Masons

[Rev Wayne]

Freemasonry tolerates and encourages the worship of false gods at the same time "Christian" Masons worship the Triune God of the Bible under the canopy term GAOTU, which only applies to Him.

I pray to God as Creator, whether in Lodge or in Church, for that is who He is. No one prays to “Allah” or “Vishnu” or any other of the names used by other religions. Therefore there is no offense, because there is no “false god” mentioned in lodge, nor is there any “name” prayed to. The prayers of Masonry that are form prayers use a variety of terms of address: “Most holy and glorious Lord God,” “the Great Architect of the Universe,” “the giver of all good gifts and graces,” “O Lord God,” “most glorious and eternal Lord God,” “source of light, and of life, and of love,” “eternal God,” “author of all good,” “giver of all mercy,” “Almighty and ever glorious and gracious Lord God, Creator of all things,” “O Thou Preserver of men,” etc. The expressions in the prayers are expressions from mid-to-late medieval England’s Christian prayers. If there are concepts beyond the idea of Sovereign or the idea that God is Creator, they are not declared in the prayers of Masonry. Those would have to be formed in the individual heart.

Compare the opening prayer of the lodge, with a contemporary prayer from the church of the same historical time fram. Since I have read in Masonic history accounts that the expressions in ritual and prayers is the language of Roman Catholic prayers of the time, I will select one from that general time and church. The prayer of blessing of the Saint Benedict Medal ought to be sufficient:

O Almighty God, the Giver of all good gifts, we humbly beseech Thee that Thou wouldst bestow, through the intercession of the holy Father St. Benedict, Thy blessing upon these Medals, their letters and characters designed by Thee, that all who wear them and strive to perform good works may obtain health of body and soul, the grace of salvation, the indulgences conceded to us, and by the assistance of Thy mercy, escape the snares and deceptions of the devil and appear holy and stainless in Thy sight. Through Christ Our Lord. Amen
(This particular quote of the prayer found at http://www.penitents.org/giftshopBenMedal.htm )

And now the opening prayer of our lodge, Ahiman Rezon p. 56:

Most holy and glorious Lord God, the great Architect of the Universe, the giver of all good gifts and graces; Thou hast promised that, “where two or three are gathered together in thy name, thou wilt be in the midst of them, and bless them.” In thy name we assemble, most humbly beseeching Thee to bless us in all our undertakings, that we may know and serve Thee aright, and that all our actions may tend to Thy glory, and to our advancement in knowledge and virtue. And we beseech Thee, O Lord God, to bless our present assembling, and to illuminate our minds, that we may walk in the light of Thy countenance; and when the trials of our probationary state are over, be admitted into THE TEMPLE “not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.”

COMPARISON:

(1) Address:

Benedict: “O Almighty God”
Masonry: “Most holy and glorious Lord God”

(2) Attribution:

Benedict: “the Giver of all good gifts”
Masonry: “the Giver of all good gifts and graces”

(3) Petition:

Benedict: “we humbly beseech Thee”
Masonry: “most humbly beseeching Thee”

(4) Blessing asked:

Benedict: “that Thou wouldst bestow. . . Thy blessing upon these Medals”
Masonry: “to bless us in all our undertakings”

(5) Purpose desired:

Benedict: “that all who wear them and strive to perform good works may obtain health of body and soul, the grace of salvation”
Masonry: “that we may know and serve Thee aright, and that all our actions may tend to Thy glory, and to our advancement in knowledge and virtue.”

(6) Divine aid and redemption sought:

Benedict: “and by the assistance of Thy mercy, escape the snares and deceptions of the devil and appear holy and stainless in Thy sight”

Masonry: “that we may walk in the light of Thy countenance; and when the trials of our probationary state are over, be admitted into THE TEMPLE “not made with hands, eternal in the heavens.”

The prayer is in the form and format of a medieval Christian prayer. The only difference is, the Christian prayer ends with “Through Christ our Lord.” The Masonic prayer, obviously, does not because, having arisen during the same period of medieval history and the Reformation, and the Masons being a group originally Christian but not “officially” Christian through the Church of Rome, they were in danger for their lives if they used such open expressions of their Christian faith. Understand Medieval terms like "beseeching," understand the history and religious climate of the period, and understand the forms of medieval prayers, and the origin of the same things in Masonry becomes crystal clear.

 

[ZionKnight]

Apparently the boo-birds flew north for the summer?

Hellooooo mason dudes! Sorry for the extended sabatical, but, I could not access CF for a long time until now. It would always come up as a big jumble of boxes. I guess I caught bird flu, now, I'm not a die hard conspiracy theorist or anything but....maybe....naw.

Either way I am going to assume that everyone is done here?

 

[ZionKnight]

Because, "Thy blessing upon these medals"?
Are you talking about ones you wear?

 

[Rev Wayne]

Because, "Thy blessing upon these medals"?
Are you talking about ones you wear?

You might want to take another look. I was comparing an old Catholic prayer with lodge prayer. The part about the medals did not come from the Masonic prayer.

 

[ZionKnight]

Yeah, I can read. I just assumed that since you used this prayer that you knew what medals they were talking about.

 

[Rev Wayne]

I'm just trying to figure out what the medals had to do with anything, since the point was, the similarities of expression in the prayers.

 

[chaoschristian]

Perhaps one should not be looking for physical medals per se, but more ancient and arcane usages of the word. Look at the parallel in the Masonic prayer, I think that gives a hint.

 

[Rev Wayne]

Arcane usage? Hints? Wouldn't it be more helpful to state whatever it is you're trying to say?

 

[Abbadon]

"To bless us in our undertakings."

Nothing really arcane there. Medals aren't even mentioned. Medals pretty much would have mean "medal, medallion," in the Benedictine prayer, and St. Benedict was far from being a Roger Bacon. No alchemy (at that time, Greek philosophy with medieval science) there.

The Benedictine prayer is asking for the medals to be blessed as a good behavior and thinking reminder for the person wearing them and stuff. The Masons are just cutting out the middle man.

Nothing really arcane there.

 

[Rev Wayne]

"To bless us in our undertakings."

In rethinking this, I think perhaps I see what was being said, and it appears to be valid. "Undertakings" in comparison with "medals" could certainly be compared metaphorically, since medals are given in response to actions. In fact, it has even been used in this metaphorical sense by Everett C. Olson in his autobiographical work, The Other Side of the Medal, in which he recounts events in his career as a paleontologist, revealing a human side to a career of distinction.

And the Masonic apron is called, in a similar sense, the "badge of a Mason."

 

[chaoschristian]

My error was in not quoting the person to whom my response was directed.

My response is aimed at ZionKnight, not Rev Wayne.

Now to clarify what I was talking about: I believe that 'medal' has an older, now obsolete, meaning that is synonamous with 'undertakings.'

I need to dig out a direct usage reference to be sure.

 

[ZionKnight]

While I wouldn't doubt any dilliberate reference to the word medals by an organization with hundreds of years of experience of wrapping stuff up in double meanings and subtext, I was genuinely curious about the medals that these catholics were expecting to be enchanted somehow.

That being said, I am now even more curious about what you may be on to, chaos. Please let us know what you find.

 

[ZionKnight]

In rethinking this, I think perhaps I see what was being said, and it appears to be valid. "Undertakings" in comparison with "medals" could certainly be compared metaphorically, since medals are given in response to actions. In fact, it has even been used in this metaphorical sense by Everett C. Olson in his autobiographical work, The Other Side of the Medal, in which he recounts events in his career as a paleontologist, revealing a human side to a career of distinction.

And the Masonic apron is called, in a similar sense, the "badge of a Mason."

I know I'm rehashing old subjects, but this does bring us back to the suggestion of salvation, (entry in to that grand temple in the sky,) through works, or undertakings.
And I know that faith without works is dead, and this is key to my understanding of methodist doctrine, but so far the masons have been described as ambiguous about faith at best, and very emphasized on works and the illumination of the mind. (the word illumination must be spoken with your best 'spooky' voice to get the full effect.)

Niether a show of faith without works, or of faith by works, but more like faith in the works.

 

[Rev Wayne]

I know I'm rehashing old subjects, but this does bring us back to the suggestion of salvation, (entry in to that grand temple in the sky,) through works, or undertakings.
And I know that faith without works is dead, and this is key to my understanding of methodist doctrine, but so far the masons have been described as ambiguous about faith at best, and very emphasized on works and the illumination of the mind. (the word illumination must be spoken with your best 'spooky' voice to get the full effect.)

Niether a show of faith without works, or of faith by works, but more like faith in the works.

Likewise, I know I am rehashing old defenses, but quite a lot, and perhaps most, of the accusations against Freemasonry arise from (1) its historical roots, (2) its emphasis on maintaining tradition "as is," being reluctant to make the least change in the forms handed down, and (3) the resulting archaisms and anachronisms that are misunderstood in our culture. You can even add (4) an unfortunate tendency within certain strains of Christianity to immediately suspect that which they do not understand.

The Mason is asked before ever joining whether he believes in a Supreme Being. He is asked in the first degree, "In whom do you put your trust?" He is instructed, if he does not answer promptly, that the proper answer is either "God," or "Jesus Christ." After his reply, he is told, "Your trust being in God, your faith is well founded." The things you object to are found later.

Yes, there is more emphasis on the aspect of works, but Masonry has the correct order in insisting on faith first. To the Christian Mason, this structure presents no impediment to his faith. Some like to criticize Masonry's emphasis on works, but it is actually very much in line with an organization whose philosophy (not religion) has its foundation in morality. Morality has to do primarily with our actions, and could hardly be otherwise, it goes with the definition. But statements in Freemasonry about "gaining entrance into the Grand Lodge above," no matter what Masonic context they are found in, are rooted in an understanding, first of all, that Masons are men of faith.

As for "illumination," it simply is another of those terms which formerly had a heavy emphasis in Christianity but have fallen into disuse, much like some other terms Masons use, like "so mote it be," which used to be a common prayer closing and now gets painted as some kind of warning signal of satanism. History has taught us that those who to on witch hunts generally tend to find the witches they are looking for. Unfortunately, they find them behind every door.

 

[ZionKnight]

.

The Mason is asked before ever joining whether he believes in a Supreme Being. He is asked in the first degree, "In whom do you put your trust?" He is instructed, if he does not answer promptly, that the proper answer is either "God," or "Jesus Christ." After his reply, he is told, "Your trust being in God, your faith is well founded." The things you object to are found later.

Really? Even in mainland china, they say the correct response is "God" or "Jesus Christ"?

Yes, there is more emphasis on the aspect of works, but Masonry has the correct order in insisting on faith first. To the Christian Mason, this structure presents no impediment to his faith. Some like to criticize Masonry's emphasis on works, but it is actually very much in line with an organization whose philosophy (not religion) has its foundation in morality. Morality has to do primarily with our actions, and could hardly be otherwise, it goes with the definition. But statements in Freemasonry about "gaining entrance into the Grand Lodge above," no matter what Masonic context they are found in, are rooted in an understanding, first of all, that Masons are men of faith.

There is no doubt (hee hee, a pun ) that a mason must make a confession of faith, but, that's not the full definition of biblical faith. Remember what James wrote by the Holy Spirit, "do you believe? Good, but, so do the devils, and they even tremble."
Christians believe that good works are a result of faith,brought about by hearing the Word, and put in to action, not a good understanding of morality.

I realize that "philosophy" was emphasized, not "religion".
But, bear in mind that I cannot see a significant difference. They are all world views, and make the basis of how one innteracts with the rest of the world and even with whatever "Higher being" they acknowledge, should they acknowledge one. And even if they don't, they still put an emphasis on something be it evolution, higher thought, the fullness of wisdom, higher moral standards, or whatever.

As for the "illumination" bit, I realize again, that you are merely covering every angle, (ever the defender,) but it was just a little humor. I see nothing wrong with being in the Light as He is in the Light, so long as we understand the true source of that Light.

 

[Rev Wayne]

Christians believe that good works are a result of faith,brought about by hearing the Word, and put in to action, not a good understanding of morality.

I realize that "philosophy" was emphasized, not "religion".
But, bear in mind that I cannot see a significant difference.

No difference between religion and philosophy? Now that certainly is news.

Christians believe that good works are a result of faith,brought about by hearing the Word, and put in to action, not a good understanding of morality.

Gee, ya think?

 

[ZionKnight]

Gee, ya think?

Well, yes occasionally. But, not often, it kinda hurts.

 

[Rev Wayne]

I see nothing wrong with being in the Light as He is in the Light, so long as we understand the true source of that Light.

Yeah, John fascinates me with his whole light/dark imagery and contrasts. I've always read John 1:9, which says Jesus is the "True Light, which lightens every man that comes into the world." I've never been quite able to explain away, as some do, the "every man" phrase in that verse. I generally take the words to mean what they say unless the text itself gives me a specific reason not to. and this one does not. So I've understood this to mean what it says, Jesus gives every man light. That does not mean every man recognizes the source, nor that every man comes to the light; just that every man receives light, and that light comes from Christ.

I've searched high and low and long to find any place at all that gives any manner of agreement to my own reading of that verse, to no avail. I had about given up the search (and the interpretation) until one day last week, while searching for something totally unrelated, I came across the following:

Whether God is the cause of spiritual blindness and hardness of heart?

Whether God is the cause of spiritual blindness and hardness of heart?
Now we must consider that God is the universal cause of the enlightening of souls, according to Jn. 1:9: "That was the true light which enlighteneth every man that cometh into this world," even as the sun is the universal cause of the enlightening of bodies, though not in the same way; for the sun enlightens by necessity of nature, whereas God works freely, through the order of His wisdom.

These are the words of Thomas Aquinas. With that new information in hand, I initiated a search once more, and found another person who had picked up on the same piece, and quoted it in a sermon:

Tropologically, according to St. Thomas, Christ (as the Word of God) "shines in everyone's understanding, because whatever light and whatever wisdom (natural or supernatural) exists in men has come to them from participating in the Word," and, thus, Christ "enlightens every man coming into this world" (Jn 1:9).

NEO-PATRISTIC EXEGESIS TO THE RESCUE by John F. McCarthy,

can be found at http://www.rtforum.org/lt/lt41.html

Now McCarthy has added a bit of a different flavor by adding the element of "lightening the understanding," so that this need not be taken as indicative of "the light of salvation." But in reading the surrounding context of Aquinas' remarks, I see he cites the verse at least twice more in some preceding comments, and in those comments he also seems to speak of this as the "light of knowledge."

So I have questions at present, though not yet answered, as to whether Freemasonry's system of thought, in which "light" is interpreted to mean simply "knowledge" or "wisdom," is wholly Thomistic in bearing and/or origin.

And the larger question, of course, would be whether Freemasonry might be Thomistic in bearing overall. As I understand it, there would certainly be similarities between Thomism and Masonry's seeming equation of salvation with the increase of knowledge of the divine.

 

[ZionKnight]

Yeah, John fascinates me with his whole light/dark imagery and contrasts. I've always read John 1:9, which says Jesus is the "True Light, which lightens every man that comes into the world." I've never been quite able to explain away, as some do, the "every man" phrase in that verse. I generally take the words to mean what they say unless the text itself gives me a specific reason not to. and this one does not. So I've understood this to mean what it says, Jesus gives every man light. That does not mean every man recognizes the source, nor that every man comes to the light; just that every man receives light, and that light comes from Christ.

I've searched high and low and long to find any place at all that gives any manner of agreement to my own reading of that verse, to no avail. I had about given up the search (and the interpretation) until one day last week, while searching for something totally unrelated, I came across the following:


These are the words of Thomas Aquinas. With that new information in hand, I initiated a search once more, and found another person who had picked up on the same piece, and quoted it in a sermon:


can be found at http://www.rtforum.org/lt/lt41.html

Now McCarthy has added a bit of a different flavor by adding the element of "lightening the understanding," so that this need not be taken as indicative of "the light of salvation." But in reading the surrounding context of Aquinas' remarks, I see he cites the verse at least twice more in some preceding comments, and in those comments he also seems to speak of this as the "light of knowledge."

So I have questions at present, though not yet answered, as to whether Freemasonry's system of thought, in which "light" is interpreted to mean simply "knowledge" or "wisdom," is wholly Thomistic in bearing and/or origin.

And the larger question, of course, would be whether Freemasonry might be Thomistic in bearing overall. As I understand it, there would certainly be similarities between Thomism and Masonry's seeming equation of salvation with the increase of knowledge of the divine.

As always this is a lot to digest at one time.

Thomistic? I think your take on it sounds close. But, official freemasonry? I think the biggest pesky difference is that recognition of the name God gave us to call Him.
There is a lot in a name, a lot of implications wrapped up in the covering of a name.

And, Paul does separate spiritually discerned wisdom from the worldly kind.

It was Thomas, (wasn't it?), that explained the difference of his approach to philosophy than the norm in that they seek to explain God through logic without faith, and he sought to explain his faith in God using logic, or something like that.

 

[kaythib]

yes. maybe.