Maybe I belong here?

[Aibrean]

It's about light....

If you are teaching the Ten Commandments are done away with or have been nailed to the cross then you have no light to start with so there is no need to go any further.

So basically you believe that the only Christians are SDA? That is obviously contrary to the Christian Forums forum guidelines.

I believe what is written in Galatians.

Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith."

Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.

As I said before, your idea of light is only based on your interpretation of the Bible.

Colossians 2:13-15 (New International Version)

When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.

My light is based on my interpretation of the Bible...which is quite clear to me.

 

[k4c]

Aibrean; So basically you believe that the only Christians are SDA? That is obviously contrary to the Christian Forums forum guidelines.

If that's what you want to believe but that's not what I said. When God set these standards there were no such thing as SDAs.

I believe what is written in Galatians.

Clearly no one is justified before God by the law, because, "The righteous will live by faith."

Amen! No one is justified by keeping the Law because justification has to do with a past wrong made right. Keeping the Law will not clear me of my past sins.

Before this faith came, we were held prisoners by the law, locked up until faith should be revealed. So the law was put in charge to lead us to Christ that we might be justified by faith. Now that faith has come, we are no longer under the supervision of the law.

And what does the law say? If anyone violates God's law they shall be put to death. But praise God we are not under law but under grace. But that does not mean we can now break God's Law.

I also believe what Romans says.

Romans 6:1-2 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not!

Romans 6:15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!

As I said before, your idea of light is only based on your interpretation of the Bible.

Do you believe it's okay as a life style to worship other gods, worship idols, use God's name in vain, forget to keep the seventh day holy and still say that we love God?

My light is based on my interpretation of the Bible...which is quite clear to me.

Colossians 2:13-15 (New International Version)

When you were dead in your sins and in the uncircumcision of your sinful nature, God made you alive with Christ. He forgave us all our sins, having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross. And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.

That which was against us was our past sins for breaking God's Law. Jesus took our sins away at the cross, not God's Law.

Our sins is what brings the curse upon us from the Law, not the Law itself.

Galatians 3:10-13 For as many as are of the works of the law are under the curse; for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who does not continue in all things which are written in the book of the law, to do them.'' But that no one is justified by the law in the sight of God is evident, for "The just shall live by faith.'' Yet the law is not of faith, but "The man who does them shall live by them.'' Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us (for it is written, "Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree''),

You are cursed if you don't keep the Law, in other words, you sin.

Jesus redeemed us from the curse that the Law brings on because of our sins, not because of the Law.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, "You shall not covet.''

 

[Aibrean]

And that is your interpretation.

Jesus told us to love God and love others. That is the whole point of the law. If you want to follow the commandments, there are more than 10.

I keep every day holy. In everything I do - it is for the glory of God. It is living in the Spirit.

 

[k4c]

And that is your interpretation.

Jesus told us to love God and love others. That is the whole point of the law. If you want to follow the commandments, there are more than 10.

I keep every day holy. In everything I do - it is for the glory of God. It is living in the Spirit.

Jesus also taught us how to love God and love others by maginfying the Law and bringing honor to it.

We should keep everyday holy under both covenants but that does not allow us to forget the Sabbath by working on the seventh day, as though it's just another day.

 

[VictorC]

We should keep everyday holy under both covenants but that does not allow us to forget the Sabbath by working on the seventh day, as though it's just another day.

You cannot be compliant to both covenants, as they are not compatible. This is the reason Jesus took away the first covenant mediated by Moses when He established the new covenant in His Blood: He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Your zeal for the sabbath is an admission that you are bound by the first covenant that conveys no promise of eternal life outside of God's redemption in Jesus Christ.

 

[k4c]

You cannot be compliant to both covenants, as they are not compatible. This is the reason Jesus took away the first covenant mediated by Moses when He established the new covenant in His Blood: He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Your zeal for the sabbath is an admission that you are bound by the first covenant that conveys no promise of eternal life outside of God's redemption in Jesus Christ.

You misinterpreted my words.

 

[Avonia]

Jesus told us to love God and love others.

And there you have it. Now if we could only do more of it.

 

[VictorC]

You misinterpreted my words.

Somehow I doubt that was the case, since you offered nothing as correction to your own post.

 

[k4c]

Somehow I doubt that was the case, since you offered nothing as correction to your own post.

WOW! You came to that conclusion in just my few words? No wonder you always come to the wrong conclusion.

Do you think we should murder people?

How about worshiping other gods, is that good too?

Do you think stealing is a good thing to do?

Do you think everything that came through Moses is null and void?

What are your thoughts regarding divorce?

 

[VictorC]

WOW! You came to that conclusion in just my few words? No wonder you always come to the wrong conclusion.

Do you think we should murder people?

How about worshiping other gods, is that good too?

Do you think stealing is a good thing to do?

Do you think everything that came through Moses is null and void?

What are your thoughts regarding divorce?

But I didn't come to the wrong conclusion, did I? Isn't that the reason you aren't able to clarify your meaning to me?

You cannot be compliant to both covenants, as they are not compatible. This is the reason Jesus took away the first covenant mediated by Moses when He established the new covenant in His Blood: He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Your zeal for the sabbath is an admission that you are bound by the first covenant that conveys no promise of eternal life outside of God's redemption in Jesus Christ.

 

[Aibrean]

Divorce in Mosaic law is permissible. Jesus said it's only permissible if there was adultery. So yes...divorce is for the most part now, null and void.

I wonder how many SDA members who build houses have parapets on them. According to Mosaic laws, new houses built are supposed to have them.

Do you not also observe the month of Abib and celebrate Passover?

 

[k4c]

But I didn't come to the wrong conclusion, did I? Isn't that the reason you aren't able to clarify your meaning to me?

You cannot be compliant to both covenants, as they are not compatible. This is the reason Jesus took away the first covenant mediated by Moses when He established the new covenant in His Blood: He takes away the first that He may establish the second.

Your zeal for the sabbath is an admission that you are bound by the first covenant that conveys no promise of eternal life outside of God's redemption in Jesus Christ.

I clarified it for you but I guess you didn't like my answer. Under the OC is found the curse which says, "If you break the Law you die" Not so under the NC. The NC says God's grace covers us in order to lead us to repentence.

Romans 2:4 Or do you despise the riches of His goodness, forbearance, and longsuffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leads you to repentance?

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? Certainly not! On the contrary, I would not have known sin except through the law. For I would not have known covetousness unless the law had said, "You shall not covet.''

Romans 6:1-2 What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound? Certainly not!

Romans 6:15 What then? Shall we sin because we are not under law but under grace? Certainly not!

Now would you kindly answer my questions, if you can.

Do you think we should murder people?

How about worshiping other gods, is that good too?

Do you think stealing is a good thing to do?

Do you think everything that came through Moses is null and void?

What are your thoughts regarding divorce?

 

[VictorC]

I clarified it for you but I guess you didn't like my answer. Under the OC is found the curse which says, "If you break the Law you die" Not so under the NC. The NC says God's grace covers us in order to lead us to repentence.

No, you didn't clarify your intent. You simply stated I came to the wrong conclusion, and never identified any holy days under the new covenant. You suggested that you need to comply with both the new and the old covenants, which are mutually exclusive as the Scripture I provided proved to you.

I'm waiting for your clarification.

 

[k4c]

No, you didn't clarify your intent. You simply stated I came to the wrong conclusion, and never identified any holy days under the new covenant. You suggested that you need to comply with both the new and the old covenants, which are mutually exclusive as the Scripture I provided proved to you.

I'm waiting for your clarification.

Might I point you to #62.

 

[VictorC]

Might I point you to #62.

All that post contained was a fallacious claim to keep the law we already know God has concluded all noncompliant to, and He did not provide an exemption for you.

I'm still waiting for your clarification about compliance to mutually exclusive covenants, the first of which contains no promise of eternal life to those it retains. That is the one containing the sabbath in lieu of God's rest.

 

[ricker]

For a start you can go here because there is a lot for you to learn. Prophe cy

A lot of crazy stuff there about the RC's. Not much documentation of where the statements and pictures can be verified in context.

I notice that a big point was made that the Catholics number their ten commandments differently, therfore fulfilling the prophesy that the laws would be changed. Of course the RC's have not taken any words away from the Bible, they read them exactly as we do. When a Catholic reads their Bible, the prohibition of graven images is right there, They just consider it to be included with the no other gods command. Nothing is changed.


You do know that almost all other denominations number them as SDA's do, don't you? Most denominations aren't following the Catholics in supposedly changing the laws.

 

[Sophia7]

A lot of crazy stuff there about the RC's. Not much documentation of where the statements and pictures can be verified in context.

I notice that a big point was made that the Catholics number their ten commandments differently, therfore fulfilling the prophesy that the laws would be changed. Of course the RC's have not taken any words away from the Bible, they read them exactly as we do. When a Catholic reads their Bible, the prohibition of graven images is right there, They just consider it to be included with the no other gods command. Nothing is changed.


You do know that almost all other denominations number them as SDA's do, don't you? Most denominations aren't following the Catholics in supposedly changing the laws.

Good point. This is from the official Catholic catechism at the Vatican site. They include the part about graven images in the first commandment:

ARTICLE 1
THE FIRST COMMANDMENT

I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them.3 (Catechism of the Catholic Church - The first commandment)

It is written: "You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve."4​

Also, the catechism's quote of the ten commandments from Exodus 20 here shows that the Catholic Church hasn't removed the commandment against worshiping graven images from their Bible. This is their explanation of their numbering of the ten commandments:

2066 The division and numbering of the Commandments have varied in the course of history. The present catechism follows the division of the Commandments established by St. Augustine, which has become traditional in the Catholic Church. It is also that of the Lutheran confessions. The Greek Fathers worked out a slightly different division, which is found in the Orthodox Churches and Reformed communities. (Catechism of the Catholic Church - The Ten Commandments)
​

Since the Bible itself doesn't number the ten commandments, whatever numbering a person accepts is based on tradition, even if it's not Catholic tradition.

 

[Byfaithalone1]

A lot of crazy stuff there about the RC's. Not much documentation of where the statements and pictures can be verified in context.

I notice that a big point was made that the Catholics number their ten commandments differently, therfore fulfilling the prophesy that the laws would be changed. Of course the RC's have not taken any words away from the Bible, they read them exactly as we do. When a Catholic reads their Bible, the prohibition of graven images is right there, They just consider it to be included with the no other gods command. Nothing is changed.


You do know that almost all other denominations number them as SDA's do, don't you? Most denominations aren't following the Catholics in supposedly changing the laws.

Fascinating.

BFA

 

[ricker]

Since the Bible itself doesn't number the ten commandments, whatever numbering a person accepts is based on tradition, even if it's not Catholic tradition.

Thank you for this clear insight. I was trying to think of a way to state this, and was not successful.

 

[Joe67]

Good point. This is from the official Catholic catechism at the Vatican site. They include the part about graven images in the first commandment:

ARTICLE 1
THE FIRST COMMANDMENT

I am the LORD your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, out of the house of bondage. You shall have no other gods before me. You shall not make for yourself a graven image, or any likeness of anything that is in heaven above, or that is in the earth beneath, or that is in the water under the earth; you shall not bow down to them or serve them.3 (Catechism of the Catholic Church - The first commandment)

It is written: "You shall worship the Lord your God and him only shall you serve."4​

Also, the catechism's quote of the ten commandments from Exodus 20 here shows that the Catholic Church hasn't removed the commandment against worshiping graven images from their Bible. This is their explanation of their numbering of the ten commandments:

2066 The division and numbering of the Commandments have varied in the course of history. The present catechism follows the division of the Commandments established by St. Augustine, which has become traditional in the Catholic Church. It is also that of the Lutheran confessions. The Greek Fathers worked out a slightly different division, which is found in the Orthodox Churches and Reformed communities. (Catechism of the Catholic Church - The Ten Commandments)
​

Since the Bible itself doesn't number the ten commandments, whatever numbering a person accepts is based on tradition, even if it's not Catholic tradition.

Sophia,

My copy of the KJV does not have any numbers with the record of what the Lord, our God, said at Mt. Sinai. Numbers are with divisions of verses, but that does not follow each "thou shall not."

Also, in my copy, the prohibition against idolatry has a section concerning our Lord being a jealous God, visiting iniquity...showing mercy.... I did not see this part in the Catechism of the Catholic church. Did I miss this part?

It is important for us all to realize that the event at Mt. Sinai became a written recorded event after the people had turned away from the Voice of the Lord and asked to be taught by Moses concerning the will of the Lord.

We have all done the same.

Joe