Life begin @ conception????

[TedT]

Psalm 9:17 in the KJV has nothing about returning, but rather1 7 The wicked shall be turned into hell, and all the nations that forget God.

You might want to take a look at the Hebrew of this verse and notice that to turn into is actually pretty well the opposite of shuv, return...a bit of eisegetical interpretation by the KJV to keep folk from noticing the implications of the word shuv and being led astray from KJV dogma.

 

[TedT]

the parable of the sower is sowing the Gospel.

Yes it is, but look again: I referenced the parable of the weeds, NOT the sower and in the explanation (v36) of the weeds metaphor, ie stripped of metaphor, it clearly states the good seed are the SONS/PEOPLE of the kingdom and the weeds are the SONS/PEOPLE of the evil one. Of course some people contend that what is actually written is not actually definitive...

Don't feel bad, a very common error. You could never guess just how many people use the sower to try to mitigate the implications of the weeds story, feeling secure in not actually checking their memory.

 

[Jamdoc]

Yes it is, but look again: I referenced the parable of the weeds, NOT the sower and in the explanation (v36) of the weeds metaphor, ie stripped of metaphor, it clearly states the good seed are the SONS/PEOPLE of the kingdom and the weeds are the SONS/PEOPLE of the evil one. Of course some people contend that what is actually written is not actually definitive...

Don't feel bad, a very common error. You could never guess just how many people use the sower to try to mitigate the implications of the weeds story, feeling secure in not actually checking their memory.

The ultimate point is why I disagree with the interpretation.
we're being resurrected physically, not existing forever as disembodied spirits.
But if we existed as disembodied spirits prior to having a body, that means the body is an unnatural state for us, and so we shouldn't even have a physical resurrection.

 

[Platte]

1. Please explain where in the Bible the passage that states life begins at conception is, I cannot find it anywhere.

2. Please explain how you came to the conclusion that life begin at conception, if you don't have a bible passage.

Note: this is not about your view on abortion, weather you are pro life or pro choice. This is about HOW you come to the conclusion and WHERE you get your beliefs from.

The Bible say life begins when you start breathing. So that would mean once a baby has a heartbeat they are alive. That is science and Bible and quite frankly common sense.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

The Bible say life begins when you start breathing. So that would mean once a baby has a heartbeat they are alive. That is science and Bible and quite frankly common sense.

that seems more in line with the actual evidence both in scripture and in Sciene

 

[Jamdoc]

The Bible say life begins when you start breathing. So that would mean once a baby has a heartbeat they are alive. That is science and Bible and quite frankly common sense.

that seems more in line with the actual evidence both in scripture and in Sciene

That'd be after birth but we all know that fetuses in the womb have experiences of life.
They dream, move, respond to stimuli.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

That'd be after birth but we all know that fetuses in the womb have experiences of life.
They dream, move, respond to stimuli.

not at the beginning they don't.

 

[Jamdoc]

not at the beginning they don't.

No but it's certainly before their first breath which is after they're born.
I don't know exactly when it is that it happens but it's after implantation and before birth.

 

[prodromos]

not at the beginning they don't.

So you want to define life as concious life?

 

[Adventist Dissident]

So you want to define life as concious life?

yes, when they are aware and have feelings.

 

[fhansen]

yes, when they are aware and have feelings.

So you’re able to precisely identify when this sacredness, this life, begins such that it must be rewarded full legal right to continue to live, immediately before which no such consideration need be given?

 

[pescador]

The Bible say life begins when you start breathing. So that would mean once a baby has a heartbeat they are alive. That is science and Bible and quite frankly common sense.

That makes no sense. Breathing and heartbeat are entirely different.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

So you’re able to precisely identify when this sacredness, this life, begins such that it must be rewarded full legal right to continue to live, immediately before which no such consideration need be given?

it is no earlier then the heart beat and no later then the brainwaves, that is as close as i can get.

 

[fhansen]

it is no earlier then the heart beat and no later then the brainwaves, that is as close as i can get.

And if we make a mistake in our timing, should it matter?

 

[HARK!]

So you want to define life as concious life?

yes, when they are aware and have feelings.

So in your opinion there is no such thing as a living plant? That opinion wouldn't hold up in court; if one was spraying herbicides on endangered plant species. I wouldn't advise cooking up bald eagle eggs for breakfast on that premise either. There could be trouble.

 

[Jamdoc]

it is no earlier then the heart beat and no later then the brainwaves, that is as close as i can get.

I'd say no earlier than implantation but beyond that, we don't know, we only might be able to observe outward signs but we don't know when they become a living soul. I'd err on the side of caution when it's murder that is on the line.

 

[prodromos]

yes, when they are aware and have feelings.

So again, completely arbitrary.

 

[rturner76]

The Bible say life begins when you start breathing. So that would mean once a baby has a heartbeat they are alive. That is science and Bible and quite frankly common sense.

THat's right, life begins at the breath of life that God blows in your nose.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

So again, completely arbitrary.

The scripture is very clear that are Body, Soul & Spirit. 1 Thess 5:23. It is very clear there are stages of development in the womb: conception, formation of the body,before the heartbeat & after the heartbeat, Brainwaves. Just because you have a body does not mean you have a person. When a person dies you still have a body, but they are not a person, they have no thoughts and no feeling and no awareness. The same thing happens at the beginning of life.

 

[Adventist Dissident]

THat's right, life begins at the breath of life that God blows in your nose.

someone is getting what I am saying, when does that occur. it is not a conception.