Magic

[freespirit2001]

" Power is all perception. Its non-use is its most powerful use. The trick is to use the least amount of power to create the maximum amount of change. Someone who has elegance can apply power, selectively, like a laser, and carefully, almost unobtrusively, ao that you don't feel you're being overpowered. You feel you're being motivated."

Diane K. Shah in New York "Times Magazine"

I like this quote and I feel it does apply to those who are trully spirit-led and who understand good conceptual skill developement and good pragmatic principles in the Lord....

 

[Smilin]

I'm sorry. I usually am more tactful than this but: People who think that Harry Potter is a recruiting tool for the occult that 'teaches' children magic make me want to go and cry in my room in the dark for the lost intelligence of mankind.

Really?
I just laugh at that notion...
Why? Because the same argument is circular in my life experience.

When I was growing up; Dungeons and Dragons was the designated
recruiting tool.

I've seen the same statements on Pokemon, Lord of the Rings...
but they've never figured it out yet..have they?

The TRUE recruiting tool is Walt Disney...YEP..that's right..
How many witches, Greek Gods, talking animals, mermaids, etc
have we seen in those movies? Yet NOT one word from mainline
Christianity on Walt Disney. They have truly been deceived I tell yah.

Take Snow White for instance...
uhhhh huhhhh..poor as snow...RIGHT...
Single woman, living (unmarried) out in the woods with
7 'little' people. And they march off to work every
morning singing and whistling...hi-ho, hi-ho,,,
errrr..WHO sings on their way to work? We know
what's going on in that household and all that 'ho' singing.

And then there's that magic mirror from Satan. Hey...ALL
magic is from Satan..right? The mirror (Satan) empowers
the evil Stepmother to take on the form of a haggard old
woman who gave Snow White a poisoned apple.

Poisons is the reference to witchcraft in the OT.
The Apple is the symbolic fruit of the fall.

So, Satan is back to his 'apple' tricks again.

Yes, I laugh to since they've been deceived by Harry Potter.
WALT DISNEY is the one that seeks to warp our children
and turn them into Satanic, evil beings...

Now...go burn your video tapes....

 

[amnesiac]

No..I don't. Harry Potter is not a Wiccan book at all. It's fiction. Anyone who has done a study of Wiccan will tell you the same thing.
For one thing, there is no such thing as Black or White magic. Magic is magic. It's neutral. THe only evil comes when it is used with a malicious intent. Then it's the person's doing, not magic's.
For another, wands are used yes, but only as a concentration tool. They don't have unicorn hair, or dragon heartstring in them. I personally don't go waving mine around with a swish and flick.
And I don't use bototuber puss...or boomslang skin.

Thanks, this is exactly what I was getting at. I do have some wiccan friends who take offense to any fantasy conception of magic, because they think it promotes a misunderstanding of their relgion. I personally think they are just as hung-up as these Christians that hate harry potter.

Its nice to see a wiccan personally refute the idea that these books are wiccan on these boards. I've read countless threads on the internet on this issue, and someone always states at somepoint that J.K. Rowling is wiccan and the books teach wiccanism. They never provide anything that backs up their statements, and when provided with evidence that their statements are false, they never reply.

 

[Myah]

Its nice to see a wiccan personally refute the idea that these books are wiccan on these boards. I've read countless threads on the internet on this issue, and someone always states at somepoint that J.K. Rowling is wiccan and the books teach wiccanism. They never provide anything that backs up their statements, and when provided with evidence that their statements are false, they never reply.

Last I heard, JK Rowling is Angelican. And her books aren't the only ones that talk about magic. Look at the Dragonlance books, or the Wheel of Time books or the Chronicles of Narnia. I don't see why Harry Potter is so singled out, myself.

 

[smr]

The trick is to use the least amount of power to create the maximum amount of change.

this isnt the section where magic is being taught is it.........

 

[smr]

No..I don't. Harry Potter is not a Wiccan book at all. It's fiction. Anyone who has done a study of Wiccan will tell you the same thing.

Sure the plot could be fiction, but the practises, where do they stand.......
Actually there was an interview with a proclaiming wiccan. She commented on the Harry potter books, and mentioned that she was concerned that the youngsters were learning some more advanced steps by watching that movie, and warned of the dangers for they could be getting into.

 

[smr]

Myah

I like it because the plots are always about standing up for what you believe in and friendship.

Gotta say Im for that though

 

[amnesiac]

Sure the plot could be fiction, but the practises, where do they stand.......
Actually there was an interview with a proclaiming wiccan. She commented on the Harry potter books, and mentioned that she was concerned that the youngsters were learning some more advanced steps by watching that movie, and warned of the dangers for they could be getting into.

I'd like to see/read that interview, as I can't understand how any Wiccan would say Harry Potter remotely resembles anything practiced in Wiccanism.

 

[Dracil]

I recall something about a Christian who *lied* saying she was a Wiccan and how Harry Potter was all evil and was the same as Wicca, just so she could mislead people into thinking Harry Potter was bad.

 

[freespirit2001]

...its sad to see some people take "dramatic magic" themes from the media---(movies and computer games) and actually get seriously disturbed and carried away with the drama and delusion of what is in the movies and on these computer games...

Anything that does become obsessive, however, is unhealthy though....

Seriously.. realizing educated intelligent people do not take these things seriously.....these movies and games are not seriously a problem for anyone ....when people need to dramatize, manipulate and control others and or get caught up in serious delusions...it may be a problem...

Good communication skills....good conceptual skills---good understanding of concepts, processes, and values in real life ---these games and movies do inspire skills that can be acquired in real life through good education and good mentoring---

.....good decision-making skills----good problem solving skills---good leadership skills-------good mediation skills---good interpersonal skills developement--come with practice and the magic of role-playing...or role playing with pretend magic....
----everyone has a different need to judge whats good and bad and whats right and wrong---Intelligent people can see the "Big Picture" and what is healthy and unhealthy about certain behaviors---intelligent focus is the key issue---If there is a healthy focus on the values of good learning experiences.....they are fun loving games and movies... Why MAKE THEM SO FEARFULLY SERIOUS? Where are the family values and intelligent reasoning?---why does everything have to be so bad?

I understand the darker side of human nature does use emotion and coercion to exploit and control others if they can...it happens in office (and job) personalities all the time.....has anyone cared to use their mind to inquire what assertive skills are? Why understand behavior or motives at all? The dark arts---as magic---are mainly political behaviors....These movies are just fun---not political....

Those that take the arts of "magic" seriously---do understand behavior in others (not often their own selves) and how to control it in others as well (not often in their own selves)....most, when brought to the light, reveal unhealthy behaviors and personalities as well a strong need to merely dramatize their delusions and false sense of power...That is not MAGIC to me...the "Magic" is in developing healthy coping life's skills and better insight into the whole picture of what better value judgements are and a better non-judgemental outlook to life is...with prayer...

 

[smr]

Very unlikely the same woman draccil.

Im not forcing you how to raise your children. I think we all agree the movie is about a boy that practises magic.

 

[Dracil]

Magic, sure. But not the same as real world magic. You can prove me wrong by showing me someone flying on a broomstick.

 

[Myah]

Magic, sure. But not the same as real world magic. You can prove me wrong by showing me someone flying on a broomstick.

Well darn..there goes my Quidditch game.

 

[onikirimaru777]

http://www.angelfire.com/mi3/tomekeeper/types/celestial.html

This doesnt apply to the whole "magic in tv and books debate", but i thought it was a good read for skeptics.

 

[Dracil]

Mmm, so you're arguing that Christians who pray are praticing magic? Or else I don't really see the point in posting that link.

Still, that's just that site owner's beliefs, which I still don't think is true.

I still want to see the witches flying on broomsticks. *pouts*

 

[MysteryProf]

I think magic in entertainment is fine. It's plainly make-believe in these situations, and no one is actually taking it seriously enough to attempt to practice it. Even if small children do make an attempt, which seems to be a concern here, it's not going to work -- kids would figure that out pretty quickly. It's the same for video games: Sure, I can press a button and magical explosions decimate my enemies, but when does that happen in real life?

Besides, I've noticed among my Christian friends that there's a strong difference between reading about magic and actually getting close to what they consider performing it. Sure, they can enjoy Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings, but they back down from exposure to Tarot Cards or Ouija Boards. I wouldn't be too paranoid about it.

~MysteryProf

 

[smr]

xtxArchxAngelxtx
It's directed towards children and actually states how to cast magic etc.

d3poptart3
I wouldn't recommend Harry Potter to kids, since the author is a witch, and the books do show one how to cast spells, or at the very least, peeks interest in witchcraft. But it seems like just a story to adults, and usually doesn't do much harm.

1god1son
If this is truely so, it totally contradicts everything you just said, and then after talking about how we should avoid all types of witchcraft
you then recommend a book titled "The Lion, the Witch and the Wardrobe." Does this also contain magic and wizardry?

Did you forget that Gandalf was a wizard, and dosen't he use magic? And dosen't Lord of the Rings make him look like the "good guy"?

 

[Dracil]

Yes, prove wrong my statement that fictional magic is not the same as real world magic

 

[smr]

We all agree the movie is about a boy that practises/or attempts to practise _ _ _ _ _. (yes/no)
Movies have influence on ppl......(yes/no)

 

[seebs]

We all agree the movie is about a boy that practises/or attempts to practise _ _ _ _ _. (yes/no)

No.

The problem here is a fallacy of equivocation.

What Harry Potter does is no more "witchcraft" than computers are. It's a set of tools which do certain things according to natural law imposed by God. That's not the same thing as Biblical "witchcraft".

Movies have influence on ppl......(yes/no)

Yes, but that doesn't buy you what you need; you're going to try to assume that the influence necessarily goes in a certain way, but it's actually very unlikely that it would.