LOTR is the spawn of satan

[Victory of the Cross]

i agree with fletcher a person who hates harry potter because of witch craft but likes lotr is a loser

Then I am loser should will dimiss the testimony of hundreds of ex witches that say its witchcraft?

 

[Fletcher]

Sources on the "JK Rowling not being a witch" issue:

http://www.quick-quote-quill.org/articles/2000/0700-swns-alfie.htm

Q: Do you believe in witchcraft and have you ever done any witchcraft ?
A: No.

Q: What are your feelings towards the people who say your books are to do with cults and telling people to become witches ? (reader's question, didn't give name)
A: Alfie. Over to you. Do you feel a burning desire to become a witch ?
Alfie: No.
A: I thought not. I think this is a case of people grossly underestimating children. Again.

http://www.quick-quote-quill.org/articles/2000/1000-vancouversun-wyman.htm
Rowling is quite clear that she doesn't personally believe in that kind of magic -- ''not at all.'' Is she a Christian?

''Yes, I am,'' she says. ''Which seems to offend the religious right far worse than if I said I thought there was no God. Every time I've been asked if I believe in God, I've said yes, because I do, but no one ever really has gone any more deeply into it than that, and I have to say that does suit me, because if I talk too freely about that I think the intelligent reader, whether 10 or 60, will be able to guess what's coming in the books.''

http://www.quick-quote-quill.org/articles/2003/0620-dateline-couric.htm
Rowling: “I think that’s utter garbage. I absolutely do not believe in the occult, practice the occult. I’ve never… I’ve met literally thousands of children now. Not one of them has said to me you’ve really turned me on to the occult, not one of them. Now I’m convinced that if that’s what my books were doing, I would by now have met one child who would have come up to me, covered in pentagrams and said, ‘Can we you know, go and sacrifice a goat later together, will you do that with me?’ It’s never happened, funnily enough.”

Couric: “You find it very annoying, I can tell.”

Rowling: “Well occasionally I do, just occasionally I do. Because I am being accused of something quite horrible. So of course I’ve got to defend myself.”

Couric: “What do you believe in? I’m just curious about your belief system — God, heaven?”

Rowling: “Well, I do believe in God.”

Couric: “You do?”

Rowling: “Yeah, which I’ve said before, but that just seems to annoy them even more For some reason. I don’t think they want me on their side at all.”


One article that probably spread around the idea of JK Rowling being a witch is this one: http://www.snopes.com/humor/iftrue/potter.htm

However, the article is fiction. It comes from a "newspaper" called "The Onion", which writes satrical fiction-- spoofs and parodies.

 

[Elrond of Rivendell]

Stop the Presses she says she is not a witch!!!! My goodness that settles it People Never Lie!!

All HP haters

 

[Fletcher]

Alright, this is getting a little ridiculous. Obviously, she could be lying over and over again about how she isn't a witch, but what evidence do you have that she is? Innocent until proven guilty, after all. Without any evidence, your implication seems pretty filmsy. Couldn't I make a similar claim? What if JRR Tolkien wasn't a Catholic, what if he was just lying? What if CS Lewis wasn't a Christian, what if he was just lying? I don't have anything to support these claims-- but after all, everyone lies. And again, I don't mean to offend anyone, but this is getting ridiculous.

 

[Victory of the Cross]

Stop the Presses she says she is not a witch!!!! My goodness that settles it People Never Lie!!

All HP haters

I hate HP

 

[intricatic]

The question you should all be asking is:

Does HP actually compare to the philological teachings of the occult in any way shape or form?

I submit to you that the answer is this:

NO! SHEESH!

 

[Victory of the Cross]

Most Ex Witches would answer
Yes SHEESH

Lets call it a draw

 

[Fletcher]

You know, maybe this discussion should be moved over to the "Should Christians Read Harry Potter" thread, but in any case, I have two questions for anti-Potter people in this thread, if they wish to answer them:

1) Most anti-Potter people in this thread claim that there is "real witchcraft" in the books. As said earlier in is thread, by several people, all spells in the "Harry Potter" books are Latin gibberish-- not real. So where is this witchcraft in the books?

and:

2) How can reading such fantasy works as "The Lord of the Rings" and "The Chronicles of Narnia" be justified while criticising "Harry Potter"? Both series feature protagoinsts who use magic, spells and incantations, and feature prophecies as important plot points of the story-line. How are they so different from "Harry Potter"?

 

[Fletcher]

Most Ex Witches would answer
Yes SHEESH!

Some examples, please.

 

[Nanee5]

Ok, so Rowling says she believes in God... that does not make her a Christian, contrary to popular belief. Even Satanists believe in God. It's not the fact that witchcraft is used in the story, beit Harry Potter or the t.v. show, "Bewitched".. the point is that it makes witchcraft seem benign, not dangerous in anyway... even ...FUN! That is what ensnares children! Not that it makes them want to run out and get Anton Lavey's Black book, but it desensitizes them to what is really wrong, and what is really evil, to look not so bad after all...

 

[Fletcher]

Ok, so Rowling says she believes in God... that does not make her a Christian, contrary to popular belief. Even Satanists believe in God.

Obviously, belief in God does not equal being a Christian. However, in one of the interviews I posted, JK Rowling was asked if she was a Christian specifically, and she said yes. Her exact beliefs are between her and God, but that is what she says.

"It's not the fact that witchcraft is used in the story, beit Harry Potter or the t.v. show, "Bewitched".. the point is that it makes witchcraft seem benign, not dangerous in anyway... even ...FUN!"

The problem with this logic is that the magic in both works isn't really magic-- as several people in this thread have pointed out. You can't turn a rat into a teacup, and, in regards to "Bewitched", you can't wiggle your nose and make something appear. The magic of the story, which is used as a literary device, doesn't equal the occult, and siince the magic of the story isn't the occult, how can it make what it is not look fun?

"That is what ensnares children! Not that it makes them want to run out and get Anton Lavey's Black book, but it desensitizes them to what is really wrong, and what is really evil, to look not so bad after all..."

Children know this is fantasy. And if they don't, those attempting to turn a rat into a teacup will be sorely disappointed.

And again, I ask the question-- how are "Lord of the Rings" and "The Chronicles of Narnia" different?

-- Added note. If children actually believed that the magic of "Harry Potter" was real, they would know they could not do it. In Rowling's world, magic is an inhereted genetic trait. Unlike the beleif system of Wicca, its not something you can "tap into."

 

[Nienor]

I am going to say something to shock you now
I don't care if the magic in Harry Potter is real. It isn't. Go ask your local wiccan. But, if it was, I still wouldn't care. I am not going to become a witch because of a book I read. In fact I have read many books that have 'real' witchcraft in them. Have I felt condemnation from God for this? No. Has my faith been challenged? No. Have I become intrested in becoming a witch? No. Do I care if the magic is real? No. Does this make it ok for everyone to read the books? No. I believe that God has laid restrictions on some Christians and not on others. You don't think that God wants you to read HP. Great. Don't read it. Just stop foisting your opinion on me.

 

[sethad]

mm...

actually LOTR was written by a christian and it has christian symbolism in it.

wizard sounds young to me and I dont think he really knows what he's talking about...

LOTR was awesome acting, special effects, etc. and I havent read all the books but they're good. harry potter stinks. I cant stand watching them. I havent even bothered reading the harry potter books. waste of time.

 

[Fletcher]

If you've just watched the "Harry Potter" movies I don't blame you for being bored. The movies (espicially the first two) are really annoying, in my opinion. The books are much better.

As for "Lord of the Rings" being written by a Christian-- that is true, but the point wizard-boy was trying to make, I think, was that it still has wizard protagonists-- and so its a bit hypocritical to love "Lord of the Rings" and bash "Harry Potter" for containing magic. As for "Lord of the Rings" being full of Christian symbolism, remember that Tolkien absolutely hated allegory.

 

[Nanee5]

The problem with this logic is that the magic in both works isn't really magic-- as several people in this thread have pointed out. You can't turn a rat into a teacup, and, in regards to "Bewitched", you can't wiggle your nose and make something appear. The magic of the story, which is used as a literary device, doesn't equal the occult, and siince the magic of the story isn't the occult, how can it make what it is not look fun?

"That is what ensnares children! Not that it makes them want to run out and get Anton Lavey's Black book, but it desensitizes them to what is really wrong, and what is really evil, to look not so bad after all..."

Children know this is fantasy. And if they don't, those attempting to turn a rat into a teacup will be sorely disappointed.

And again, I ask the question-- how are "Lord of the Rings" and "The Chronicles of Narnia" different?

-- Added note. If children actually believed that the magic of "Harry Potter" was real, they would know they could not do it. In Rowling's world, magic is an inhereted genetic trait. Unlike the beleif system of Wicca, its not something you can "tap into."

[/QUOTE]

I think you need to read my post again. I never said that the magic in these things were "real' or "not real".. I said that it gave the idea that magic (in general, real or not) was harmless. Have I ever watched "Bewitched?" Yes... was I lured into the occult, No. Did I think that if I wiggled my nose I could do things?? NO (of course I wish I could sometimes... J/K) But even though I know this show is ficticious, I also know there is REAL witchcraft in the world, and shows like this might give the misconception that REAL witchcraft might me just like this..and THAT is my point.

 

[Nanee5]

If you've just watched the "Harry Potter" movies I don't blame you for being bored. The movies (espicially the first two) are really annoying, in my opinion. The books are much better.

As for "Lord of the Rings" being written by a Christian-- that is true, but the point wizard-boy was trying to make, I think, was that it still has wizard protagonists-- and so its a bit hypocritical to love "Lord of the Rings" and bash "Harry Potter" for containing magic. As for "Lord of the Rings" being full of Christian symbolism, remember that Tolkien absolutely hated allegory.

I think the difference in Harry Potter and LOTR and Narnia, is that the HP stories center around the magic, not that magic is used in the story. LOTR and Narnia do not do this.. magic is used, but it is not the center of the plot, unlike HP. And yes, Tolkien did not like to use allegory, but symbolism and allegory are not the same. His Christianity definitely comes out in LOTR in many ways; in subtle ways, but there none the less. I see Aragorn as a type of Christ, the King who renounces his throne, and humbles himself, only to take up the Crown again when the time comes...; I also see Sam as a type of Christ, the friend who sticks closer than a brother, who carries us when our burdon is so heavy we cannot carry it ourselves... I could go on and on.

 

[Fletcher]

Magic is not the center of "Harry Potter" either. The center of "Harry Potter" is the characters, the storyline, the good-versus-evil and choice themes. The magic is simply a story device-- just like it is "The Chronicles of Narnia" and "The Lord of the Rings," And since you seem to be saying that the concept of magic in a book, even if it bares no resemblence to the occult, greatly affects children's minds, then how is it different in "The Chronicles of Narnia" and "The Lord of the Rings"? How would Lucy saying a gibberish spell to make the Duffers visible (with the full approval of Aslan) be any less effective in desensitizing children's minds to the occult then Harry saying a gibberish spell to turn a rat into a teacup? How is Gandalf trying spell after spell to open the doors of Moria any less of a threat to desensitize children's minds to the occult than "Harry Potter", in your view? As I've said, I don't think "Harry Potter" desenzitizes children to the occult, because it [/I]isn't the occult. But by your logic, I still don't see how "Lord of the Rings" and "The Chronicles of Narnia" can qualify as okay.

 

[intricatic]

Most Ex Witches would answer
Yes SHEESH

Lets call it a draw

I'm an ex occultist from practicing in the FCoS and OoP, as well as a lot of Crowlean philosophy. That's the entire basis of the whole 'modern witchcraft' garbage that's out right now, and anyone who knows anything about the symbology behind paganism and the occult would laugh at you for saying that. I know I am.

 

[WhenFinallySetFree777]

I am going to say something to shock you now
I don't care if the magic in Harry Potter is real. It isn't. Go ask your local wiccan. But, if it was, I still wouldn't care. I am not going to become a witch because of a book I read. In fact I have read many books that have 'real' witchcraft in them. Have I felt condemnation from God for this? No. Has my faith been challenged? No. Have I become intrested in becoming a witch? No. Do I care if the magic is real? No. Does this make it ok for everyone to read the books? No. I believe that God has laid restrictions on some Christians and not on others. You don't think that God wants you to read HP. Great. Don't read it. Just stop foisting your opinion on me.

I congratulate you for making a free king awesome post. Woot.

And I just wanted to say that I couldn't help but chuckle whenever I saw the title of this thread.

 

[Humbledmac]

Look i have all respect for HP as a book. well written and obviously very popular. however, all three of my pastors have taught, and i concur, that HP contains real incantations and spells. Haven't their been insidences where people, mainly kids and teens have gotten involved with the occult. matter of fact i have a book that explains the difference in HP and LOTR