Matt 1:21 He Shall save His People

[Jack Terrence]

He shall see His Seed !

Isa 53:10

10 Yet it pleased the Lord to bruise him; he hath put him to grief: when thou shalt make his soul an offering for sin, he shall see his seed, he shall prolong his days, and the pleasure of the Lord shall prosper in his hand.

This His Seed is a Seed that Belongs to Christ, Yes Christ has a Seed or offspring, descendants, children and they are those Chosen in Him before the foundation Eph 1:4; They were given to Him as a Spiritual Seed, just as they were given to adam as a physical, natural seed; and they were Christ's Seed prior to being Adam's, for Christ has the preeminence in all things Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Now as His Seed, they shall have the Spirit poured out upon them as the fulfillment of this Promise Isa 44:1-3

Yet now hear, O Jacob my servant; and Israel, whom I have chosen:

2 Thus saith the Lord that made thee, and formed thee from the womb, which will help thee; Fear not, O Jacob, my servant; and thou, Jesurun, whom I have chosen.

3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

This is why Christ at His Resurrection and Ascension to the Right Hand of God, He was given the Spirit of Promise to pour upon His Spiritual Offspring that He died for Acts 2:30-33

30 Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne;

31 He seeing this before spake of the resurrection of Christ, that his soul was not left in hell, neither his flesh did see corruption.

32 This Jesus hath God raised up, whereof we all are witnesses.

33 Therefore being by the right hand of God exalted, and having received of the Father the promise of the Holy Ghost, he hath shed forth this, which ye now see and hear.


Paul realizes this here Titus 3:5-6

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

That word shed also means to pour ekcheo:

I pour out (liquid or solid); I shed, bestow liberally.

Thats what Isa 44:3 foretold

3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

This Pouring of the Spirit on them also saves them Titus 3:5-6

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

So in order for Matt 1:21 to be complete, to save His People from their sins, this aspect of must also some to pass, the Regenerating Operations of the Spirit must also save them through the Work of Christ ! He saves His People, Seed from their sins !6

Again you are wrenching Old Testament Scriptures out of their context. Isaiah is addressing Judah and Israel. Paul said that the salvation of the Gentiles was not revealed to the Old Testament prophets. He said that it was a "mystery" that had been given him by direct Revelation (Ephesians 3). Furthermore, Paul clearly said that the Gentiles are now included because of Israel's disobedience. Therefore, if Israel had obeyed and the
Gentiles had not been included Matthew 1:21 would have been complete.

Your anachronistic approach to the Scriptures simply does not work. You are in effect denying that the Gentiles were once "not my people" and "not loved." Jesus said that he was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. He called the Gentile woman "dog." This statement is recorded in the very book in which the angel told Joseph that he came to save "his people" from their sins. If Jesus knew the Gentiles as his people at that time, then why did he say that he was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel? Why did he call the Gentile woman a dog?

My point that the Calvinist interpretation of Matthew 1:21 implies that Gentiles do not have salvation still stands unrefuted by you.

 

[Brightfame52]

But the Church didn't exist when the angel spoke to Joseph in Matt 1:21.

Yes it did exist, as much as Christ Jesus the head of the church existed. When was Jesus without His Body the Church, Col 1:15-18

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

 

[Brightfame52]

Again you are wrenching Old Testament Scriptures out of their context. Isaiah is addressing Judah and Israel. Paul said that the salvation of the Gentiles was not revealed to the Old Testament prophets. He said that it was a "mystery" that had been given him by direct Revelation (Ephesians 3). Furthermore, Paul clearly said that the Gentiles are now included because of Israel's disobedience. Therefore, if Israel had obeyed and the
Gentiles had not been included Matthew 1:21 would have been complete.

Your anachronistic approach to the Scriptures simply does not work. You are in effect denying that the Gentiles were once "not my people" and "not loved." Jesus said that he was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. He called the Gentile woman "dog." This statement is recorded in the very book in which the angel told Joseph that he came to save "his people" from their sins. If Jesus knew the Gentiles as his people at that time, then why did he say that he was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel? Why did he call the Gentile woman a dog?

My point that the Calvinist interpretation of Matthew 1:21 implies that Gentiles do not have salvation still stands unrefuted by you.

Jesus seed is and was a Spiritual Seed, His People, and they would have the Spirit poured on them Identifying them as His Seed. Gentiles were Identified by the Spirit being poured on them like it was with the jewish segment of His seed, so Peter said:

Acts 10:45


And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This fufilled :

Isa 44:3 foretold

3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

Now whoever is given the Spirit is Identified as His People, belonging to Him, Jew or Gentile Rom 8:9

9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Race doesnt matter, if one isnt eventually sealed by the Spirit, they dont belong to Christ, they are not His People He came to save Matt 1:21

You have been deceived !

 

[zoidar]

Yes it did exist, as much as Christ Jesus the head of the church existed. When was Jesus without His Body the Church, Col 1:15-18

15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

It's not the Church that is the beginning, Christ is the beginning...

 

[Brightfame52]

It's not the Church that is the beginning, Christ is the beginning...

Christ is the Beginning, and so as Head of the Church His Body, its in the beginning. Christ has never existed without a Body, He would have been a bodiless Head, yet Hes the same always Heb 13:8

8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Do you deny Christs existence in the OT times ?

 

[zoidar]

Christ is the Beginning, and so as Head of the Church His Body, its in the beginning. Christ has never existed without a Body, He would have been a bodiless Head, yet Hes the same always Heb 13:8

8 Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and to day, and for ever.

Do you deny Christs existence in the OT times ?

Of course not! But you can't be a head of a body before it exists. The Church didn't exist from the beginning, so Christ can not have been its head from the beginning, since there was no Church to be head of.

 

[Brightfame52]

Of course not! But you can't be a head of a body before it exists. The Church didn't exist from the beginning, so Christ can not have been its head from the beginning, since there was no Church to be head of.

So Christ and His Body are One, from the beginning Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Do you believe Adam was a head before Christ was a Head ? If so, Adam has the preeminence over Christ in headship.

Right now you saying Christ was a Bodiless Head, even worse, not a Head at all at the beginning of the world, which I think is blasphemous !

 

[zoidar]

So Christ and His Body are One, from the beginning Col 1:18

18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Do you believe Adam was a head before Christ was a Head ? If so, Adam has the preeminence over Christ in headship.

Right now you saying Christ was a Bodiless Head, even worse, not a Head at all at the beginning of the world, which I think is blasphemous !

If you like to take it there you could from a point of view say Christ was "the Church" from the beginning, but that is semantics and not Paul's point at all in Col 1:18.

Feel free to tell where the Church was when only the Triune God existed.

 

[Brightfame52]

If you like to take it there you could from a point of view say Christ was "the Church" from the beginning, but that is semantics and not Paul's point at all in Col 1:18.

Feel free to tell where the Church was when only the Triune God existed.

Hey if you dont believe it, God isnt giving you understanding, may as well move right along The church simply is believers in Christ, any OT Believer who believed in Christ was part of the Body of Christ, part of the household of Faith, the Called Out Ones. Everybody in Heb 11 who was given Faith, they were part of the Church, Christs Body that He was Head. And Im leaving it at that

 

[Brightfame52]

@zoidar

Feel free to tell where the Church was when only the Triune God existed.

Same place Christ was when only the Triune God Existed 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

The Church was in their Head Christ Jesus, in the Godhead. Ps 90:1-2

Lord, thou hast been our dwelling place in all generations.

2 Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.

 

[zoidar]

Hey if you dont believe it, God isnt giving you understanding, may as well move right along The church simply is believers in Christ, any OT Believer who believed in Christ was part of the Body of Christ, part of the household of Faith, the Called Out Ones. Everybody in Heb 11 who was given Faith, they were part of the Church, Christs Body that He was Head. And Im leaving it at that

I see, it's a theological perspective you have. Still, there is no mentioning of old testament believers being the Church. Sure I believe they are included into the Church through the New Covenant, as the Church was grounded by the death and resurrection of Christ.

The word "Church" is not mentioned in Heb 11.

@zoidar



Same place Christ was when only the Triune God Existed 2 Tim 1:9

9 Who hath saved us, and called us with an holy calling, not according to our works, but according to his own purpose and grace, which was given us in Christ Jesus before the world began,

The Church was in their Head Christ Jesus, in the Godhead. Ps 90:1-2

Lord, thou hast been our dwelling place in all generations.

2 Before the mountains were brought forth, or ever thou hadst formed the earth and the world, even from everlasting to everlasting, thou art God.

You believe we were in Christ before we were in Christ by faith? How?

 

[Brightfame52]

I see, it's a theological perspective you have. Still, there is no mentioning of old testament believers being the Church. Sure I believe they are included into the Church through the New Covenant, as the Church was grounded by the death and resurrection of Christ.

The word "Church" is not mentioned in Heb 11.


You believe we were in Christ before we were in Christ by faith? How?

Im moving on now.

 

[zoidar]

Im moving on now.

Ok fine! At least I hope I got you something to think about.

God bless!

 

[Brightfame52]

His People are His Portion !

Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Again, who are His People that its Promised He shall save from their sins ? Many ignorantly think it to be the jews, the physical seed of Abraham, yet that is a delusion, however they are His Portion:

Deut 32:9

For the Lord's portion is his people; Jacob is the lot of his inheritance.

Thats who Jesus People are, His Portion, His Inheritance !

hence portion, i.e. (acquired) possession:

David writes of these here Ps 2:7-8

7 I will declare the decree: the Lord hath said unto me, Thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee.

8 Ask of me, and I shall give thee the heathen for thine inheritance, and the uttermost parts of the earth for thy possession.

They are the Church Redeemed Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works.

The word peculiar is the greek word periousios:

costly, treasured, select, specially chosen.

of one's own possession

that which is one's own, belongs to one's possessions,

a people selected by God from the other nations for his own possession, Titus 2:14

Thats the same as Deut 32:9 ! Its the Church ! Thats the " His People He shall save from their sins " or Redeem from all iniquity Titus 2:14, that's the same thing ! 4

 

[Brightfame52]

The consequences of their sins !

Within the Promise that Jesus shall save His People from their sins Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

That word from the prep apo means:

from, away from.

of any kind of separation of one thing from another by which the union or fellowship of the two is destroyed;

Christ shall and did save His People from all the penal consequences of their sins. This would include but not limited to spiritual death, which is a consequence of their sins !

God warned Man in Adam that in the day that he ate from the forbidden Tree, that he would surely die Gen 2:16-17

16 And the Lord God commanded the man, saying, Of every tree of the garden thou mayest freely eat:

17 But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

This brought about also spiritual death to God, whereby all men as a consequence of sin are born alienated from the Life of God, that's death , spiritual separation from God Eph 4:18; Col 1:21, and so for Jesus to be faithful to what it is stated He shall do for His People in saving them from their sins, He must save them from all the negative consequences of their sin/sins which includes spiritual death, they must be made alive by Him 1 Cor 15:45

And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

That word quickening the verb ζῳοποιέω:

I make that which was dead to live, cause to live, quicken.

So its translated appropriately

45 So also it is written, The first man Adam became a living soul. The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.ASV

He causes them that were spiritually dead to God, to live to God, hence reversing the dreadful consequences of their sins, spiritual death ! If that does not occur for each and everyone Christ died for, then we may conclude that Matt 1:21 is a False Testimony to what Christ shall do ! 4

 

[Brightfame52]

His People is His Church that He came to redeem !

Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Ps 111:9

He sent redemption/liberation unto his people: he hath commanded his covenant for ever: holy and reverend is his name.

The same is stated of the NT Church Titus 2:14

14 Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem/liberate us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people of His Own Possession, zealous of good works.

Which again speaks of the Church that He gave Himself for Eph 5:25

25 Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it;

God sends redemption unto His People the Church foundationed upon the Everlasting Covenant confirmed in Christ its Surety, so His People are redeemed by the Blood of the Everlasting Covenant Heb 13:20, known also as the New Covenant Matt 26:28

28 For this is my blood of the new testament, which is shed for many[My People] for the remission of sins. 4

 

[Brightfame52]

He shall save, not maybe save, His People from their sins !


Matt 1:21

21 And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins.

Did you not know, Jesus could not have saved His People from their sins or successfully seek and save that which was Lost Lk 19:10

10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.

BTW the objects to Save in Matt 1:21 and here in Lk 19:10 are the exact same ones,

Yet He could not have saved them if He was not the One that applied Salvation to their Lost case !

The Saviour, in order to be a legitimist Saviour must effect the Application of Salvation !

So when we read in Titus 3:5-6 of those being saved :

5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us[applied Salvation], by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;

How ? Vs 6

6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour;

The application is the shedding on abundantly of the renewing of the Holy Ghost through Jesus Christ Our Saviour !

The Saviour through the Work of the Spirit actually does put into effect or action our Salvation, and without this, He would not be True to the Promise that He shall save His People from their sins ! The Saviour must be given the Credit for the ones He is to save experimental , practical Salvation ! 5

 

[Jack Terrence]

Jesus seed is and was a Spiritual Seed, His People, and they would have the Spirit poured on them Identifying them as His Seed. Gentiles were Identified by the Spirit being poured on them like it was with the jewish segment of His seed, so Peter said:

Acts 10:45


And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.

This fufilled :

Isa 44:3 foretold

3 For I will pour water upon him that is thirsty, and floods upon the dry ground: I will pour my spirit upon thy seed, and my blessing upon thine offspring:

Now whoever is given the Spirit is Identified as His People, belonging to Him, Jew or Gentile Rom 8:9

9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.

Race doesnt matter, if one isnt eventually sealed by the Spirit, they dont belong to Christ, they are not His People He came to save Matt 1:21

You have been deceived !

You keep referring to Old Testament prophecies about Israel and applying them to Gentiles. Again Paul said that the inclusion of the Gentiles was not revealed to the Old Testament prophets. Why do you contradict Christ's chosen apostle?

 

[Brightfame52]

You keep referring to Old Testament prophecies about Israel and applying them to Gentiles. Again Paul said that the inclusion of the Gentiles was not revealed to the Old Testament prophets. Why do you contradict Christ's chosen apostle?

Im explaining how Jesus fulfils His sacred mission of saving His People from their sins.

 

[zoidar]

Im explaining how Jesus fulfils His sacred mission of saving His People from their sins.

Jesus mission is taking on the sins of the world, that whoever believes will be saved.

“For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life. For God did not send the Son into the world to judge the world, but that the world might be saved through Him.
— John 3:16-17