LDS Mormonism and Non-Mormons

[He is the way]

So in your particular ward you do not give testimonies?
Kindly point out what is erroneous.

I came here to point out erroneous statements made by posters and I will keep pointing them out.

 

[Jamesone5]

I came here to point out erroneous statements made by posters and I will keep pointing them out.

And the erroneous or really the avoiding part is when asked, you do not want to talk about your testimony.

Again----What is erroneous?

 

[Ran77]

What do Mormons have to do to reach "exaltation?" It is clear.

Yes, that is clear.

If there is a thread discussing the topic of exaltation, I would be happy to address that topic there. Otherwise, my comments in this thread have been about "Coming unto Christ." Do you have any questions or comments about that?

 

[Ran77]

A Mormon's testimony.

You seem to want to avoid talking about your testimonies. What you Mormons say you believe and "know" as if they are some kind of chant that you hope God will look down at you members and approve.

when a True Believer gives a testimony, It is generally all about what Christ has done in their lives, instead of adding a false prophet and a church or a fictitious writing such as the BoM.

First of all, no one has asked me about testimonies. That makes it impossible for me to have avoided the topic. Exaggerated and inaccurate claims will not help to make your point or refute mine.

Secondly, the topic, for me anyway, is "Coming unto Christ." That is what I am currently discussing.

Third, I recognize that you have given me your thoughts on the testimonies of members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I'm not sure what it is you are expecting me to do with your comments. They aren't asking a question. If that is what you want to believe, it's alright with me.

Finally, I don't deal with "what you Mormons say." I will address our doctrine (our actual beliefs) and I will address what I have said. It would be foolish for me to speak for others. I'm sure they are capable of expressing their beliefs on their own. Now, would you care to deal with what I have stated? Or our doctrine of "Coming unto Christ?"

 

[Jamesone5]

First of all, no one has asked me about testimonies. That makes it impossible for me to have avoided the topic. Exaggerated and inaccurate claims will not help to make your point or refute mine.

Secondly, the topic, for me anyway, is "Coming unto Christ." That is what I am currently discussing.

Third, I recognize that you have given me your thoughts on the testimonies of members of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. I'm not sure what it is you are expecting me to do with your comments. They aren't asking a question. If that is what you want to believe, it's alright with me.

Finally, I don't deal with "what you Mormons say." I will address our doctrine (our actual beliefs) and I will address what I have said. It would be foolish for me to speak for others. I'm sure they are capable of expressing their beliefs on their own. Now, would you care to deal with what I have stated? Or our doctrine of "Coming unto Christ?"

So you agree that you have to give essentially 1/3 billing to your Faith in Christ in your testimony?
Or really a Faith [or a knowing] of Christ is through your Church and your prophets, right?
Are you, as Mormons, not "coming unto Christ" in this manner?

That is the so-called valid testimony I was brought up with and I was corrected when I forgot to add Joseph Smith into my testimony as a child. That particular "knowing" went onto my adulthood. That is one of those doctrines of "coming unto Christ" by the way.

I have heard essentially the same things from missionaries that come by the house, btw.

You are in the postition of telling me I am right or wrong here. The asking bit is those sentences with a question mark behind them.

 

[He is the way]

And the erroneous or really the avoiding part is when asked, you do not want to talk about your testimony.

Again----What is erroneous?

I do have a testimony that Jesus is the Christ and that His church has been restored to the earth in these latter days. You say that Joseph Smith is a false prophet. I say that your statement is erroneous.

 

[Jamesone5]

I do have a testimony that Jesus is the Christ and that His church has been restored to the earth in these latter days. You say that Joseph Smith is a false prophet. I say that your statement is erroneous.

Well I have been a Mormon and after God rescued me---now I have solidly determined that your testimony is partially false or erroneous.

What is the term-- Jesus is the Christ?

 

[He is the way]

Well I have been a Mormon and after God rescued me---now I have solidly determined that your testimony is partially false or erroneous.

What is the term-- Jesus is the Christ?

Jesus Christ, Son of God

 

[Jamesone5]

Jesus Christ, Son of God

Help you out here:
John 20:30-31
30 Andtruly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,and that believing you may have life in His name.

Did Christ say here we have to also include the BoM to believe in Him?



It seems that we have come to a stalemate in, as you say what I say is erroneous without proof, by the way.
And then I say you are speaking it error with a lot of Biblical truth.

So we go to the True Christ for who is in error--maybe at the end of our lives, but hopefully not.

 

[mmksparbud]

Yes, that is clear.

If there is a thread discussing the topic of exaltation, I would be happy to address that topic there. Otherwise, my comments in this thread have been about "Coming unto Christ." Do you have any questions or comments about that?

Exaltation is all about coming to Christ---it is the highest rung on your ladder to God so it is right on topic.

 

[He is the way]

Help you out here:
John 20:30-31
30 Andtruly Jesus did many other signs in the presence of His disciples, which are not written in this book; but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,and that believing you may have life in His name.

Did Christ say here we have to also include the BoM to believe in Him?



It seems that we have come to a stalemate in, as you say what I say is erroneous without proof, by the way.
And then I say you are speaking it error with a lot of Biblical truth.

So we go to the True Christ for who is in error--maybe at the end of our lives, but hopefully not.

You said: "Did Christ say here we have to also include the BoM to believe in Him?"

No He didn't, neither did He say we need the New Testament to believe in Him. However Jesus said we need to keep the commandments to know and LOVE Him.

 

[Jamesone5]

You said: "Did Christ say here we have to also include the BoM to believe in Him?"

No He didn't, neither did He say we need the New Testament to believe in Him. However Jesus said we need to keep the commandments to know and LOVE Him.

John 20:31
but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,and that believing you may have life in His name.

That is to us.

as we reach him by Faith.

However Jesus said we need to keep the commandments to know and LOVE Him---He is the way

1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us

What you are referring to is a form of "blind obedience" You simply have it turned around.

 

[He is the way]

John 20:31
but these are written that you may believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God,and that believing you may have life in His name.

That is to us.

as we reach him by Faith.

However Jesus said we need to keep the commandments to know and LOVE Him---He is the way

1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us

What you are referring to is a form of "blind obedience" You simply have it turned around.

We LOVE Him by keeping the commandments. This is what Jesus said:

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

(New Testament | John 14:24)

24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

(New Testament | 1 John 2:4)

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

If we don't LOVE as the commandments teach us to do how can we know God who is LOVE?

 

[Rescued One]

There are only two churches per Mormonism: the Church of the Lamb of God (headquarters Salt Lake City); all other churches are the Church of the Devil.

Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 14:10
And he said unto me: Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church which is the mother of abominations; and she is the harlot of all the earth.

The only principle upon which they judge me [Joseph Smith] is by comparing my acts with the foolish traditions of their fathers and nonsensical teachings of hireling priests, whose object and aim were to keep the people in ignorance for the sake of filthy lucre; or as the prophet says, to feed themselves, not the flock.
Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Deseret Book, 1977, p. 315

What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world.
Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 270

 

[Jamesone5]

We LOVE Him by keeping the commandments. This is what Jesus said:

(New Testament | John 14:15)

15 ¶ If ye love me, keep my commandments.

(New Testament | John 14:24)

24 He that loveth me not keepeth not my sayings: and the word which ye hear is not mine, but the Father's which sent me.

(New Testament | 1 John 2:4)

4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

If we don't LOVE as the commandments teach us to do how can we know God who is LOVE?

I don't know---- you got it backwards, not I.

Love as the commandments teach you? How would you know what you feel is really this love unless you first felt Christ's love? The verses you quote say nothing about who's first.
But this one does:

1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us

 

[He is the way]

There are only two churches per Mormonism: the Church of the Lamb of God (headquarters Salt Lake City); all other churches are the Church of the Devil.

Book of Mormon, 1 Nephi 14:10
And he said unto me: Behold there are save two churches only; the one is the church of the Lamb of God, and the other is the church of the devil; wherefore, whoso belongeth not to the church of the Lamb of God belongeth to that great church which is the mother of abominations; and she is the harlot of all the earth.

The only principle upon which they judge me [Joseph Smith] is by comparing my acts with the foolish traditions of their fathers and nonsensical teachings of hireling priests, whose object and aim were to keep the people in ignorance for the sake of filthy lucre; or as the prophet says, to feed themselves, not the flock.
Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, Deseret Book, 1977, p. 315

What is it that inspires professors of Christianity generally with a hope of salvation? It is that smooth, sophisticated influence of the devil, by which he deceives the whole world.
Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 270

You said: "There are only two churches per Mormonism: the Church of the Lamb of God (headquarters Salt Lake City); all other churches are the Church of the Devil."

That statement is false. The headquarters of the Church of the Lamb of God is NOT in Salt Lake City. There are not all other churches there are ONLY two churches.

 

[He is the way]

I don't know---- you got it backwards, not I.

Love as the commandments teach you? How would you know what you feel is really this love unless you first felt Christ's love? The verses you quote say nothing about who's first.
But this one does:

1 John 4:19
We love Him because He first loved us

How do you show your LOVE for Christ? That is the important part.

 

[Jamesone5]

You

How do you show your LOVE for Christ? That is the important part.

You have no idea.

 

[mmksparbud]

How do you show your LOVE for Christ? That is the important part.

The first 4 of the 10 commandments show our duty to God, the last 6 show our duty to man. However, none of them can save you, they are duties, Jesus saves. Not a one of yo9u have ever kept the true 4th commandment so you can't claim to keep the commandments of God. You keep the commandments of men, for you do not believe that only the 10 commandments are needed---to attain exaltation, you must keep a bunch of or commandments not in the bible and also must be eternally married in the temple---God never required that. And according to LDS, only those that keep the LDS commandments get to be with the Father where the bible says that He will be with all the saved, not a select few.

Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple therein: for the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are the temple of it.
Rev 21:23 And the city had no need of the sun, neither of the moon, to shine in it: for the glory of God did lighten it, and the Lamb is the light thereof.

Both will always be with us. There is no verse that says anyone must be married in an LDS temple in order to be with The Father and Son.

 

[Rescued One]

Why did Joseph Smith say that Christianity had to be restored?

But the church was already in great measure an apostate institution and even in crude outline of organization and service bore but remote resemblance to the Church of Jesus Christ, founded by the Savior and builded through the instrumentality of the apostles...

Is it to be wondered at, that from the sixteenth century onward, churches of man’s contriving have multiplied with phenomenal rapidity? Churches and churchly organizations professing Christianity as their creed have come to be numbered by hundreds. On every side is heard in this day, “Lo, here is Christ” or “Lo, there.” There are sects named from the circumstances of their origin—as the Church of England; others after their famous founders or promoters—as Lutheran, Calvinist, Wesleyan; some are known by peculiarities of doctrine or plan of administration—as Methodist, Presbyterian, Baptist, Congregationalist; but down to the third decade of the nineteenth century there was no church on earth affirming name or title as the Church of Jesus Christ. The only organization called a church existing at that time and venturing to assert claim to authority by succession was the Catholic church, which for centuries had been apostate and wholly bereft of divine authority or recognition. If the “mother church” be without a valid priesthood, and devoid of spiritual power, how can her offspring derive from her the right to officiate in the things of God? ...The apostate condition of Christendom has been frankly admitted by many eminent and conscientious representatives of the several churches, and by churches as institutions. Even the Church of England acknowledges the awful fact in her official declaration of degeneracy, as set forth in the “Homily Against Peril of Idolatry,” ...
James E. Talmage, Jesus the Christ,
A Study of the Messiah and His Mission according to Holy Scriptures both Ancient and Modern, © 2006
Chapter 40: The Long Night of Apostasy

James E. Talmage(1862-1933) was an English chemist, geologist, and religious leader who served as a member of the Quorum of the Twelve Apostles of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints from 1911 until his death. Wikipedia