Luck: Exists in Christianity?

[BRERDO]

I understand the definition of Luck to being a chance happening of fortunate or unfortunate events. To gain/lose something by chance.

I have found a few excerpts that relate to this idea but am still on the fence with this. One being:

Ecclesiastes 9:11-12 states, “I have seen something else under the sun: The race is not to the swift or the battle to the strong, nor does food come to the wise or wealth to the brilliant or favor to the learned; but time and chance happen to them all. Moreover, no man knows when his hour will come: As fish are caught in a cruel net, or birds are taken in a snare, so men are trapped by evil times that fall unexpectedly upon them.”

Now, I then try to put a separation between Luck or Chance and God's Will. That also then brings into play the topic of pre-destination. Did God mean for me to win the lottery? Was it just a lucky guess that I picked those numbers? Was it not destined but it happened at the moment or perhaps God intervened with my decision and blessed me with the results of my actions?

I am on the fence here and Luck seems to have always been on my mind when it comes to where the views of Christianity finds it. Sometimes I feel Luck is the same as God's Will and others I feel that it is of our own perception on what is good and bad or fortunate and adverse. How do we know that what we interpret as "good" Luck will end up being "bad" in the long run, or after the initial joy acceptance has faded and we wit with its results.

I don't know. It is something that I have been pondering a lot here lately. Mostly regarding my sister. She is the type of person that can step in a mud puddle wearing flip-flops and come out wearing a pair of Prada flats. I used to be envious of that since I would probably get stuck in the puddle and lose my shoe. I accept it now for me and I build off my "bad luck" as a learned experience to make myself better. I know it is the will of God for her to go through what she has... no I am not bitter. I am happy for her success but a lot of it is coincidental or with her being in the right place in the right time. She has a very thriving business and opportunities open up themselves to her left and right for her family and herself personally. Is that luck?

I looked for old posts on here for Luck but didn't seem to find anything. Does anyone want to chime on the idea of whether or not Luck can exist in Chrstianity, in the way everyone perceives it to be? A chance happening?

 

[dysert]

I don't know. It is something that I have been pondering a lot here lately. Mostly regarding my sister. She is the type of person that can step in a mud puddle wearing flip-flops and come out wearing a pair of Prada flats. I used to be envious of that since I would probably get stuck in the puddle and lose my shoe. I accept it now for me and I build off my "bad luck" as a learned experience to make myself better. I know it is the will of God for her to go through what she has... no I am not bitter. I am happy for her success but a lot of it is coincidental or with her being in the right place in the right time. She has a very thriving business and opportunities open up themselves to her left and right for her family and herself personally. Is that luck?

I looked for old posts on here for Luck but didn't seem to find anything. Does anyone want to chime on the idea of whether or not Luck can exist in Chrstianity, in the way everyone perceives it to be? A chance happening?

I had (ok, maybe "have") similar feelings with regards to my brother. I too have wondered if it's compatible with Christianity to talk about luck. I haven't thought too deeply about it, but it seems that there are probably a lot of things that God has no preference about. In those cases luck may in fact be the best way to explain happy coincidences that occur because of a bunch of random variables coming together. I'll have to think more about the Ecclesiastes passage you referenced.

 

[Emmy]

Dear Brerdo. I would accept: " With God on my side, all things are possible." Luck is wordly, and prayers belong to Christianity. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.

 

[BRERDO]

With God on your side, fortunate or adverse things happening solely by chance is possible? I know what you are saying but that also opens up the idea of luck being a plausible thing with faith driven beliefs. I don't know why this always blows my mind as one thing I can never figure out.

 

[Thy Will Be Done]

I of course could be in error here as I suppose anyone might be as there are many schools of thought on this but I tend to think maybe it is a bit of both as random can exist within a design and at designated ranges and at various allocated points within that design .

 

[Thy Will Be Done]

The wind blows where it wants, and you hear the sound thereof, but can not tell from where it comes, and where it goes: so is every one that is born of the Spirit.

 

[fhansen]

I understand the definition of Luck to being a chance happening of fortunate or unfortunate events. To gain/lose something by chance.

I have found a few excerpts that relate to this idea but am still on the fence with this. One being:

Ecclesiastes 9:11-12 states, “I have seen something else under the sun: The race is not to the swift or the battle to the strong, nor does food come to the wise or wealth to the brilliant or favor to the learned; but time and chance happen to them all. Moreover, no man knows when his hour will come: As fish are caught in a cruel net, or birds are taken in a snare, so men are trapped by evil times that fall unexpectedly upon them.”

Now, I then try to put a separation between Luck or Chance and God's Will. That also then brings into play the topic of pre-destination. Did God mean for me to win the lottery? Was it just a lucky guess that I picked those numbers? Was it not destined but it happened at the moment or perhaps God intervened with my decision and blessed me with the results of my actions?

I am on the fence here and Luck seems to have always been on my mind when it comes to where the views of Christianity finds it. Sometimes I feel Luck is the same as God's Will and others I feel that it is of our own perception on what is good and bad or fortunate and adverse. How do we know that what we interpret as "good" Luck will end up being "bad" in the long run, or after the initial joy acceptance has faded and we wit with its results.

I don't know. It is something that I have been pondering a lot here lately. Mostly regarding my sister. She is the type of person that can step in a mud puddle wearing flip-flops and come out wearing a pair of Prada flats. I used to be envious of that since I would probably get stuck in the puddle and lose my shoe. I accept it now for me and I build off my "bad luck" as a learned experience to make myself better. I know it is the will of God for her to go through what she has... no I am not bitter. I am happy for her success but a lot of it is coincidental or with her being in the right place in the right time. She has a very thriving business and opportunities open up themselves to her left and right for her family and herself personally. Is that luck?

I looked for old posts on here for Luck but didn't seem to find anything. Does anyone want to chime on the idea of whether or not Luck can exist in Chrstianity, in the way everyone perceives it to be? A chance happening?

Luck plays no part in man's salvation because God is infinitely just.

 

[dysert]

Luck plays no part in man's salvation because God is infinitely just.

I don't think Brerdo was talking about Luck as a part of salvation.

 

[SilenceInMotion]

If you are not living in God, then you die by your sins. By extension, you are given to chance. There is no such thing as 'luck' when it comes to doing as God wills, because everything you do thereof has purpose. In being inside the body of Spirit, you have entered the good part of revelation- the part that is willed and favored. To die in those bounds is to die in purpose, no luck or chance is factored.

 

[dysert]

If you are not living in God, then you die by your sins. By extension, you are given to chance. There is no such thing as 'luck' when it comes to doing as God wills, because everything you do thereof has purpose. In being inside the body of Spirit, you have entered the good part of revelation- the part that is willed and favored. To die in those bounds is to die in purpose, no luck or chance is factored.

I understand that everything I *do* has purpose, but what about those things that happen to me or someone close to me? Is it bad luck if I get the flu or get hit by a car? Is it good luck if Publishers Clearinghouse knocks on my door? I'm not so sure that God has a preference in a lot of things going on down here. If in fact He has no preference, perhaps He just lets random variables take their course and then afterwords takes everything and forms it into good?

 

[fhansen]

I understand that everything I *do* has purpose, but what about those things that happen to me or someone close to me? Is it bad luck if I get the flu or get hit by a car? Is it good luck if Publishers Clearinghouse knocks on my door? I'm not so sure that God has a preference in a lot of things going on down here. If in fact He has no preference, perhaps He just lets random variables take their course and then afterwords takes everything and forms it into good?

I think that's the point. Scripture says that the rain falls and the sun shines on the good and bad alike; in everyday life here on earth there's not necessarily an advantage to living rightly. My sister lived a virtuous and healthy life-style, contracted cancer and died relatively young anyway. It doesn't really matter, though, because what does matter is how we lived that life, what we did with what we were given. IOW, luck plays no part in the truly important things: our eternal destiny.

 

[bricklayer]

There is no chance.

God is necessary; everything else is contingent.

Knowing it exhaustively apart from its being, this is exactly the creation God chose to create, with exactly this combination of choices.

Exactly!

We cannot even have an idea that is not already eternally present in the mind of God.
We cannot conceive ideas at all. We can only perceive concepts. God is the original conceiver of all ideas.

One of the most significant differences between our ideas and God's ideas is that we are not the first ones to have our ideas.

 

[BRERDO]

One of the most significant differences between our ideas and God's ideas is that we are not the first ones to have our ideas.

That is a good point. I have never thought about that before. That would mean that we have no uniqueness as God was who we were before we were. I am ok with that. It makes sense. If the idea of us has happened then God made it possible, meaning He knew what it would take to make us the way we are. Hmm... That makes one think. That is for sure.

Say a man loses his job and struggles with almost losing his family. Say he finds a lottery ticket on the ground on the way home from his last day at work and that lottery ticket turns out to be a winner. Now he does not have to work and his family problems are resolved. Was he lucky to find that lottery ticket or did God place that lottery ticket there for him to find? I guess I would say both but I am now thinking maybe the latter would be the true statement. However, we view thinks as lucky when God views things as predestination.

 

[dysert]

Say a man loses his job and struggles with almost losing his family. Say he finds a lottery ticket on the ground on the way home from his last day at work and that lottery ticket turns out to be a winner. Now he does not have to work and his family problems are resolved. Was he lucky to find that lottery ticket or did God place that lottery ticket there for him to find? I guess I would say both but I am now thinking maybe the latter would be the true statement. However, we view thinks as lucky when God views things as predestination.

I am not necessarily disagreeing (I honestly haven't made up my mind on this whole issue), but if you do credit God with the finding of the lottery ticket, then it introduces other problems, like why did God pick that person to rescue instead of the thousands of others in the same boat? For that matter, if God had intended to rescue him via that lottery ticket why did He not simply prevent the man from losing his job in the first place? Also, for the man to have found the ticket means that someone else had to lose the ticket. Is God in the business of rescuing the man at the expense of ripping off the one who bought the ticket?

 

[bricklayer]

That is a good point. I have never thought about that before. That would mean that we have no uniqueness as God was who we were before we were. I am ok with that. It makes sense. If the idea of us has happened then God made it possible, meaning He knew what it would take to make us the way we are. Hmm... That makes one think. That is for sure.

Say a man loses his job and struggles with almost losing his family. Say he finds a lottery ticket on the ground on the way home from his last day at work and that lottery ticket turns out to be a winner. Now he does not have to work and his family problems are resolved. Was he lucky to find that lottery ticket or did God place that lottery ticket there for him to find? I guess I would say both but I am now thinking maybe the latter would be the true statement. However, we view thinks as lucky when God views things as predestination.

God works ALL THINGS together for the good of those called according to His purpose.

 

[splat]

Well, I'm not sure about luck but I do believe in chance as allowed by general providence and libertarian free will. I don't believe that God "looks down the corridors of time" in order to see what decisions we will make and have found no evidence of this in scripture.

 

[DArceri]

CHANCE has no power to do anything because it is not a force or being. To say something happens or is caused by chance suggests that chance is given power to do something.



.

 

[QED]

I don't think anything can be said to be caused purely by chance. That's an odd statement, but think about the implications of pure chance -- that is, something would not be connected to something else and thus it'd be a totally isolated event from the rest of reality.

The issue is then how free will is defined. I'd argue that there is no free will in the strictest sense, but it's a matter of what you can do with your abilities at any given time. With help from God, of course.