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"Legend of Korra", Eastern Views, T.V & Ethics: What Can Christians learn from Anime?

Gxg (G²)

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Just watched 8 and I'd say the pieces fit. They went through enough trouble to tell Toph's story, suggested the gang isn't working alone, and she's the only one who hasn't made an appearance with only 5 episodes left for the reveal.

I never did like Toph's character very much but I wonder how the fans will feel to find out a member of Aang's Team Avatar fell so far. So if Zaheer could have killed Korra while she was sleeping, why does Toph want her alive?

Also, the lava bending is pretty cool but I really like the metal benders. Whipping around steel cables like that is really terrifying.
Amazing episode..

And what's interesting is that there's one point where they zoom in on the photo of Lin when she grew up. Up close, this is what you see:

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Suyin Beifong working with ZAHEER?! (Book 3) - YouTube
The Legend of Korra Season 3, Episode 5 - The Metal Clan - YouTube

If Zaheer and her are together, it seems obvious at this point. As another said best:

This image has surfaced the internet directly from Comic Con 2014 thanks to avatar-mom. It appears to be a younger Suyin & Zaheer in the circus.

In Book 3 episode 3 The Metal Clan, Suyin mentioned that she joined the Circus. Here is a quote taken from the episode:

When I was sixteen, I left home to explore the world. I sailed the seas on a pirate ship, joined a traveling circus for a while, and lived in a sandbender commune in a desert
.​

Coincidentally, screenshots show that Avatar will be travelling to the Misty Palms Oasis (which is in the desert) and other desert locations in a future episode(s). Zaheer and Suyin in the Circus together, Suyin stating that she used to live in the desert & Team Avatar travelling to the desert as a relevant part to the plot. Could this all be somewhat linked?

The potential routes others can go are endless - as noted best in Legend of Korra Book 3: Bending over Backwards - Page 20. . that said, looking forward to seeing where things go from here...
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Halfway through the season and it seems like Korra's story arc rather minimal. We still know so little about her new pursuers and with no substantial back story, I don't really think they're all that interesting...yet.
Having watched the Stakeout episode, it is interesting to finally have some background on who the Red Lotus are. And seeing what has occurred, it has really has been wild seeing how much more dangerous things are now for Korra. The ways they tied in things with Book 2 and Unalaq was brilliant - and I wonder on what will happen in light of Zaheer's radical stance for anarchy. In some ways, of course, I can agree with others that note that Zaheer is really a Nihilist and that is a bit unsettling - it makes him seem all the more unhinged.. Additionally, it is very fascinating to witness how Zaheer seems to be advocating Buddhist Anarchism in his thoughts. With his desire to bring Chaos, it seems that Vaatu will return or be brought back....but it does make for good discussion on whether or not Zaheer truly believes in being consistent with his thoughts.

As another wisely pointed out, the fundamental paradox of anarchism and why true Anarchy will never emerge is that a true Anarchist would never force the world into Anarchy. Additionally, it is a firm belief of the fundamental philosophy of anarchy (and by fundamental I mean academically fundamental philosophy on anarchy which esteems consensus above all else) that one would never take away the right of an individual to decline to join an anarchic way of life. For the complete freedom of choice is huge to them.

I'd lean toward the version of anarchism that is geared toward not needing governments imposed on others in order to truly survive and thrive as a society since it has been done before where others (changed in their thinking) treated others properly - and I'd also lean toward the view that advocates for resistance toward oppression in any form (more discussed here and Iconocast Episode 30: James H. Cone and here in Christian Anarchism: A Revolutionary Reading of Scripture and Experimental Theology: Christian Anarchism & Atheism ). Yet I don't agree with the ideology that those in power are automatically a negative....and thus, Zaheer is a bit of an issue for me in how he is going about things.

So how the Red Lotus will go about addressing that reality is something to look out for. Nonetheless, it is still very fascinating to see where Zaheer and the Red Lotus are coming from.

We now know that the Red Lotus was formerly associated with White Lotus - AND that after the Hundred Year War, White Lotus came into hiding and began serving people, defying its true purpose according to Zaheer. We also know that Zaheer and Unalaq planned the abduction of Korra when she was five - and that it is true that the Red Lotus wanted to train Korra and lure her into opening the Spirit Portals, with the Red Lotus aiming to bring the governments and their respective figureheads/leaders down. A complete twist on what it means to bring "balance" to the world...

For a good review on the matter, one can investigate THE LEGEND OF KORRA: THE STAKEOUT Review - as it concerns more of Zaheer's backstory.

As another said best in The Legend of Korra: "The Stakeout" Review - IGN and The Legend of Korra "The Stakeout" Review: Red Lotus Petals of Truth - The Legend of Korra Community - TV.com :

I was particularly intrigued by the fact that Unalaq once allied himself with Zaheer and the others, but later betrayed them and covered his tracks. (This of course was to fulfill his eventual goal of becoming the Dark Avatar.) As for Zaheer's plans for the Avatar, they were pretty much what we'd suspected all along -- basically, they wanted to raise Korra themselves and train her in their ways. The question is, given Korra's resolve in the present day, how exactly would the Red Lotus convince her to come to their side? Brainwashing? More compelling evidence for their cause? Not that Zaheer didn't raise any good points; Fire Lord Sozin, the Earth Queen and (to a lesser extent) President Raiko are all valid examples of flawed governments in the nations. (This would seem to align with Suyin's beliefs as well.) Then again, to Korra's point, just because she may not agree with those leaders doesn't mean they should be wiped out completely.

It was also interesting to hear Zaheer bring up Avatar Wan and his "mistake" in closing the portals. Even Korra realized the error in his ways. In that regard, perhaps Zaheer is right: "Once change begins, it can not be stopped, even by the Avatar." Again, much like Amon, I love how Zaheer's arguments aren't necessarily evil for the sake of evil; he only wants to further the change that Korra started. To paraphrase his own words, maybe nations and governments are as foolish as separating the Spirit World from the mortal one
.


"The Stakeout" because it finally provided an answer to the question of what Zaheer and his gang—hereafter the Red Lotus—wanted with Korra all those years ago: to instruct her in a different way of restoring order and balance to the world, before the White Lotus and the rest could fill her head with status quo jargon about queens and presidents and their ideas of what constitutes order and balance. I imagine that they would now like to either convert Korra or kill her so that the Avatar can be reincarnated into a new child... assuming that cycle wasn't broken when Korra lost the connection to her past selves.

...Zaheer wasn't exactly clear, or even consistent, about the ideas of freedom that he and the Red Lotus are all about. He's opposed to corrupt governments, so would he be okay with a non-corrupted government? Or would any centralized system be inherently corrupt and limiting? The bottom line is that anarchists on TV can be a little squishy.


Also, as it concerns the Buddhist themes behind what Zaheer is for (As said best here and in What I think the Red Lotus is planning to do: A prediction by a real life Anarchist! : TheLastAirbender


“True freedom can only be achieved when oppressive governments are brought down,” Zaheer tells Korra, coming clean in a Spirit World safe haven. “The natural order is disorder.”

Is our villain wrong? Achieving a zen state is a lot easier when there aren’t 6 billion people on the planet clashing like a cluster of energized atoms. Politics, morals, religious beliefs, fuzzy factual stances — while these POVs define society, define its inhabitants, they also add clutter.



In real life, a common saying amongst Anarchists is to "Build the new society within the shell of the old" What this effectively means is that before you can overthrow the state, you first need anarchist forms of organisation that are ready and set to take over. This involves creating democratic unions, worker councils and neighbourhood assemblies that are functioning properly BEFORE you start throwing molotov cocktails at cop cars.

So basically, in real life anarchism, Creation needs to precede Destruction. In the Avatar universe, there quite clearly aren't already well-defined, non-hierarchical institutions ready to take over from the state. Zaheer would know this. So any Anarchist revolution would immediately fail in the Avatar universe.

Now, Zaheer's speech to me seems to imply a few interesting things.

First off, "Disorder is the Natural Order" - Zaheer isn't interested in creating anarchist institutions, he's interested in Chaos. From Chaos - Zaheer then seems to think that a better world would naturally emerge from there.

In real life that's stupid - Blunt Chaos would just leave a vacuum of power, wherein a new ruler would emerge. I assume Zaheer knows this. I also assume that we aren't going to be subjected to a season's worth of the Red Lotus engaging in anarchist community building. So what's his plan?

Let's look at this from the Red Lotus' perspective. There are no pre-existing anarchist institutions in this world - no peasant communes, no trade unions or any other institutions that can readily run society without the State. Basically, the people aren't yet ready to govern themselves.

But there is the Avatar, and there is the spirit world. This is a fantasy universe, and the spirit world follows it's own logic and rules.
So now a few predictions

1: I think the Red Lotus follows a specific ideology of either Anarcho Primitivism (Anarcho-primitivism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia) or Buddhist Anarchism (Buddhist anarchism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). Anarcho-Primitivism calls for a return to an earlier state of existence without technology. This is probably similar to what we saw when the Spirit world and Physical world were first fused together.

In real life, Anarcho-Primitivists don't really have a way to bring their ideology about. But in Legend of Korra? We have the spirit world, which brings me to my next point.

2: Buddhist Anarchism praises Chaos as a harbinger of change. But unlike more mainstream anarchists - they don't seem to bother creating their own institutions. Chaos will itself bring change. Now, what entity in this world represents Chaos? That would have to be...

3: Vaatu. Now, Vaatu isn't around right now. But that doesn't mean they can't ressurect Vaatu...inside the body of Raava...which is currently within Korra. Yea, you can see where this is going.
The Red Lotus are planning to subject Korra to a painful and life-threatening ritual - most likely at a temple within the Spirit world. This ritual will fuse Korra with Vaatu, turning her into an Avatar of balance. It will also bring the Spirit world further into the physical world. The Red Lotus are hoping that the presence of the chaotic Spirit world will erode governments in the physical world until change ensures, bringing about true anarchy.

This is pretty evil......It's better that people liberate themselves than "be" liberated by an Avatar of balance.
For more, one can go here to The Legend of Korra’s “Stakeout” Yields Answers to Big Questions. | Tor.com and Korra Vlogs: The Stakeout

Zaheer means business and It's going down soon in the Earth Kingdom...but it's very refreshing to see the ways that he has been contrasted with Korra - both seeking to battle in a duel of philosophies and it'll be interesting to see how the battle plays out in the end. Whether that be both trying to intensely convince the other of their point of view even more - or (in line with Zaheer's desire for Chaos) Korra having to deal with Zaheer trying to ressurect Vaatu again (perhaps within Korra)..who knows. What is clear is that the duel is on




 
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Gxg (G²)

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Maybe a digital route is the way to go. The show has a pretty bad time slot
Seeing the latest episode and what happened, I can now see why they went digital and Nick felt that perhaps it was time to take it off the air - as the series just a good bit darker today, in addition to last week''s episode with Zaheer condemning Aiwei to spiritual death in the Fog of Lost Souls.

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I knew Zaheer and the Red Lotus were intensive - but I wasn't expecting what happened today when he killed the Earth Queen in choosing to literally take her breath away. The first murder of a leader in Legend of Korra and probably the most explicit death we've seen on The Legend of Korra, at least since Tarrlok's murder/suicide in Book One.

I was glad discovering they chose to have an air bending individual as the enemy for this season - but to witness what he did and showing the darker side of air-bending (consistent with air nomad philosophy he was raised on AND being completely peaceable/calm on it throughout the process) took me off guard completely. As another noted best:

Remember how Avatar: The Last Airbender used to position the different forms of bending? Firebending came off as the most threatening, especially because most of the villains were firebenders. Earthbending was kind of dangerous, because, well, rocks hurt. But waterbending and airbending always seemed rather harmless. You could blast people with air or soak them with water, maybe even freeze them in some ice, but the lasting damage never seemed all that severe, physically or psychologically.

And then "The Puppetmaster" introduced bloodbending, and suddenly, a whole new use for waterbending came into horrifying relief. It's scary and creepy, and the franchise's animation of the effects of bloodbending has always stressed its contorted nature, which makes it the worst to see. That leaves airbending as the one seemingly innocent and least life-threatening discipline of the bending arts.

Or rather, it was—right up until Zaheer airbended the air right out of the Earth Queen's body and we had the honor of seeing her eyes bulge as her oxygen swirled about her head until she (apparently) died.

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"You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim... But to your people, freedom is as essential as air."

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As with waterbuilding and bloodbending, it's one of those applications that seems obvious in retrospect—well, of course you could do that!—but it continued to build on Zaheer's adherence to the more radical and less peaceful ideas that have surrounded airbending since the inception of the this franchise. It wasn't just a shocking use of airbending for the sake of a shocking use of airbending. Bending the air out of someone's body isn't something we could imagine Aang, Tenzin, or sweet old Monk Gyatso doing; it spits in the very face of the Air Nomad's respect for all living things, after all.

Air bending just got taken to a new level, as they can literally kill any individual by making a vacuum to suck the air out...expanding upon the air bending arsenal.

The detailing of the scene was literally breathtaking - seeing Zaheer’s tai chi movements, the Earth Queen’s blistering eyes, and her shaking hand as the last breaths of air evaporate above her — it was something that brought home the point that each and every element has a dark side...and it's arguably the case that air bending is possibly the most deadly form of bending in existence - something that the air nomads probably realized and part of the reason the culture (from what we've seen) was so big on restraint. Seeing what Zaheer did made me think "If the air nomads COULD do as Zaheer had done, why didn't they defend themselves and prevent their own genocide?" - but then again, what we're seeing is philosophical differences... Zaheer would have had no problem dealing with the Firelord, unlike Aang who felt that all life was precious.

To be honest, however.... I've always wanted to see the true power of Airbending and yet even a tyrant like her didn't deserve to die that way. I wouldn't even say she deserved to die at all, as she never had anyone killed that we could see and the worst thing she did was conscript Earth Kingdom citizens into the army. At worst, she deserved to be overthrown and replaced with a better Earth Monarch. But given Zaheer's extreme antics, I am not surprised at what he did.

It was fascinating to see the fact that Zaheer was not demonized by the people for what he did. For if Zaheer had murdered an innocent, he’d be the ultimate evil and there would be no problem with Korra choosing to swoop in and take him out as the world cheered on. However, Zaheer was an enemy who actually represents the people - one whom the poor loved when it came to them freeing him. As we see when Gahzan melts down the walls of Ba Sing Se, the people welcomeD the Red Lotus’ revolution - seeing the death of the Queen as the end, as opposed to addressing the means.

Zaheer's philosophy is an excellent means of showcasing what air nomads would look like if they chose to go to war - as the air nomads of Aang's persuasion were about being peaceable and never harming life - like Buddhist do in certain camps. For Zaheer, his form of Buddhist Anarchism is something which would be very much opposite of that - and on the issue, more has been discussed elsewhere on the matter:

People don't like change, especially when they are used to what they already have. It will probably take some sort of catastrophe before the majority of the developed world changes its ways.
Gxg (G²);66123191 said:


There have been cases of others standing in the way of aggressive destruction of the environment (like these Buddhist monks in Cambodia blessing trees which are about to be destroyed to make way for a banana plantation - with the orange cloth making them sacred and used in the hopes of deterring loggers from cutting them down.




But if things do not change, there's no sense in fear being promoted within that system.





I am reminded of where Pulitzer Prize-winning poet Gary Snyder wrote an essay called “Buddhism and the Coming Revolution"....detailing at one point the practice of Buddhist Anarchism (more in Buddhist Anarchism (Gary Snyder) and BUDDHISM AND THE COMING REVOLUTION by Gary Snyder | Arthur Magazine). Buddhist Anarchism is very similar in many ways with Anarcho Primitivism. And interestingly enough, Buddhist Anarchism praises Chaos as a harbinger of change...yet unlike more mainstream anarchists - they don't seem to bother creating their own institutions since Chaos will itself bring change. ..
.. Zen Anarchy (Max Cafard) | The Anarchist Library.

And for others:





As Zaheer noted to the Queen when she was oppressing others, " You think freedom is something you can give and take on a whim... But to your people, freedom is as essential as (pause) air. And without it, there is no life. There is only (pause) darkness." Air cannot be controlled - air is the symbolization of freedom just as the wind goes where it pleases. And likewise, Zaheer feels that true freedom comes with no controls.

We see where Zaheer quoted Guru Laghima and stated that new growth cannot exist without the destruction of the old ..as evidenced by his conversation with Korra in the Spirit world. His allegiance to the teachings of the air bender Guru Laghima make me consider that there was perhaps a fall-out between airbenders in the traditional sense of non-violence and those who were for violence...

Guru Laghima's philosophy is probably the most developed core philosophy of the Air Nomads - as the goal is to free yourself from worldly wants and desires, and be one with the void. It seems possible, of course, that he took it to the extreme - and started thinking that because he was untethered and free because of his teachings, that meant that if everyone else was, there would no more war in the world. What we see now is Zaheer's using the same philosophy but applying it to tearing down the current systems of government in the world. And if Guru Laghima represents an off-shoot of air nomad philosophy, that will be huge in showing where things will go and where they evolved from Wan's time. To have airbenders in the past like Zaheer who admired Vaatu is not surprised when considering how the airbenders actually operated..

There was a scene where the air benders actually met Raava and Wan together and what's interesting is seeing the ways that they are work. They clearly knew more about the spirit world and recognized Vaatu and Raava. Whereas Wans people had no concept of the spirit world beyond the wilds. Specifically, after separating Raava and Vaatu, Wan eventually made his way onto the lion turtle where the air nomads resided and introduced himself to the Nomads - with Vaatu gaining control the spirits on the island and began to terrorize the inhabitants, before revealing his presence, which the airbenders questioned due to the absence of Raava. Wan tried to fight off the spirits with firebending, when Raava arrived.

So even at the beginning of time, there was a respect air benders had for for Vaatu - and thus, they are going to have to go back to address this in order to give more reality to what happened to the evolution of the air benders.

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And they will probably do more exploring on that background later.


It's not accidental that Tenzin and the new airbenders are currently training at the Norther Air Temple, which was also once the home of Guru Laghima - and in light of Laghima's philosophy which Zaheer adopted, one must wonder if perhaps we'll see an eventual confrontation between Zaheer and Tenzin ..both representing two differing schools of thought. As another wisely pointed out...


I feel like it would make a lot of sense and provide the viewers with greater understanding if Tenzin/Kai/Jinora discover a secret room at the Northern Air Temple that once belonged to Laghima which will further explain the Red Lotus' plans (I am guessing Xia Bao was also a fan of Laghima)?
Tenzin had a locket with one of Laghima's poems, so it's unlikely that the Air Nomads ostracized Guru Laghima.

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With Zaheer, we have a side of Air Nomad philosophy which is all for peace - except this peace is one that comes about through violence....one that feels the world should descend back before there was government and society...that chaos is the natural order of things. With Zaheer, we the mirror opposite of who Aang was since his goals are to achieve true freedom for the world but that would also bring chaos too.

For the Red Lotus, they are not so much heartless villains as they are antiheroes - for their methods may be less than benevolent (i.e., killing the Earth Queen, threatening others who do not fall in line with their goals, etc.), but at the end of the day, they're good people who are just trying to make the world a better place for regular people. And that is something that makes things VERY complicated for Korra. It was not accidental that we witness several times throughout the episode this theme, like when Bolin conversed with the lava bender and waterbender and both of them were humanized when they talked about how lonely they were in prison and how they entertained themselves by thinking about the lives of the guards. It was classic witnessing how the lava bender shared a genuine moment of connection with Bolin - and on top pf that, when Zaheer stopped his waterbender associate Ming from hurting the radio guy, saying they were trying to help people like him, it was clear that these guys were not simply out for power.

And again, when the lava bender Ghazan brought down the walls of Ba Sing Se, that was a VERY historic moment...


I wonder how Korra is going to be able to handle things as they are now that the problems have increased for her. Who knows - but one thing is certain, things will NOT be the same afterward.


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I found eps up to 11 here:
Watch Avatar: The Legend of Korra Online

But not sure where the official release is, though
If you go to Nickelodeon at their website -as seen here in The Legend of Korra Full Episodes, Long Live the Queen: Season 2, Episode 210 - you'll find the info there..

That's where I ended up watching it myself. And it's worth the wait - things really have changed in the Avatar world, starting with the people themselves finding freedom regardless of how it comes (and worth debating with Team Avatar). The ways that events are going when considering history are interesting. ...including Zaheer's speech to the people after the fall of the Earth Queen:

"Attention, citizens of Ba Sing Se. I have an important announcement to make. Moments ago, the Earth Queen was brought down at the hands of revolutionaries, including myself. I’m not going to tell you my name, ‘cause my identity is not important. I’m not here to take over the Earth Kingdom. I think you’ve had enough of leaders telling you what to do. It’s time for you to find your own path. No longer will you be oppressed by tirance. From now on, you are free. I deliver Ba Sing Se back into the hands of the people."

Prior to this, we have witnessed where there was a class division promoted by the walls separating parts of the city....and that is something that has marked the city since we first visited it. "The Earth Queen" episode earlier this season served to remind us of the city's intense classism and to showcase that it had, in fact, gotten worse since the end of the 100 Years' War. And it seems that the Earth Kingdom was modeled on 19th century China, a once great power sliding into backwards isolation and corruption as rebellions flare up throughout the countryside. The main bad guys (or anti-heroes) of the show are playing the role of the Taipings in regards to the talk of signs and the righteousness of their cause (from when Zaheer freed Ghazan)..as well as the expansiveness of their rebellion. Although their actions would be very similar to what Amon was about (as he/Equalists were a combination of the Communist Revolution AND The Taiping Rebellion. ), it would also give them a chance to do that story right.

The Earth Queen, in contrast with the four bad guys, plays the role of Empress Dowager Cixi - a very influential figure who many were torn about when it came to her personality and influences (more in [303] The Earth Queen ).

As said best elsewhere on the matter:

While the heroes are occupied elsewhere, Zaheer and the Bad Benders make seismic changes to the Earth Kingdom, killing its queen by pulling the air from her lungs. They successfully hand over the power in Ba Sing Se to an oppressed people, but at what cost?

....There are strong connections to Chinese history all throughout Avatar and Korra, but the influence of real-world events is more explicit than ever in the Earth Queen’s storyline. I should have expected a coming revolution after meeting the Earth Queen, who is clearly modeled after China’s Empress Dowager Cixi, from her costume to her jewelry to her penchant for meticulous, extravagant landscaping.





Cixi was the power behind the throne for most of the second half of the 19th century, and saw the dynasty’s power dramatically weaken under her unofficial rule. Three years after her death, the imperial dynasty would collapse during the Xinhai Revolution, but this show weaves her death and the uprising together for greater dramatic effect.

.....The Earth Queen is not a good ruler, but does that mean she deserves to die? Ba Sing Se descends into chaos after the demise of the queen and the crumbling of the city’s walls, but a tyrannical ruler is no longer in power and the people theoretically have control of their home again. These are good things, right? Avatar and Korra have never shied away from philosophical and political complexity, but this season has taken it to a completely different level, showing both sides of a conflict and forcing the viewer to decide which one is more just.​



















































The Avatar has her work cut out for her from here on out. She already failed at protecting the Earth Queen from the fate that came upon her...

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And now, she's going to have to step it up with defending herself and doing the best she can to protect the world - and keep herself in tact as she already has done.



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I just finished episode 10 and there is so much to process. First, I love how the show throws out the cliche story formulas and isn't afraid of complexity and dramatic reveals.

I still wasn't impressed with Zaheer until this episode. I prefer a calm, cool, intelligent, skilled, and in control villain rather than an incompetent, ego maniacal, villain any day.

What a really slow, disturbing death scene for the queen; I didn't think they would go through with it. And Zaheer is just so blase about it and then sent the evilness factor off the chart.

As far as Zaheer's plans, I tend to think larger populations are more likely to need governments. Given the world's industrial state in the show and the distribution of wealth in the city, a sudden power vacuum will certainly cause chaos. On the other hand, power corrupts, so don't corrupt governments introduce their own chaos and anarchy? And is chaos and anarchy really the natural order of the universe? What about physics and math? Maybe there needs to be a balance between freedom and justice.
 
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I just finished episode 10 and there is so much to process. First, I love how the show throws out the cliche story formulas and isn't afraid of complexity and dramatic reveals..
After what has occurred this season, indeed, there is so much to process on with the direction they are going. They have definitely gone against formulas on several levels - and the nuances within the series have gotten more intricate. There are truly a lot of shades of grey...
I still wasn't impressed with Zaheer until this episode. I prefer a calm, cool, intelligent, skilled, and in control villain rather than an incompetent, ego maniacal, villain any day.
More than agree - although I can't really stand incompetence in any kind of variation of villain, even the calm/collected ones who seem patient. But with Zaheer, I was honestly impressed at how strong-willed, staunch and extreme the man was in going after what he feels to be right. The way he is portrayed as clever / charismatic and respectful helps as well..

What a really slow, disturbing death scene for the queen; I didn't think they would go through with it. And Zaheer is just so blase about it and then sent the evilness factor off the chart.
It was very much something which made me think the man was highly unhinged in several ways - for I appreciate how he's highly philosophical on what life is about and it's cool to see him zealous in his dedication to the Air Nomads' philosophy. But what he did to the Queen and his goal of chaos still shows that the man is still highly dangerous - the ends cannot justify the means.
As far as Zaheer's plans, I tend to think larger populations are more likely to need governments. Given the world's industrial state in the show and the distribution of wealth in the city, a sudden power vacuum will certainly cause chaos. On the other hand, power corrupts, so don't corrupt governments introduce their own chaos and anarchy?
Good questions

As it concerns the dynamic of governments, corrupt governments do create chaos - but it often happens at a slow rate....and sometimes the consequences can erupt quickly.

For trying to establish massive rapid change in total, you need more than a corrupt government (which can go between times of being stable and correcting the errors it allowed and then times where it is off and makes more problems). You need a system's shut-down on all levels. A power vacuum can cause chaos - but it can be replaced...and thus, you need to keep on adding to the problem with more problems bigger than a vacuum. Zaheer's plan as it has unfolded thus far is based on violence solving economic problems - but the potential for the people organizing peacefully in a new way where there's no state could also begin.....perhaps something Korra would end up supporting to counter the way Zaheer is trying to go about it via Chaos.

For Large populations without governments (and yet having massive industrialization) will either end up going to "Might Makes Right" /Mob Rule (which tends to be unfavorable many times if the people are ignorant and violent) as they expand - or they will choose to simplify how they live with technology and the environment and work wisely with their resources while also going to the Town Model where you work village to village on a local level....similar to how it was in the Roman Empire during its twilight era. This has also been advocated in regards to the African context - as noted best in African Anarchism - Sam Mbah, Chaz Bufe (also shared in African Anarchism: The History of A Movement (Sam Mbah & I.E. Igariwey) | The Anarchist Library ) and Africa: Endurance and Change South of the Sahara - Catherine Coquery-Vidrovitch - Google Books

Part of what Zaheer has advocated is interesting since one can consider the dynamic of seeing where there has been treating of anarchism as a critique of centralized state power, with radical Daoist thought from the 4th century BCE to the 9th century CE a and Daoist philosophers / poets being akin Western anarchist and utopian thinkers - as noted best in Daoism and Anarchism: Critiques of State Autonomy in Ancient and Modern China - John A. Rapp - Google Books

Moreover, one can consider Tibet as a Stateless Society - for Tibet historically was a region where a centralized state was barely achievable, and Tibetan political structures had more solidarity with stateless societies than with states...with a big influence being the Buddhism in Tibetan society

Stateless societies were the norm in human prehistory (more here/here) AND the dynamic of a stateless society isn't necessarily one that has to automatically result in violence - as it all comes down to the disposition others may have before things happen, just as it is with governments and how people (if of good will/having a heart to serve) can do much with a state focus. With Stateless societies, there have been many "primitive" tribal peoples who actually made a conscious decision to adopt a "simpler" lifestyle in order to avoid the burdens of living under organized states - as noted best in The Art of Not Being Governed: An Anarchist History of Upland Southeast Asia - James C. Scott by James Scott, Sterling Professor of Political Science, Professor of Anthropology, and Co-Director of the Agrarian Studies Program. (and for review, one can go to The Art of Not Being Governed - Jesus Radicals )

â’¶ The Art of Not Being Governed â’¶ - YouTube

With industrialized nations that have bigger populations, it's more than possible to decentralize - if we really wished to go to there. Others have proposed this in books such as Sacred Economics by Charles Eisenstein.

The New Edge of Radical Economics - David Graeber & Charles Eisenstein - YouTube


.. is chaos and anarchy really the natural order of the universe? What about physics and math? Maybe there needs to be a balance between freedom and justice.

I think there's something to be said about how there's much order within the universe....but naturally, there's the dynamic of things tending to decay over time as well. The second law of thermodynamics (entropy) comes to mind with regards to how the universe itself will eventually die without - having a theistic view as I have, I believe this is what will occur regardless without God's intervention. But outside of that, things tend to not become more orderly as time goes by...but more out of control. And within the universe I see a lot of order. As said elsewhere, C.S Lewis said, "Men became scientific because they expected law in nature and they expected law in nature because they believed in a lawgiver." Galileo (1564-1642), Kelper (1571-1630), Pascal (1623-1662), Boyle (1627-1691), Newton (1642-1727), Faraday (1791-1867), Babbage (1792-1871), Mendel (1822-1884), Pasteur (1822-1895), Kelvin (1824-1907), and Clerk-Maxwell (1831-1879) were all theists, most of them Christians. Their belief in God, far from being a hindrance to their science, was often the main inspiration for it....for as Johannes Kepler wrote, "The chief aim of all investigations of the external world should be to discover the rational order which has been imposed on it by God, and which he revealed to us in the language of mathematics. " ( Astronomia Nova De Motibus )
 
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As far as Zaheer's plans, I tend to think larger populations are more likely to need governments. Given the world's industrial state in the show and the distribution of wealth in the city, a sudden power vacuum will certainly cause chaos..
Seeing that even power vacuums can be fixed by a replaced leader, I'm agreeing with others who are calling it now and saying that Zaheer is going to tell Korra how to restore Vaatu and somehow connect within Raava since Vaatu is the only one who will be able to spread chaos on a massive scale that can throw off the industrial state of the world - more shared in I think Zaheer will tell Korra how to restore her connection to the previous Avatars : TheLastAirbender

As another said

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By “destroying” him rather than rebinding him, he now is part of Raava - which means part of the Avatar. Change through destruction is his nature! Korra leaving the portals open reflects this shift in the nature of the Avatar.

...Watching the Book 2 finale yesterday got me thinking. Vaatu is “vanquished.” But when Raava was destroyed Korra could find Raava in Vaatu (neither of them can exist without the other). If Korra can find Raava in Vaatu then, conceivably Vaatu is also in Raava. Since Korra has Raava inside her again that means she can have Vaatu there as well.

I really hope this comes up. I want her to have a moment where she gets so angry that she triggers Vaatu instead of Raava.​

Thoughts? I think this is more than reasonable. The other theory I have, of course, is that they intend to permanently separate the Avatar spirit and free both Raava and Vaatu back into the world as they were when Wan first encountered them.


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For killing Korra would just set the cycle off again and they'd have to go looking for the Earth bender baby (or whatever element the Avatar came into) she reincarnated as.
 
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I still wasn't impressed with Zaheer until this episode. I prefer a calm, cool, intelligent, skilled, and in control villain rather than an incompetent, ego maniacal, villain any day.

What a really slow, disturbing death scene for the queen; I didn't think they would go through with it. And Zaheer is just so blase about it and then sent the evilness factor off the chart.
Where Zaheer is going is a direction that makes me not really respect him on some levels - even though others he definitely caught my attention more. As another noted in REVIEW: Legend of Korra 3×10 “Long Live the Queen” | A Place to Hang Your Cape



I have seen many people die in both animation and on TV but Zaheer rocketed to the top of my list for screwed up way to kill someone. What really manages to blow me away on a weekly basis is just how creative Zaheer is as a villain as he does not restrict himself to the grand scheme and evil machinations. The sheer fact that he was willing to call an audible when he discovered Korra’s airship had been downed in the desert shows that he will go with the flow as long as his objective is complete. I just have to commend Henry Rollins for his magnificent performance this week, Zaheer has been a shining star entire season but his entire monologue while was truly astounding.

The question is now that Ba Sing Se’s queen is dead, who Zaheer will target next? There are many different options, Raiko or Tonraq seem to be the most likely, but it would be in Zaheer’s nature to possibly go after Zuko’s daughter as we have not seen her and it would be who Korra least expects.
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If Korra's father gets harmed by Zaheer, I will have some serious issues with the man on top of the ones I already have.

Maybe there needs to be a balance between freedom and justice.

The way that things are going, I think Korra is going to be placed in a position where she's truly able to save the day and show what balance is really about - even if it means alteration as she seeks to fight Zaheer in his philosophy and bring things back to how they were meant to be..

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I just finished episode 10 and there is so much to process. First, I love how the show throws out the cliche story formulas and isn't afraid of complexity and dramatic reveals.

I still wasn't impressed with Zaheer until this episode. I prefer a calm, cool, intelligent, skilled, and in control villain rather than an incompetent, ego maniacal, villain any day.
.
Praying for Korra to make it out of all that's going on..


Seeing what has thus far happened - especially with the treatment of the airbenders in this episode - I got really ticked off at the villains. The man is truly crazy, IMHO, and needs to die - especially after what he and others did to Tenzin for resisting.


At this point, all talk of being for "the people" went OUT the window when seeing the ways they placed the air benders in danger just to get to Korra....and ironic that there's so much talk of freedom for the people and yet they were willing to oppress others. A

In many ways, it's similar to how dictators are revealed when seeing them willing to do the same thing that they say they want to prevent others from doing. As said best in The Legend of Korra: "The Ultimatum" Review - IGN :

Of course, things got a little more serious upon Korra hearing Zaheer's message. I especially found it interesting that Zaheer's confidence is starting to waver, since he seems to have compromised his generosity to the common people (in this case, to airbenders). More importantly, though, Zaheer's threat put Korra in a uniquely difficult position, forcing her to decide between two options: save the Air Nation and sacrifice the Avatar, or vice versa.

And the ways things are looking in the Earth Kingdom don't seem to be better - but worse...even though there are things for redemption.

That said, I have to say that Tenzin rocked putting them all into check as much as possible. That's a REAL air bender there:cool: And I appreciate the ways he contrasted with Aang who earlier defended the Northern Air Temple from being defiled:

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Tenzin had Zaheer owned, but he unfortunately had to cheat and get his crew to save him.

Kya and Bumi really did amazing as well...despite where they had difficulty.

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It really makes you wonder how they would have all faired if they were a family..

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Really suspenseful episode - and thankful for Zuko being a guide for Korra as well

But to see where the series is going is wild. It really did seem at the beginning like a demonstration of the Earth Kingdom capital’s version of The Purge. And with pure freedom, it was sad to witness how even the Queen's guards weren't keeping looters at bay since they were leading them to the good stuff. And the scenery did not indicate whatsoever that things were better because of Zaheer. For Zaheer wanted to free the people of Ba Sing Se from the tyranny of government order and now they have chaos - but what does it matter when seeing that the revolution successful if the lives we’re living now smolder into ash?

And when seeing how the price of freedom would mean even innocent people being harmed like with the air nation, I have to say that it's a much more intensive world. But I'm so glad for the hope they do have thus far to handle it :)

Hoping Korra survives it all...

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Gxg (G²);64654200 said:
It'd be cool if the Avatar creators got to tell the story of an Airbender villain centuries before Aang's time - perhaps even before the time of the Air Nomads (we know for a fact that some of the four nations didn't always have the cultures they do now, like the Sun Warriors and the first earthbenders).

That would be a pretty cool story line but I think Book 3 is supposed to be based on earth, so I'm guessing it will detail Beifong's back story.
Gxg (G²);64654480 said:
With Book 3 being based on Earth, that'd not be a problem as it concerns Air monks. For you could easily give previews or hints in preparation for Book 4 which focuses on the Fire Nation.

You could have it where the Airbenders have grown in numbers (Although hidden) - as there was really no proof given in the series that Aang was truly the Last Airbender.


As another noted best (And as said earlier)


Here’s a newsflash if you haven’t watched much of the series. Aang is very clearly not the last of the Airbenders. In fact, when the show was released outside of America, it was called Avatar: The Legend of Aang.

This seems fairly obvious, once you consider it. If every Avatar must master all four bending arts, and the old Avatar must die in order for the new one to reincarnate, then if Aang really is the last airbender, the Avatar cycle breaks with his death. The next Avatar would have no one to learn airbending from.

But beyond the logical considerations, several details in the show subtly reinforce this idea without ever directly referencing it. The characters visit four different air temples (there are either four or five in total, depending on who you ask), but only the Southern Temple, the one closest to the Fire Nation, has any damage or signs of battle. While the Fire Nation is a nation, the Earth Kingdom a kingdom, and the Water Tribes are tribes, the airbenders are called nomads. When he finds that Fire Nation children are taught that their glorious leader Fire Lord Sozin defeated ferocious airbender armies, Aang responds “But the Airbenders had no armies.” It is easy to see how the highly militaristic and xenophobic leaders of the Fire Nation might have inflated a single battle at one Temple into a glorious war, especially if they couldn’t find any other airbenders to fight.

After all, the Fire Nation supposedly routed the airbenders one hundred years before they gained access to airships. It is very plausible that, after seeing the carnage at the Southern Air Temple (where, by the way, there are a great many Fire Nation bodies, and very few airbender bodies), the Air Nomads simply decided to pull up stakes and move somewhere were the other nations could not reach them since they were the only people in that time period who could fly.


As Aang was never shown to truly be the last Airbender, that'd mean other airbenders are elsewhere - but in secret. And with numbers increased, you could have it where with Book 4 (focused on Fire), those Airbenders would want to take revenge and finish the Firebenders for eliminating them in the Hundred Year War. That would give room for discussing some of the background with what happened to Zuko and Iroh - or things that were considered in their time and yet never tackled.


Going back over the series from before, it just occurred to me that the writers may have found the best way to tie in what happened to the air nomads (after the Air Temple Genocide) with the Earth Kingdom. For when seeing how Harmonic Convergence revealed Air Nomads throughout the Earth Kingdom, it occurred to me that the best way to resolve this issue was to have it where survivors of the genocide hid out in the Earth Kingdom.

As another noted wisely and Zaheer's ethnicity? / Racebending.com : The Air Nomad Genocide


Zhao (in one of the comics) said that Air Nomad cultural artifacts were used to lure surviving Air Nomads, and it was an Air Nomad who turned on his people and had the Fire Nation attack them (the same monk was later executed). There was also an Air Nomad girl who survived, and she lived in a forest and would fight whenever she could.

Monk Gyatso took out a room full of Fire Nation soldiers before he died, which confirms that airbenders knew some deadly attacks, and coincides with the fandom headcanon that the real reason Sozin had the Air Nomads wiped out was because they were really the most dangerous.

Although I’m still of the personal belief that some Air Nomads did in fact survive all that, and that there’s a secret society of them living somewhere, like the Sun Warriors.

.....If anyone was half the bender Monk Gyatso was, it’s possible that the Air Nomads could have been a force to be reckoned with if they had a formal military. Aang is a pretty darn good airbender during the events of A:TLA and his training wasn’t even finished yet. I’m glad that in the comics (which, unfortunately, I have not read yet) there were some survivors.


I came up with this hypothesis several weeks ago, and now I'm waiting for it to be revealed that the new Airbenders sprung up because they were the descendants of the original Air Nomads who escaped the genocide 170 years ago and hid out in the Earth Kingdom. They passed down the bloodlines of Airbenders, but because they had to stay on the down-low few, if any, of their descendants manifested the ability, and knowledge of their heritage has mostly been lost. This is also why you don't hear about new Airbenders in the Fire Nation or the Water Tribes: the Water Tribes were too distant for the Air Nomads to flee to, and the Fire Nation would be a terrible place for them to hide.

Harmonic Convergence didn't just randomly spit out spirit energy to give a ton of people Airbending. It just reawakened the latent ability to Airbend in those who still carried enough Air Nomad bloodline to exhibit it. It also explains Zaheer's origins: he didn't become an Airbender by some crazy one-in-a-million roll of the dice... one of the few people who's an Air Nomad evangelist just happening to get hit by Harmonic Convergence that way by coincidence? Not likely.

The truth is, he not only was descended from Air Nomads, but he was one of the very few who was aware of his origins. He probably grew up with his parents teaching him all about Air Nomad philosophy and walking him through Airbender forms, which is why he was a proficient Airbender in his jailbreak even though the awakened ability was so new to him.

Again, just a guess...but seeing how they've connected things with Beigfong already and the air nomads coming out of nowhere is a bit of a puzzle, I think it's more than possible. The ways that Air Nomad culture could be explored and brought together more has potential...

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I'm waiting on another good Cyberpunk anime to watch .
Gxg, do you recommend any animes with strong religious themes?

Although it may be debated as to whether or not the series was truly religious (as well as anime since it's not pure anime, per se), one series I forgot to reference earlier was called "Samurai Jack" - it it noteworthy for its anime/manga-like emphasis on visual storytelling and a minimalist, yet atmospheric animation style. As said in brief synopsis of the story:

SSamurai Jack tells the story of a young prince (Jack) from Feudal Japan whose father's empire is destroyed by the shape shifting demon Aku. As a child, the prince escapes destruction and travels the world training his mind and his body for years until he reaches adulthood, becoming a legendary samurai. After taking his father's magic katana, he challenges Aku to a duel and defeats the demon. However, before the prince can deal the killing blow, Aku creates a time portal and sends his opponent into the distant future, anticipating that he would be able to amass sufficient power to deal with the samurai later.

...He arrives in a dystopian, retro-futuristic Earth ruled by Aku and filled with his robot minions and a large number of alien immigrant races of various appearances. The first people he encounters in the future call him "Jack" as a form of slang, which he adopts as his name (his true given name is never mentioned in the series)........Samurai Jack takes place in a world where science and technology have developed far beyond what is available in the present day, and in some ways resembles magic on its own. However, despite scientific advances, the future is decidedly dystopian—for example, in one episode the mafia profits greatly from the sale of simple water. Aliens, bounty hunters, and robots are plentiful, and always ready for a fight. The leader of this world is Aku.

While the setting is distinctly retro-futuristic and technological, instances of mythology and supernatural events do occur....Stories take place in a variety of locations. Ranging from beautiful wilderness to futuristic or even dystopian cities, there is often a stark contrast made between the industrial world and the natural world.

.

For good reviews on the matter, one can go to the following:



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I just finished episode 10 and there is so much to process.
Don't know if you saw the season finale - but if not, it's epic.

Amazing - but I don't know how to feel about it....and who knows where we'll go from here. Bottom line, it was beautiful - and yet saddening at the same time.




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Gxg (G²);66206998 said:
Don't know if you saw the season finale - but if not, it's epic.

Amazing - but I don't know how to feel about it....and who knows where we'll go from here. Bottom line, it was beautiful - and yet saddening at the same time.

Just watched it.
It's pretty cool that they dared not to have that convenient happy ending where everyone stands around laughing at a really corny pun.
 
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Just watched it.
It's pretty cool that they dared not to have that convenient happy ending where everyone stands around laughing at a really corny pun.
So true. It REALLY wasn't a convenient happy ending, at all..

I truly felt sorrow at the end of the series - like Korra had truly been crippled (even though there were other amazing things that happened, from Suyin and Lin working together to Bolin growing into a Lava bender , Tonraq being a BOSS protecting his daughter true daddy style, the bad guys getting pretty epic yet well deserved deaths and the air benders rising up and learning to embrace change via working as a team, etc.).

I agree with other reviews that have noted it was truly "an emotional hurricane" and the best yet - demonstrating that Korra is the strongest Avatar in history and yet the most vulnerable. And something to give much to think on. As another noted best:

..speaking of said poisoning, what a crazy sequence. That was some anime near body horror there, and seeing the Red Lotus members inject the poison through Korra’s skin was one of the darker scenes of the show’s history.....The ultimate conclusion to the gigantic ending fight was pretty simple, but effective, and I think it was a smart move on the writers’ parts to have the airbenders be the one to ultimately “save” Korra. This whole season has been building up to the return of a proper Air Nation, and them working together as a unit to save the Avatar was a fantastic moment.....The final moments of “Venom of the Red Lotus” were bittersweet, to say the least. On the one hand, Jinora was finally getting her tattoos, which was a great little victory moment following a lot of dire situations and dark sequences. But on the other there remained a lot of tragedy in this final sequence, and I’m still not sure what to make of the final shot of Korra crying: was she doing it out of happiness for Jinora, or depression due to her handicapped state? Honestly, I’m leaning to the latter, simply because of the way she was behaving leading up to the actual ceremony. She had the face and attitude of someone who seemed to be very much in depression, and it makes sense that someone as heavy on movement and physicality would be upset about being in such a weakened state. The way the other characters were discussing things her condition seems to be temporary, but we’ll just have to wait until next season to see if that is indeed the case.


Curious as to whether you felt it was the best yet or had reservations.
 
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I didn't feel the same satisfaction as I did with the series finale of the original AtLAB. I think it had a little more realistic ending though. Korra's tasked with repeatedly having to save the world while her life and those of her friends and family are consistently in danger and there's basically no appreciation. After all she's been through, I don't think I could blame her for wanting to throw in the towel.
 
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I didn't feel the same satisfaction as I did with the series finale of the original AtLAB. I think it had a little more realistic ending though. Korra's tasked with repeatedly having to save the world while her life and those of her friends and family are consistently in danger and there's basically no appreciation. After all she's been through, I don't think I could blame her for wanting to throw in the towel.
What would have caused satisfaction on the same level as AtLAB?

As it concerns the ending, I agree that it was realistic in multiple ways - it seemed (outside of her friends/family) that she often seemed unappreciated in this season and always losing a part of herself in the process - first having her bending removed (but restored with Amon), then having her connection with the past Avatars destroyed (with Unalaq/Vaatu) - and now having to deal with being nearly killed/brought to the point of insanity while being unable to stop a revolution in the Earth Kingdom (by Zaheer) ....it seems like she really has started to morph into an Avatar with a tragic end.

It seemed like she was really going into a big Change with embracing hopelessness - or knowing she'd never have real rest for herself (like Frodo Baggins after saving the shire in "Lord of the Rings" and yet being so deeply traumatized he couldn't live in Middle Earth any longer and needed to leave to the Undying Lands for healing the damage to his spirit that bearing the Ring had caused). If she's confined to a crippled state, that'll be the first for an Avatar. She definitely didn't deserve all of the things that came her way...






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Gxg (G²)

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Has anyone seen Mushi-shi? I think you'd both enjoy it, especially you Gxg. It's a very relaxing show to watch and episodic, more or less without an overarching plot but it employs a lot of Shinto and traditional Japanese spiritualism. It's a great re-envisioning of some ancient stories and some created ones. I
I wouldn't be surprised if they end up placing it up on Adult Swim, seeing that they ended up going back to airing animes like they used to do in the 90s when it came to what's known as Toonam (nostalgia kicking in, including the music they did which was crazy[/URL] ^_^ ).







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So glad they brought Toonami back since it was where I got exposed to a good number of animes as did others - and hopefully, they'll do more with it coming up soon. As another noted recently:


If you’re an anime fan, you’ve probably heard of Toonami. And If you are like me, then Tom was the first person to introduce you to the world of anime. After its comeback, it is now on the Saturday night block on Adult Swim. You can see they are still doing their thing, like bringing you Space Dandy and Attack on Titan. But I feel like it doesn’t have the same impact as it once did, which makes me think it would be a good thing if Toonami had its own Television channel.

Just like Cartoon Network, Nick, and Disney, Toonami could be a television channel that only shows anime and mature cartoons. We could get anime like Deadman Wonderland and Samurai Champloo that were a one time thing to re-run episodes every now and again. Also, they can bring back some good cartoons. They could start playing shows like Samurai Jack and Batman and they could bring back Young Justice, or at least play re-runs of it. Also, if they show anime and mature cartoons, it might attract more people to anime. Toonami attracted many people to DBZ for instance. Even non anime fans have seen DBZ.

And, if you haven’t heard, Japan is planning on taking down illegal anime and manga sites. Likely, they want to stop their anime from being uploaded and watched for free. Well, for us American fans, there aren’t many options to watch it. We do have Toonami, but that’s only one day a week,
 
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awitch

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Gxg (G²);66208773 said:
What would have caused satisfaction on the same level as AtLAB?

I don't know really. Maybe a little more closure with Zaheer and his minions. If they could kill the Earth Queen they should be able to kill them off, or at least strip away their ability to bend.

I didn't really get Zaheer's ability to fly either. We saw plenty of air benders sitting on their swirling globes of air or using their gliders.

I wonder if the next book is going to be a story arc about the world balancing itself to save the avatar.
 
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