May I ask some questions?

[MariaRegina]

Dear Therese and Suzannah:

By popular devotion some wonderworking icons are embellished with gold, silver and precious gems. Our Lady of Kazan is a good example. I have seen an icon of St. Nicholas that was also embellished with inlays of gold, silver and precious gems.

BTW: My son and I both lost our cell phones recently this new year. Searched everywhere. Finally I told my son to pray to St. Nicholas the Wonderworker (aka Santa Claus). Within seconds I received an sudden insight. I told my son to check his jacket pocket but he said that it wouldn't be in his jacket pocket. He searched for another hour and used our phone to try to make it ring. Nothing. Finally he checked his jacket pocket -- and there it was. The battery had to be recharged! We found my phone within that hour also.

Dear Suzannah:

I think there is a significance here that we might be overlooking. You mentioned that you were a sailor and St. Nicholas is the patron saint of sailors. Perhaps you might consider taking St. Nicholas as your patron saint at your baptism/chrismation. There are female variations: Nicki, Nichole, etc.

Your sister in Christ our God,
Elizabeth

P.S. Please check the thread on Icons -- I have posted some icons for you to see!

 

[Suzannah]

Wow! I did not know that! I will check the other thread!
Thank you!!!!

 

[Suzannah]

I spent the entire afternoon trying to digest what I experienced. Someone came right up to me and introduced himself and then when I said my name, he said, "Oh we're expecting you! Glad you could come!" He sat me on a pew next to a very little old lady who was delightful and kept kissing me. She didn't speak any English but after the Communion, she gave me a piece of bread. And kissed me some more. (She turns out to be the priests great aunt, I believe. And delightfully Greek. )

The liturgy was very difficult for me to follow and understand but it was very clear that the Holy Spirit was in that place! I was a little embarrassed to not understand what was going on but everyone was very friendly....also, during the service, no one was fidgety or looking around , or doing their math homework, which are some of the things that irritate me about my own Baptist church. Also, everyone, although not expensively dressed, looked as though they cared about presenting their very modest, best to the Lord. In my own church, people come in Metallica t-shirts. I've even seen Hells' Angel t-shirts. To me, this is just indicative of a right attitude toward worship. Maybe I'm just OLD.

Anyway, it's very hard for to process everything all at once. But let me tell all of you: I am very impressed so far by: your friendliness, your honesty, your williness to answer questions with a straight answer (no beating around the bush), and the obvious : you really DO have something we don't have!

 

[Photini]

Suzannah,

I am very happy for you. It takes a little while, but you will start to catch on to some of the phrases in the Liturgy. The Liturgy books in my parish have the Greek, phonetics, and English on the pages, so it makes it a little easier to follow. The Greek language has really grown on me.
Now the church feels like home to me. I spend my week looking forward to church.

 

[Philip]

The liturgy was very difficult for me to follow and understand but it was very clear that the Holy Spirit was in that place!

I felt the same way after my first Divine Liturgy. I printed a copy I downloaded and took it with me for a few weeks until I caught on.

Anyway, it's very hard for to process everything all at once. But let me tell all of you: I am very impressed so far by: your friendliness, your honesty, your williness to answer questions with a straight answer (no beating around the bush), and the obvious : you really DO have something we don't have!

I am glad you had a positive experience, and I want to thank you for interest and respect. Please feel free to continue to ask question. I am sure the priest at the parish you attended would be even more willing to address any questions you have.

 

[Matrona]

I spend my week looking forward to church.

You're not alone! I love going to church. I go to both Wednesday Vespers and Saturday Vespers--I feel renewed afterwards, even if it is "just" reader's vespers. "Gladsome Light" is always getting stuck in my head.

Nothing compares to the liturgy, though... I think I would have gone batty at home if I hadn't had my Mystical Supper CD. And I can't wait until Lent!

 

[Anastasia]

Suzhanna, my heart swells with excitement for you! I felt everything you did when I first walked into my GO church (I'm in the process of being baptized) but after a while the language is no longer a barrier. You learn to follow along with a Divine Liturgy book and even so, when I get lost I just immerse myself in the Holy Spirit and my blessed surroundings. Soon enough you'll feel at home!

I too appreciate the proper, modest dress. At my Roman Catholic church people would show up in shorts and flip flops!

Your Sister In Christ,
Anastasia

 

[Photini]

You're not alone! I love going to church. I go to both Wednesday Vespers and Saturday Vespers--I feel renewed afterwards, even if it is "just" reader's vespers. "Gladsome Light" is always getting stuck in my head.

Nothing compares to the liturgy, though... I think I would have gone batty at home if I hadn't had my Mystical Supper CD. And I can't wait until Lent!

Matrona,

Because my parish priest lives so far from church...all we have is the Liturgy on Sundays. There are exceptions during Lent and Pascha, and some other Feasts...but this is very hard. I would very much love to attend Vespers, especially on Saturdays. I can hardly wait for Lent!!! I love attending the Akathist services every Friday. There's usually not very many people there, and it is so peaceful. Hopefully in the next couple of weeks, I'll be making another trip to the monastery. I can hardly wait. I'm running out of *gas* so to speak, and need my tank refilled.

 

[Suzannah]

keeps "blessing" me....I think it's someone from here.....I don't know who you are, but THANK YOU...and in kind, I am going to bless Anastasia for being the last person to post in my thread and for being so sweet to say she understood!

Anyway, here's my question: It's taken me all day to formulate this. If I am being irreverent, please understand my Protestant background. I am having trouble with one thing I saw today: the prostration of the congregation. This probably goes back to my "sola scriptura" roots....I am having trouble processing this, although I see entirely where it comes from: an adoration for God. I agree with it, actually, but perhaps my own pride is getting in the way. I am having trouble seeing myself do this. I grew up in missionary churches in Africa and Iran and so seeing petitioners of "God" prostrate themselves on a kilim is not new to me, as a visual sight. But it IS unusual for me to see Christians doing this.

During the service, the "L-O-L" (little old lady) did NOT do this....I understand it was probably from age. When everyone else began to do it, it really startled me and I must have made some physical sign of discomfort, so she leaned over put her hand on my heart and just kissed my cheek. I'm not sure I understood what she was trying to convey, if anything. It was just an uncomfortable moment for me. Please tell me this: did Martin Luther do this? I guess what I'm getting at is trying to find some common ground here???? Please help me with this???
Thank you!

p.s: the small lunch afterward was very nice and I felt very welcome. I had "real" Greek olive sala and homemade bread! Excellent!

pss: the priest and his wife were very kind to me. She has a title that I cannot remember and I will be horrified if I don't use it when appropriate??? What is her title and when do I use it????
They have given me their phone number to call with questions, so yes, Philip, you are right! They are very kind to this sinner!

 

[Photini]

The wife of a priest is called Presbytera....or in Russian it's Matushka

 

[Oblio]

I grew up in missionary churches in Africa and Iran and so seeing petitioners of "God" prostrate themselves on a kilim is not new to me, as a visual sight. But it IS unusual for me to see Christians doing this.

If they were Muslim, remember that Islam started as a heretical sect of Christianity and they hijacked and perverted many of our customs. Prostrations is one of them. Prayers at set times of the day are another. Both of these have their origins in Orthodox Christianity. Here is a visual one for you. Ever notice how mosques have a round dome just like Greek Orthodox Churches ? After they invaded, killed, raped and enslaved Christians, they then stole their churches, lopped off the crosses, plastered over (or removed) the mosaics and frescoes and erected the minnaretes and turned them into mosques.

 

[Suzannah]

Oblio: excellent post! Yes, I remember this from History classes! Yes, I am seeing it....so Yes, Martin Luther, the founder of Protestantism did this also....wow! Eye-opener!

 

[Philip]

Anyway, here's my question: It's taken me all day to formulate this. If I am being irreverent, please understand my Protestant background. I am having trouble with one thing I saw today: the prostration of the congregation. This probably goes back to my "sola scriptura" roots....I am having trouble processing this, although I see entirely where it comes from: an adoration for God. I agree with it, actually, but perhaps my own pride is getting in the way. I am having trouble seeing myself do this. I grew up in missionary churches in Africa and Iran and so seeing petitioners of "God" prostrate themselves on a kilim is not new to me, as a visual sight. But it IS unusual for me to see Christians doing this.

During the service, the "L-O-L" (little old lady) did NOT do this....I understand it was probably from age. When everyone else began to do it, it really startled me and I must have made some physical sign of discomfort, so she leaned over put her hand on my heart and just kissed my cheek. I'm not sure I understood what she was trying to convey, if anything. It was just an uncomfortable moment for me. Please tell me this: did Martin Luther do this? I guess what I'm getting at is trying to find some common ground here???? Please help me with this???

I can not say for certain what Luther did, but in the Catholic Church today, it is common for prayers to be offered while kneeling upright. I assume he prayed this way. If the similarity in posture of an Orthodox Christian and a Muslem praying is bothering you, try putting it in historical perspective: Islam was created in lands where Orthodoxy was common. It has often been pointed out by historians that Muhommad copied many practices from Christianity. We can also look at it from a Biblical point of view: the Hebrew word shachah and the Greek word proskuneo are both translated as "worship". Both refer to the physical act of prostration.

pss: the priest and his wife were very kind to me. She has a title that I cannot remember and I will be horrified if I don't use it when appropriate??? What is her title and when do I use it????

This depends on the parish and the Presbytera. In my parish, we sometimes refer to her as ummum (Arabic for "mother") or Khouria. Some people just use the title "Mother".

 

[Philip]

I guess I need to hit the refresh button from time to time to be sure Oblio isn't stealing my thunder.

 

[Reader Nilus]

An Orthodox priest's wife is known as Presbytera, in a Greek Church, in a Russian Church as Matushka, and in an Arab Church Khouria.
Jeff the Finn

 

[Suzannah]

All of you are so helpful! I have to say this: during the service, while I was looking around at the icons, the little old lady next to me (her name is not producible here: I can pronounce it but not spell it: something like this: Theotika Papandrayou) she kept pointing to the one that seemed to have the Gospel story printed on it. I think she was trying to tell me that this was her message to me. She was very sweet to me, and I think if they made her an ambassador, they would convert the entire world. She sat with me at lunch and showed me her necklace: it was a square gold pendant with a saint on it, and a ship in the background. So, on the leaf page of my bible, I drew her a picture of my "life", showing her I was a sailor. She started kissing me again, and I seemed to understand that her husband was a sailor. I don't know why I am telling you this except that it was so very touching to me. She looked, except for no habit, a lot like Mother Theresa whom I have always admired and revered.
I am just reeling from the experience of the day, I guess!

Also, the priest and his wife, shared with me a list of other Orthodox churches in the area. There are only three, including theirs. I live in a very rural area of Nevada, in the interior desert.
I was touched that they were not "claiming" monopoly, but sharing with me, the "others".
This is something you NEVER see, in Protestantism.

 

[MariaRegina]

All of you are so helpful! I have to say this: during the service, while I was looking around at the icons, the little old lady next to me (her name is not producible here: I can pronounce it but not spell it: something like this: Theotika Papandrayou) she kept pointing to the one that seemed to have the Gospel story printed on it. I think she was trying to tell me that this was her message to me. She was very sweet to me, and I think if they made her an ambassador, they would convert the entire world. She sat with me at lunch and showed me her necklace: it was a square gold pendant with a saint on it, and a ship in the background. So, on the leaf page of my bible, I drew her a picture of my "life", showing her I was a sailor. She started kissing me again, and I seemed to understand that her husband was a sailor. I don't know why I am telling you this except that it was so very touching to me. She looked, except for no habit, a lot like Mother Theresa whom I have always admired and revered.
I am just reeling from the experience of the day, I guess!

Also, the priest and his wife, shared with me a list of other Orthodox churches in the area. There are only three, including theirs. I live in a very rural area of Nevada, in the interior desert.
I was touched that they were not "claiming" monopoly, but sharing with me, the "others".
This is something you NEVER see, in Protestantism.

Dear Suzannah:

Several Orthodox Priests have told me that certain personalities do better in different Orthodox Churches. The Russians seem to be more melancholic, more reserved, more introverted, while the Antiochian and Greeks tend to be less reserved or extroverted.

Hope this help.
Elizabeth

 

[Suzannah]

To Chanter: Wonderful! I probably belong in the Russian church then! ( i am an introvert and not very given to expression; it's diffucult for me.) There is a Russian Orthodox church about forty miles each way....I will go back to the Greek church, to express my gratitude and explain my search, and then try the Russian church. I feel very obligated to express my thanks for their welcome of me, and their hospitality. The priest and his wife are very spiritual people, as I recognize and Iknow they will understand!

 

[MariaRegina]

To Chanter: Wonderful! I probably belong in the Russian church then! ( i am an introvert and not very given to expression; it's diffucult for me.) There is a Russian Orthodox church about forty miles each way....I will go back to the Greek church, to express my gratitude and explain my search, and then try the Russian church. I feel very obligated to express my thanks for their welcome of me, and their hospitality. The priest and his wife are very spiritual people, as I recognize and Iknow they will understand!

Suzannah

That was a generalization. There are many introverts within the Greek Church -- those are the quiet folk.

 

[Suzannah]

Okay! Call me one of the "quiet folk"...that's me! I feel so overwhelmed. I feel like "What have I been missing all my life???" I'm almost fifty years old, and I feel very much like an overgrown child ...like this is an "epiphany" for me. I named my daughter for a cityin israel, and now I feel like a fool????

Question: What is the Orthodox church position on the "Great Commission"? How have they fulfilled this?

When I look at the world, teh only people I see expressing Christ's comission to the world is teh evangelicals, of which I am one? Am I missing something important here???