Liberal Christians

[Forrest GOP]

I didn't want this thread to turn into a debate about alcohol. I admit I worried it would happen because so many Christians, like I said, seem to defend it. Maybe we should all agree to disagree on that topic.

Very well, but it does lead me into a topic that I was thinking about: For the time being, and across the land, conservative Christians need to put aside their theological differences and band together against the common enemy. As a Catholic, I can tell you that I have gone to abortion prayer events, only to be targeted by Fundamentalists about the Catholic Church being Babylon and all that other nonsense, and I said: Why are we wasting energy on this subject when we are here for the children?

The amount of ink and hot air expended on saying why protestantism is wrong and Catholicism is wrong could be redirected and aimed at our common enemy. Does that not make sense? We can argue later in heaven, but right now it is ridiculous to argue about the color of the drapes when the house around them is burning to the ground.

 

[sealacamp]

Very well, but it does lead me into a topic that I was thinking about: For the time being, and across the land, conservative Christians need to put aside their theological differences and band together against the common enemy. As a Catholic, I can tell you that I have gone to abortion prayer events, only to be targeted by Fundamentalists about the Catholic Church being Babylon and all that other nonsense, and I said: Why are we wasting energy on this subject when we are here for the children?

The amount of ink and hot air expended on saying why protestantism is wrong and Catholicism is wrong could be redirected and aimed at our common enemy. Does that not make sense? We can argue later in heaven, but right now it is ridiculous to argue about the color of the drapes when the house around them is burning to the ground.

Forrest you are absolutely right. And you can rest assured that some of us know that God has His people everywhere in every denomination. To God denominations don't exist. What does exist are those that follow His son, believe in the truth (Christ), and do His will. This divide between Gods people is satan at work and those that perpetuate it are deceived into believing that they are doing the right thing. It can easily be shown that there is no denomination with perfect people and errant individuals whose belief is questionable at best are everywhere as well. Thus Jesus story of the wheat and the tares. Strange that so many people forget about what He taught us for He has covered all the bases if we are paying attention to what He said. Yes He prayed for us to all be one, one with each other and one with Him and the Father. And each day I ask for the same thing too. For if we are not united then we will not be able to fight the evil that is slowly consuming the world around us. In addition we won't be able to lead many to Christ because they won't see Him in us.

Sealacamp

 

[MrJim]

Forrest you are absolutely right. And you can rest assured that some of us know that God has His people everywhere in every denomination. To God denominations don't exist. What does exist are those that follow His son, believe in the truth (Christ), and do His will. This divide between Gods people is satan at work and those that perpetuate it are deceived into believing that they are doing the right thing. It can easily be shown that there is no denomination with perfect people and errant individuals whose belief is questionable at best are everywhere as well. Thus Jesus story of the wheat and the tares. Strange that so many people forget about what He taught us for He has covered all the bases if we are paying attention to what He said. Yes He prayed for us to all be one, one with each other and one with Him and the Father. And each day I ask for the same thing too. For if we are not united then we will not be able to fight the evil that is slowly consuming the world around us. In addition we won't be able to lead many to Christ because they won't see Him in us.

Sealacamp

Is there a line though? If "conservative" Mormons or JWs want to join the "fight against evil" then is that cool?

At what point do we begin to "fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness" [Eph 5:11] to gain fellow warriors to "fight against evil"?

 

[realtruth101]

Lots of Christians defend alcohol. I never understood that.

Welcome Angel, I am sorry your family is doing that but we are glad to see you here

I'm sorry this really isn't what the thread is about but I really have to say somthing, there are two different groups of Christians that defend alcohol, one is the group who know very little about the bible and abuse it, and the others are those who know the bible very well and find biblically that there's no possible way the wine, that is spoken about all through the bible is alcohol free, I personally don't drink but perhaps that is due to the way I used alcohol in the past, Its funny everytime I hear someone stand up and make the claim the wine used in the bible was grape juice, all I can say is when that statement is held up in the light of God's word it is so full of holes, it falls to pieces. Drunkeness is a sin, just as over indulging in donuts is a sin, funny thing I have found is these teetotallers always seem to have a vice of their own that their bound to, or alcohol was there vice and since it was their struggle it should be everyones..........I'm not saying the abuse hasn't destroyed many of Christian homes, it has.......just my thought on the matter

 

[Forrest GOP]

Is there a line though? If "conservative" Mormons or JWs want to join the "fight against evil" then is that cool?

Let me say two things on that

1) If Mitt Romney runs I will vote for him. Enough said.
2) In California, it was the massive push by the Mormon Church that enabled California Proposition 8 to pass. So my hat's off to them for that.

And for that matter, if a Jew or Buddhist or whatever wants to help end abortion or end same-sex marriange, I say: Join the team!

 

[sealacamp]

Is there a line though? If "conservative" Mormons or JWs want to join the "fight against evil" then is that cool?

At what point do we begin to "fellowship with the unfruitful works of darkness" [Eph 5:11] to gain fellow warriors to "fight against evil"?

John said to Jesus, “Teacher, we saw someone using your name to cast out demons, but we told him to stop because he wasn’t in our group.” “Don’t stop him!” Jesus said. “No one who performs a miracle in my name will soon be able to speak evil of me. Anyone who is not against us is for us. If anyone gives you even a cup of water because you belong to the Messiah, I tell you the truth, that person will surely be rewarded.

There is your answer. There is very little that Jesus has addressed in His time here and if that wasn't enough for you the Holy Spirit is always there to guide you into a deeper understanding of all that God has for us to know.

Sealacamp

 

[MrJim]

Let me say two things on that

1) If Mitt Romney runs I will vote for him. Enough said.
2) In California, it was the massive push by the Mormon Church that enabled California Proposition 8 to pass. So my hat's off to them for that.

And for that matter, if a Jew or Buddhist or whatever wants to help end abortion or end same-sex marriange, I say: Join the team!

There is your answer. There is very little that Jesus has addressed in His time here and if that wasn't enough for you the Holy Spirit is always there to guide you into a deeper understanding of all that God has for us to know.

Sealacamp

So there is no line~~anyone is an ally against "evil" even if they are heretics or unbelievers...there is something really creepy about that line of reasoning...but then I understand that the real battle for most here is the preservation of Americanism and that trumps any scriptural/church teachings.

I understand there is a conservative movement in the Church of Satan you can embrace as allies

 

[Forrest GOP]

So there is no line~~anyone is an ally against "evil" even if they are heretics or unbelievers...there is something really creepy about that line of reasoning...but then I understand that the real battle for most here is the preservation of Americanism and that trumps any scriptural/church teachings.

I understand there is a conservative movement in the Church of Satan you can embrace as allies

1) Here is something for you to consider: Today's unbeliever may be tomorrow's believer, and visa versa. So frankly you really don't know who you're joining with.

2) If an unbeliever can help stop children from being aborted, would you abandon those chidlren just so that you can wave the flag of what you consider to be orthodoxy? And bear in mind as well, this is a two-way street. I would also be overlooking what I consider to be your heresy for the sake of joining with you to help stop the spread of Liberalism.

As I said in an earlier post, it is ridiculous to argue about the color of the drapes when the house around them is burning to the ground.

 

[Softly]

MrJim is right. We need to draw the line somewhere. We need to remember the Word says that light has no place with darkness. I hate the murder of unborn babies but what if the church of satan had a rally against it, would we join them? Where I understand what Forrest GOP is saying and appreciate his heart on the matter do you think that we could walk on dangerous or enemy territory without the lines being drawn?

 

[supersoldier71]

Stone cold conservative in my theology. Pretty dang conservative politically.

I believe also believe that while our Christian ethics should guide and inform ALL aspects of our lives, I don't necessarily see a problem with Christians pulling in the same political direction as those who don't share our faith. If a Jew or a Muslim is anti-abortion, I'd probably march with them, for example. Our cause would be godly. Marching with a satanist....mmm....probably not, because while practicing Muslim and Jews who would be likely to be at that rally share many values, the satanist...wouldn't.

Not sure that makes any sense in a post.

 

[Forrest GOP]

MrJim is right. We need to draw the line somewhere. We need to remember the Word says that light has no place with darkness.

How dark do you think it is inside an abortionist's vacuum tube? This is why Conservatives can't make any headway, because Fundamentalists want to argue over minutia.

We have a crisis in our nation, regarding abortion, filth on the airwaves, teen pregancies, same-sex marriage, etc., and anybody - ANYBODY - who is against those things and wants to help is who we should be teaming up with to stop them. Do you think the child in the womb who is about to be crushed gives a damn whether his rescuer is a Christian or a Buddhist? Save the country first, then you guys can argue over who the heretic is later!

 

[Forrest GOP]

MrJim is right. We need to draw the line somewhere. We need to remember the Word says that light has no place with darkness.

How dark do you think it is inside an abortionist's vacuum tube? This is why Conservatives can't make any headway, because Fundamentalists want to argue over minutia.

We have a crisis in our nation, regarding abortion, filth on the airwaves, teen pregancies, same-sex marriage, etc., and anybody - ANYBODY - who is against those things and wants to help is who we should be teaming up with to stop them. Do you think the child in the womb who is about to be crushed gives a damn whether his rescuer is a Christian or a Buddhist? Save the country first, then you guys can argue over who the heretic is later!

Just one other thing to add to what I said: If you or I want to sacrafice our lives for our beliefs, that's one thing. But we are not talking about our lives here, are we. Are you the one in danger of being aborted? No. If you were, you might be singing a different tune.

We are talking about the lives of the unborn, and the quality of the lives of our children and their children. Neither you nor I have no right to sacrafice their lives because of our theological beliefs.

 

[MrJim]

How dark do you think it is inside an abortionist's vacuum tube? This is why Conservatives can't make any headway, because Fundamentalists want to argue over minutia.

We have a crisis in our nation, regarding abortion, filth on the airwaves, teen pregancies, same-sex marriage, etc., and anybody - ANYBODY - who is against those things and wants to help is who we should be teaming up with to stop them. Do you think the child in the womb who is about to be crushed gives a damn whether his rescuer is a Christian or a Buddhist? Save the country first, then you guys can argue over who the heretic is later!

I can understand your passion; not sure the ends justifies the means, for if it did then I would be the first to enlist in the Army of God and carry the war against the abortionists in a more solid manner...

 

[Softly]

Forrest I don't think anyone is saying that you are wrong but rather that we need to be careful who we team up with. I agree with how horrendous the world has become, that is why I started this thread.

 

[sealacamp]

So there is no line~~anyone is an ally against "evil" even if they are heretics or unbelievers...there is something really creepy about that line of reasoning...but then I understand that the real battle for most here is the preservation of Americanism and that trumps any scriptural/church teachings.

I understand there is a conservative movement in the Church of Satan you can embrace as allies

The line is where Jesus says it is no more no less. He is the one that determines who is His and who is not. In His own words,

Anyone who is not against us is for us.

If you have a problem with what Jesus said I suggest you take it up with Him. I'll listen to Him before I listen to anyone, including you. Now it is a fact that God has His people everywhere and if someone isn't given the chance to reveal their self to you because you place an automatic barricade in their path how many of your brothers and sisters do you block out?

I understand there is a conservative movement in the Church of Satan you can embrace as allies

I'll leave that for you since you are the only one talking about such nonsense.

Sealacamp

 

[Forrest GOP]

Forrest I don't think anyone is saying that you are wrong but rather that we need to be careful who we team up with. I agree with how horrendous the world has become, that is why I started this thread.

Well just for the record: I obviously do not advocate becoming pals or buddies with the local Satanic anti-priest (although if they want to vote Republican thats okay with me). But one poster said something about JW's and Mormons, and as I said, it was the massive push by the Mormon Church that enabled California Proposition 8 to pass in California. If it wasn't for them the measure may have failed.

Here is an interesting hypothetical to ponder: Let's say you are drowning in a freezing river, and at the last second the police & firemen show up. Before they jump in the water to grab you they yell, "Oh, by the way, we have two Buddhists, a Muslim and an athiest here. No Christians. Do you still want us to save you?" What will your reply be?

As I said, its about saving the kids and their future, not about us. Let us not sacrafice them just because we don't like Mary Baker Eddy, the Pope, or the Dalai Lama, or whomever.

 

[Softly]

I would say save me and get me out of this freezing water!

 

[MrJim]

In His own words, If you have a problem with what Jesus said I suggest you take it up with Him. I'll listen to Him before I listen to anyone, including you.

Mt 12:30 NKJV
He who is not with Me is against Me, and he who does not gather with Me scatters abroad.

 

[MrJim]

Well just for the record: I obviously do not advocate becoming pals or buddies with the local Satanic anti-priest (although if they want to vote Republican thats okay with me). But one poster said something about JW's and Mormons, and as I said, it was the massive push by the Mormon Church that enabled California Proposition 8 to pass in California. If it wasn't for them the measure may have failed.

Here is an interesting hypothetical to ponder: Let's say you are drowning in a freezing river, and at the last second the police & firemen show up. Before they jump in the water to grab you they yell, "Oh, by the way, we have two Buddhists, a Muslim and an athiest here. No Christians. Do you still want us to save you?" What will your reply be?

As I said, its about saving the kids and their future, not about us. Let us not sacrafice them just because we don't like Mary Baker Eddy, the Pope, or the Dalai Lama, or whomever.

Ecumenism at it's finest...as long as you are a "good" person all is well...

 

[Forrest GOP]

Ecumenism at it's finest...as long as you are a "good" person all is well...

Ecumenism has to do with religion. I am not talking religion, I'm talking politics.

Okay then, let me put another hypothetical to you: Your only child has a deadly medical condition, and the only doctor qualified to perform the necessary surgery is a Hindu. What will you do sir: Let the man save your child, or let your child die because he is not a Christian? Every aborted baby was somebody's child.

Stone cold conservative in my theology. Pretty dang conservative politically.

I believe also believe that while our Christian ethics should guide and inform ALL aspects of our lives, I don't necessarily see a problem with Christians pulling in the same political direction as those who don't share our faith. If a Jew or a Muslim is anti-abortion, I'd probably march with them, for example.

That is my point precisely. I am not saying we need to go worship with them. But we are in a war against a force that is destroying the fabric of our society, and in such a war, the enemy of my enemy is my friend.