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Yeshua was 100% G-d and 100% Man. As a man he had to willingly align his will with the Fathers will....
Its not a perfect example but then, we are human and Adonai is the creator of the universe... this goes beyond our ability to grasp and fully understand
I guess I have always looked at it this way. I am Rob. I am one person. Yet to my wife I am a Husband, to my sons I am a father and to my Father I am a son...
I am not 3 different people I am one person yet I have 3 uniquely distinct and different roles that make me appear very, very different roles. In all 3 roles are completely different and not at all the same. I do not behave with my sons or my father relationally the same way I do as my wife. Nor do I relate the same way with my wife as I do my father. And my sons relate completely differently than either my wife or my father.
Where did that come from? Jesus was a Republican???
Are you halachaly Jewish (Jewish mother)?
If not, is "goyim" appropriate to use?
Actually, I don't think it's appropriate in any case in this forum.
I think most people know and accept that Jesus was a Jew. I don't think there are any "shock revelations" about that ready to hit the Churches.
I guess I have always looked at it this way. I am Rob. I am one person. Yet to my wife I am a Husband, to my sons I am a father and to my Father I am a son...
I am not 3 different people I am one person yet I have 3 uniquely distinct and different roles that make me appear very, very different roles.[/I]
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In the above it seems perfectly reasonable. Your relationships in your example is based on at least three people, giving YOU various titles.
The same with God - Jesus did not say "I and the Father are the same One!" He said instead, "I and the Father are one." John 10:30
Jesus had His own Will, as demonstrated when He prayed to His Father from Gethsemane, and which He aligned with His Father's Will - an act of OBEDIENCE!
Beware of the ones twisted mentally in legal definitions. Legalism is dirtier than fornication.
The word used there is echad... which means one or in total unity.... A man takes a woman as his bride and the two become echad (one) flesh
To share my understanding of this relationship The Father is life all that comes from him is life. His Spirit is literal breath. As his image the spirit of a man is that man. In the same way The Fathers spirit is him. Also like the widows oil no matter how much comes out it is not lessened.when his image speakes it is his will heart and mind in conjunction with his breath giving a form( sound waves). A thing to remember man is dust and ashes his words are not a pure reflextion of himself. The Father on the other hand only speaks truth and what he speaks is his express image. By this Word the creation was formed, Moses recieved the law, the prophets were instructed. At The Fathers appointed time that same word became flesh. As such he lived as flesh and submitted himself to The Father as all flesh should. However he confessed he was the way thetruth the life the resurection the son of man the son of God one with the Father the salvation of YHWH. So hear oh Israel the Lord your God is one, and to the gentiles he has brought to you the spirit of adoption
I can hardly wait until we get to His throne and see all three as one.
I think you only see Jesus then. I think Jesus walking on earth was the best Example of three Persons being one Person and working together, the Father spoke, Jesus spoke what He said, the Holy Spirit did the miracles. Just like with creation.Originally Posted by visionary
I can hardly wait until we get to His throne and see all three as one.
I believe sin has caused the light of God to refract so we don't see 'One' white light but seperate manifestations of this one light, as light passing through a prism.Excellent Point!
Being that Elohim is a Spirit and the Holy Spirit is a Spirit then in whom is Yahweh going to manifest His visible Presence? The name Elohim is as an all encompassing plural, inclusive of Hashalush HaKadosh (Trinity).
John 1:1-3
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was in the beginning with God. All things were made through Him, and without Him nothing was made that was made.
John 3:12
If I have told you earthly things and you do not believe, how will you believe if I tell you heavenly things?
The LORD GOD can take on various visible manifestations. For instance Daniel 7:9 and Revelation 1:14-15. Does anyone believe that they will be able to see a visible manifestation of both the Ancient of Days and Yeshua at the same time sitting beside each other or with Yeshua seated at the right hand of Elohim.
Not from what i've seen within the Messianic Jewish world. Jew and Gentile one in Messiah.... Most Messianics I have met perceive gentiles as merely non-Jews. Not a slur. But I do remember it historically being used as a slur from those within Orthodox Judaism.I know that. But it is also frequently used as a slur against Gentiles.
Makes me think how God must be bored being a being of pure white light, so he speaks.
In my view, the use of it in this thread is intended as a slur.Not from what i've seen within the Messianic Jewish world. Jew and Gentile one in Messiah.... Most Messianics I have met perceive gentiles as merely non-Jews. Not a slur.
Don't pick on the Orthodox, lol. Jews across the spectrum use it, and some of the worse offenders I have met are secular Jews.But I do remember it historically being used as a slur from those within Orthodox Judaism.
Is it OK with you to equate the life giving growth of green chlorophyll with His “Word” as represented by the Tanakh (Torah, Neviim, Ketuvim), the Brit Chadashah, that still small voice and the audible voice of God. Isn't the Trinity of the LORD GOD represented by: The Word (green), The Holy Spirit (blue) and Yeshua Ha Mashiach (red).I believe sin has caused the light of God to refract so we don't see 'One' white light but seperate manifestations of this one light, as light passing through a prism.
In my view, the use of it in this thread is intended as a slur.
Don't pick on the Orthodox, lol. Jews across the spectrum use it, and some of the worse offenders I have met are secular Jews.
In the name of our only One God, by the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, the Shoa has promoted the resurrection of the Church of Jerusalem (Jewish Christianity), the Church of Simon, James, Mathew, Mark, and John.[/FONT][/SIZE]
The Messianic Jews have two important missions, the one to make known Yeshua the Mashiyach among their fellow Jews. The second, not less important, is to be witness to the Pauline Church about the Jewish roots of Christianity and to increase the awareness to that topic in mainstream Christianity.I am saddened that among Messianic Jews, that the Trinity is still an issue of division. Trinity is just a Greek label of what Yeshua has linked in the same sentence: Go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, the Son and of the Holy Spirit.(Mathews 28.19). Could someone helps us in giving an Hebrew label of this linkeage? Those can have only a very limited impact on the Pauline Church who holds to the non-Trinitiarian Modalist Monarchianism that the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost are mere manifestations of the same God. Or in other words, the Father is the Son, the Son is the Holy Ghost.
Could someone translate into Hebraic Father and Son in the formula of “in the Name of the only One Elohim, by the Father, the Son, and the Ruach haKodesh ?
Let us pray Adonai that He leads us on the right path.
Well ... God is not the Author of confusion.
On a basic level I could never entertain the monotheism of, say, followers of Islam. A very lonely self-absorbed unloving god which they have and the one who spends most of eternity, ALL ON HIS little OWN! No! "In the beginning was God" - (Elohiim - plural) and before anything else was made, by the Son of His Love.
In the real Lord's prayer, John 17, Jesus wasn't talking to Himself! He speaks of a Oneness with the Father Who loves Him and prays for His disciples to be One with Them even as He and the Father are One. That is still in the future for us because the Bride hasn't become the Wife, yet, in the Spiritual sense! Read the parable of the wise and foolish virgins - Matthew 25
Jesus, the Originator of Life (Acts 3:15) didn't pray to Himself in Gethsemane and not because He felt mortified over the prospect of having nails spiked into His wrists and feet. He knew that His fellowship with the Father would be riven in a manner that would be equivalent to experiencing eternal separation for a sinner cast into hell. While He was there, the Father was reconciling the world to Himself through His Son as His High Priest and Atoning Sacrifice. Jesus also demonstrated, in Gethsemane, that He had a will and that His Father had another will! He always deferred to His Father's will - they are, after all, not the same Person! Unlike schizophrenics, He wasn't debating with Himself! He was suffering the prospect of broken fellowship, something that not many Christians take seriously enough in their own walk. Jesus learned obedience through suffering - and that was obedience to the Father's will (Heb 5 : 8) and we are called to learn the same walk by denying ourselves.
On that Cross, He prayed to His Father, and in the period of darkness He prayed to Eli (My God) and then when it was "FINISHED" still on the Cross, He was able to pray to His Father to Whom He commended His Spirit.
Regarding the notion offered in the forum that the planet was given to Jesus as a gift is TOTALLY eclipsed by Jesus' own words; "ALL Authority has been given to Me in Heaven and on earth!" Matthew 28 : 18
Most Christians spend more time in other people's books rather than the Inspired Scriptures. That is why so many are confused. The tangible relationship available now, is through the Holy Spirit, the Comforter and the One promised to us by Jesus. Sent that we might be led to the Father along Life's narrow way.
Our Heavenly Father has NO grandchildren!
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