Lies about the Sabbath.

Sophrosyne said:

Thus by Christianity they are SINNING by NOT loving their neighbor on Saturday... a rejection of the two greatest commandments given by Jesus himself IMO.

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They specifically keep the Sabbath and condemn the yearly commemoration of the Resurrection as a Satanic festival; because they utterly reject the Resurrection and the full atonement of the Cross.

Nothing has changed or ever will change.

LarryP2 said:

They specifically keep the Sabbath and condemn the yearly commemoration of the Resurrection as a Satanic festival; because they utterly reject the Resurrection and the full atonement of the Cross.

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Just another contradiction. For people who demand compliance to commandments when two commandments clash they have no choice but to break one of them. Like you iterated earlier to have the Sabbath more important than loving your neighbor for Christians..... shows contempt for the New Testament authors over and over again (plus Jesus himself) equating this is big commandment why are folks keeping a commandment that isn't even mentioned instead? Because they are disobedient and are not acting like Christians.

Sophrosyne said:

Just another contradiction. For people who demand compliance to commandments when two commandments clash they have no choice but to break one of them. Like you iterated earlier to have the Sabbath more important than loving your neighbor for Christians..... shows contempt for the New Testament authors over and over again (plus Jesus himself) equating this is big commandment why are folks keeping a commandment that isn't even mentioned instead? Because they are disobedient and are not acting like Christians.

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Such ugly, un-Christian behavior indicates that the Church Fathers knew what they were doing when they unequivocally-condemned Sabbath Keeping in the Synod of Laodicea (4th Century):

Canon 29

"Christians must not judaize by resting on the Sabbath, but must work on that day, rather honouring the Lord's Day; and, if they can, resting then as Christians. But if any shall be found to be judaizers, let them be anathema from Christ."

CHURCH FATHERS: Synod of Laodicea (4th Century)

Simply put, historically Christianity knew that the Sabbath Keeping heresy was incompatible with the Resurrection and the Gospels. It has known this for 2,000 years.

Cribstyl said:

Dont lie Elder, you and Paul are not in agreement. Paul says in this context...... Rom 7:6
But now we are delivered from the law, that being dead wherein we were held; that we should serve in newness of spirit, and not in the oldness of the letter.

(...that Christian are now (a)delivered from the law, (b)being dead to the law, (c) to serve God in a new way.
Not by the 10.com you keep saying you keep in Christ.) Your comments are pathetic to say the least.
You will not say what the scriptures are saying. You keep pointing to the law, with scriptures that points away from it.



You're confusing the facts. My bicycle is in perfect shape but I drive a car to work. Paul is not trashing the law. He is saying that the law is a good thing. He explains that grace through faith has more glory than the law.
The law administers death, grace through faith administers life.
You and your prophetess Ellen White keep promoting righteousness by the law while the apostles preach righteousness by faith to Christians.

Rom 3:28
Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
What part of without the deeds of the law means we're under the law?
Rom 4:13
For the promise, that he should be the heir of the world, was not to Abraham, or to his seed, through the law, but through the righteousness of faith.
Rom 4:14
For if they which are of the law be heirs, faith is made void, and the promise made of none effect:

Faith and law are 2 separate covenants, one is of Moses and one is of Jesus Christ.

Gal 3:11
But that no man is justified by the law in the sight of God, it is evident: for, The just shall live by faith.
Gal 3:12
And the law is not of faith: but, The man that doeth them shall live in them.

Gal 3:23
But before faith came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which should afterwards be revealed.

Posting scripture about the law is easy but it's old covenant.

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Can I have a response Elder......

Elder 111 said:

So the church fathers usurped the heavenly Father's commandment? The knew better that God! So then the commandment to keep Sunday did not come from the bible, the Apostles or God.
Truth at last.

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The Commandment you are referring to NEVER applied to Gentiles, before during or after Christ. That is simply just history.

There is an unbroken logical thread that runs through history: Jesus was Resurrected on Sunday and Pentecost happened on Sunday. Christianity threw off Sabbath Keeping in the First year after the Resurrection. Nobody ever thought of the Sabbath after that. How could they? It had obviously been fulfilled by Christ. And the consistent history of the Early Church was excommunicating the Judaizing Heretics that tried to revive the dead and moldy Mosaic Law. Laodicea only confirmed what had been the reality for 300 years. It became written Church doctrine to excommunicate Judaizers.

Just reading these posts, you can immediately see the wisdom of their course: Plainly, Sabbath Keeping is incompatible with and an outright rejection of the Resurrection and the Gospel. They simply cannot be reconciled and harmonized. The more you believe in the Sabbath, the less that you believe in the Resurrection, the Gospel and the Full Atonement of the Cross. Sabbath Keeping ALWAYS eventually leads to a system of Salvation by Works. ALWAYS! Seventh Day Adventism merely takes it to its logical end point, and hatefully condemns ALL of the rest of Christianity. They flatter their conceit by claiming they are the Remnant Church, when clearly they are not. Christianity has always believed in EXACTLY the same things. The Sabbath was simply a useless and silly cast-off cultural artifact after the mighty hydrogen bomb blast of the Resurrection. There is no way it could have survived that. The First and Second Century Church Fathers were unanimous: continued Sabbath Keeping was ironclad proof that the person had not received Grace and did not understand the Gospel and the Resurrection. In fact, in the latest round of this argument, it was argued by a Seventh Day Adventist yesterday that to honestly state the undisputed history of the Council of Laodicea can cost you your Salvation. Honestly stating historical facts is a sin! Sabbath Keeping therefore demands lying to achieve Salvation. You are saved if you lie and break the Commandment against lying, as long as it is done to promote the Sabbath.

Sabbath Keepers believe that at least some of the Mosaic Law was abrogated by the Cross, and therefore logically they believe the Cross's redemption is only partial! That is the sheer logic of the argument. Christianity teaches that the Law was completely abrogated, therefore the Atonement is complete. Those are the only two logical outcomes. You have to pick the Resurrection or you have to pick the Sabbath.

Christianity clearly has history and the full sense of the plan of Salvation on its side. Sabbath Keeping only has proof-texts, outright lies about history, with blinders on to squeamishly avoid the central occurrence of history and the Bible.

Elder 111 said:

Can you give the quotation where SDA.s say the reject the atonement of the Cross?

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This one is easy. Adventist rejection of Christ's atonement and sufficient propitiation made 2000 years ago is codified in the SDA Fundamental Beliefs.
Subscribing to a fictitious "second and last phase" contrary to Scripture amounts to an open admission that Adventism denies Christ's atonement in the perfect tense.

Elder 111 said:

Note your quotation from Romans 7.
2 For the woman which hath an husband is bound by the law to her husband so long as he liveth; but if the husband be dead, she is loosed from the law of her husband.
3 So then if, while her husband liveth, she be married to another man, she shall be called an adulteress: but if her husband be dead, she is free from that law; so that she is no adulteress, though she be married to another man.
These are the verses prior to yours. Note that the Husband dies not the law. If she married again after the dead of the first husband is it not that she commits adultery if she looks to another while married to the second?
Your verse says we become dead to the law, not that the law is dead!

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The truth comes out: you admitted that you lied in misrepresenting Adventism on a public forum, and according to your own words you aren't saved.

Deflection from that point isn't going to work for you. In an earlier post you conceded that Romans 7 doesn't address you, since Paul's qualification "for I speak to those who know the law" doesn't include the Gentiles living in Barbados. Now you want to argue that "you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another" doesn't include you, and "we have been delivered from the law, having died to what we were held by" doesn't include you either.

There is no continuity to be found in your posts. The mental gymnastics and cognitive dissonance you rely on as a defense show that you need others to forget what you've posted, and this continued lie-by-omission pattern is just another lie. What follows is simply to remind others of your post's content and how you misrepresented (read: LIED) the soteriology of the SDA 'church':

Elder 111 said:

Who said that they is salvation by the law? We are not saved by the Ten commandments. But I am not saved when I steal, and lie and kill.

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With a short paragraph consisting of three sentences, you've contradicted yourself and show that your 'salvation' depends on compliance with the old covenant Law. You're attempting to save yourself via works of the flesh and you know you're lying on a public forum.

Review your own statement claiming that "I am not saved when I lie".
No one needs to refute your statements when you condemn yourself.

Besides, you've already seen plenty of quotes from the Pen of Liability proving that Adventist soteriology is based on compliance to the old covenant.

Testimonies for the Church
Volume Two, page 693, paragraph 2
Chapter Title: No Probation After Christ Comes

As we have followed down the chain of prophecy, revealed truth for our time has been clearly seen and explained. We are accountable for the privileges that we enjoy and for the light that shines upon our pathway. Those who lived in past generations were accountable for the light which was permitted to shine upon them. Their minds were exercised in regard to different points of Scripture which tested them. But they did not understand the truths which we do. They were not responsible for the light which they did not have. They had the Bible, as we have; but the time for the unfolding of special truth in relation to the closing scenes of this earth's history is during the last generations that shall live upon the earth. Special truths have been adapted to the conditions of the generations as they have existed. The present truth, which is a test to the people of this generation, was not a test to the people of generations far back. If the light which now shines upon us in regard to the Sabbath of the fourth commandment had been given to the generations in the past, God would have held them accountable for that light. When the temple of God was opened in heaven, John saw in holy vision a class of people whose attention was arrested and who were looking with reverential awe at the ark, which contained the law of God. The special test upon the fourth commandment did not come until after the temple of God was opened in heaven. Those who died before the light was given upon the law of God and the claims of the fourth commandment were not guilty of the sin of violating the seventh-day Sabbath. The wisdom and mercy of God in dispensing light and knowledge at the proper time, as the people need it, is unsearchable. Previous to His coming to judge the world in righteousness, He sends forth a warning to arouse the people and call their attention to their neglect of the fourth commandment, that they may be enlightened, and may repent of their transgression of His law, and prove their allegiance to the great Lawgiver. He has made provision that all may be holy and happy if they choose. Sufficient light has been given to this generation, that we may learn what our duties and privileges are, and enjoy the precious and solemn truths in their simplicity and power.​

To show Ellen's dependence on 1844, I will include this quote from Early Writings, Pg 42-43:

Sabbath, March 24, 1849, we had a sweet and very interesting meeting with the brethren at Topsham, Maine. The Holy Ghost was poured out upon us, and I was taken off in the Spirit to the city of the living God. Then I was shown that the commandments of God and the testimony of Jesus Christ relating to the shut door could not be separated, and that the time for the commandments of God to shine out with all their importance, and for God’s people to be tried on the Sabbath truth, was when the door was opened in the most holy place in the heavenly sanctuary, where the ark is, in which are contained the ten commandments. This door was not opened until the mediation of Jesus was finished in the holy place of the sanctuary in 1844. Then Jesus rose up and shut the door of the holy place, and opened the door into the most holy, and passed within the second veil, where He now stands by the ark, and where the faith of Israel now reaches.

I saw that Jesus had shut the door of the holy place, and no man can open it; and that He had opened the door into the most holy, and no man can shut it (Revelation 3:7, 8); [see page 86. See also appendix.] and that since Jesus has opened the door into the most holy place, which contains the ark, the commandments have been shining out to God’s people, and they are being tested on the Sabbath question.

I saw that the present test on the Sabbath could not come until the mediation of Jesus in the holy place was finished and He had passed within the second veil; therefore Christians who fell asleep before the door was opened into the most holy, when the midnight cry was finished, at the seventh month, 1844, and who had not kept the true Sabbath, now rest in hope; for they had not the light and the test on the Sabbath which we now have since that door was opened. I saw that Satan was tempting some of God’s people on this point. Because so many good Christians have fallen asleep in the triumphs of faith and have not kept the true Sabbath, they were doubting about its being a test for us now.​

Ellen White's soteriology revolves around the Sabbath she failed to keep Holy according the Law that ordained it. This is evident in these quotes provided below that show the Adventist formula for 'salvation' to be compliance with the old covenant from Mount Sinai you don't acknowledge God's redemption from:

No one is saved who is a transgressor of the law of God, which is the foundation of his government in heaven and in earth. {RH June 17, 1890, par. 8}

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." 1 Samuel 2:30. {6T 356.4}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

No one who disregards the fourth commandment, after becoming enlightened in regard to the claims of the Sabbath, can be held guiltless in the sight of God. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 14}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

“God requires of all His subjects obedience, entire obedience to all His commandments. He demands now as ever perfect righteousness as the only title to heaven. Christ is our hope and our refuge. His righteousness is imputed only to the obedient!” (Review & Herald, Sept. 21, 1886)

"Christ does not lessen the claims of the law. In unmistakable language He presents obedience to it as the condition of eternal life—the same condition that was required of Adam before his Fall. The Lord expects no less of the soul now than He expected of man in Paradise, perfect obedience, unblemished righteousness. The requirement under the covenant of grace is just as broad as the requirement made in Eden—harmony with God’s law, which is holy, just, and good." (Christ’s Object Lessons, p. 391)​

How much clearer does it need to be that the SDA church adopts a formula of 'salvation' by compliance to the old covenant? This is not a Christian organization that recognizes God's redemption from the covenant from Mount Sinai, and having one foot in the tenets of Judaism while giving lipservice to our Redeemer is their form of promoting adultery.

Therefore, my brethren, you also have become dead to the law through the body of Christ, that you may be married to another—to Him who was raised from the dead, that we should bear fruit to God.​

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The resulting conclusions are inescapable:

• The Seventh-day Adventist 'church' has rejected redemption in Jesus Christ.
• Elder111 is a habitual liar who wants others to forget what he posted.

Elder 111 said:

If I help him Sunday to Friday that is not enough. I am a bad Christian if I don't work on the Sabbath!

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Elder 111 said:

So the only day counts for love to my neighbour is on Saturday?

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If one refuses to love their neighbor on Saturday then one is refusing to love their neighbor it is sin according to Jesus and the Bible be it one day a week or more. Would you reject one of the GREATEST commandments Jesus gave in the Bible to keep a commandment that he did NOT ever mention in the New Testament? That is just disobedience IMO.

Elder 111 said:

So the church fathers usurped the heavenly Father's commandment? The knew better that God! So then the commandment to keep Sunday did not come from the bible, the Apostles or God.
Truth at last.

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Elder111's vocabulary is going through growth pains. It isn't Christendom that has usurped God's commandments, but rather it is the SDA 'church' that has usurped the old covenant and erroneously re-packaged it as God's commandments in the present tense.

Elder 111 said:

So the only day counts for love to my neighbour is on Saturday?

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What a horrible testimony!
Not to mention discontinuous from the previous post, showing yet again there is no continuity to be found in your inability to carry a conversation.

1 Peter 2:15-16 is completely lost on the Adventist.
For this is the will of God, that by doing good you may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men— as free, yet not using liberty as a cloak for vice, but as bondservants of God.

Cribstyl said:

Cribstyl said:

Dont lie Elder, you and Paul are not in agreement...

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Can I have a response Elder......

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You made a prescient point unlikely to be answered. Would a reputation point ease the pain?

Elder 111 said:

Do you really want to see it? I have shown from the bible already that the Sabbath was being kept by both Jew and Gentle with Paul and it has been rejected. Look at post 162

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No you didn't. What you did show is Paul attending the synagogue evangelizing the Jews. The Gentiles in attendance weren't even Christians. In short you think attendance at church is keeping the Sabbath when its only church attendance. Furthermore you condemn yourself for not worshipping at the synagogue.