? Because everyone who is in favor of the EP mentions how evil Russians are.

My take on it... In the Ukraine, you have ethnic Russians, who look across the border and see brothers. Then, you have ethnic Ukrainians, who look across the border, and remember decades of "enemy occupation", during the Soviet era. Scars take time to heal

 

[Not David]

Greek Church recognizes Phanar’s right to grant autocephalies, stops short of recognizing OCU

That's something else. I heard the Ecumenical Patriarch has authority to give autocephalies because of some canons. Is that right or not?