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Just... need to vent somewhere.

Lostandfoundgirl

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I have to get this stuff off my chest. I figure this forum is the best place to vent it, since my experience of you guys so far has been very positive and comforting.

Where do I start? I guess I just need to rant about what this so-called "journey to faith", or more realistically, "plummet into insanity", has done to me recently.

It's like... faith is supposed to be this glorious thing, but to me it just seems like this nexus of contradictions and fears. One minute, you're being told God loves you. The next minute, you're a sinner and going to Hell. One minute, I'm reading that our acts and deeds don't decide whether we go to heaven. The next, I'm scared to order a prawn sandwich in a restaurant because I've read this article about how Christians ought to obey Levitican law because it's God's word.

And worse than that, my life hasn't been enriched recently. It has been destroyed. I haven't started seeing God's splendour in everything and feeling inclined to love people. No, rather, I've come to loathe the world, and treat life with utter indifference. I try to relax, sit back, watch a DVD of my favourite sitcom; yet, suddenly, I realise that the jokes are sexual, that the characters have no religious conviction, that the lifestyle and humour being advocated is what makes modern society hellbound, and I have to switch it off, pace the room, slide into terror again.

I try to read books, but then modern literature is secular, and instead of enjoying the narrative, I'm thinking about discussions I've heard of the end times, how the world has turned from God, and this sick sick thought of Satan's power being behind entertainment creeps into my mind, and I'm scared, and I'm sad, and I look around me and see nothing but fear-inducing sin, a world doomed to damnation according to Christianity. And do I feel saved? Does my heart dance with delight in the Lord? No, I feel sick to my stomach, I wish I was born in a simpler age, and I walk down the street gazing with sadness at everything around me which, Christianity tells me, is a sin. I see girlfriends and boyfriends, loved up, holding hands in the park; normal, happy 21st century couples. And I wonder, is their pre-marital sex going to condemn them to perpetual torment? I chat to gay friends, and bite me lip, wondering, what if? What if they are an abomination? What if my chilled out, tolerent, anti-homophobic attitude is wrong?

My friends ask me if I'd like to go out. I just see meaning in nothing. If all we are truly created for is to live, what, a maximum of 100 or so years, then we have a judgement and go one way or the other for a timescale incomprehensible to our frail human minds; who cares then, if a good movie has come out, or if it's sunny or raining, or anything else? What's the point of comedy, of literature, of music, of dancing, of anything, if we really are just created to spend a couple of decades auditioning for some role of which, ultimately, we're told none of us are worthy. Why would I want to go shopping, or write an essay, or go for a walk, or anything, if ultimately this life is nothing more than a test to decide whether we're going up or down?

And then there's the contradiction of humility and faith. Isn't it a bit self-righteous to proclaim ourselves saved? Then to say "but we're still sinners"... I mean, what? I'm going to continue sinning, whether I come through this half-journey to faith or not. I'm going to continue having sex before marriage. I cannot feel convinced not to. I am going to continue my sarcastic and mildly insulting humour which makes people laugh. I am going to eat ham, and prawns, and wear clothes without checking whether they're made of mixed materials. I'm told to love life, to enjoy the gift the Father gave me; then I'm told that the things which make me happy are a direct rebellion against God.

Why did God give us personalities, if they drive us from him? I am sarcastic. I am daft. I make crude remarks. I enjoy going out, having a bit too much to drink, talking nonsense, taking photos of myself and friends being ridiculous and having a whale of a time, and waking up in the morning groaning at my own silliness. I don't sleep around, and I don't want meaningless sex. However, when I feel a connection with someone, if it's a moment of passion with a friend, or the start of a relationship, sex to me is meaningful. It's a physical expression of attraction. I don't go out and sleep with strangers. I use contraception. By 21st century, average-joe standards, I'm fairly moral sexually. But religion is telling me I'm a vile fornicator, bound for Hell. I don't want to wait until I'm married. I don't only want sex with one person, for procreation. But I'm being told by other people that God wants me to do that. I'm being told that drunkenness is a sin, as is masturbation, as is my general outlook on life; that of a mildly crazy student, making the most of life, being happy, trying to be nice to people and help people, giving change to the homeless, making time for family and friends, smiling at people on the street... you know, being generally loving. But as for the purity and seriousness... it's directly contradictory to my nature.

I have a moral core. I f*ck up sometimes, don't we all. I mean, I'm swearing on a Christian forum now, pretty sure that's not great. But I don't go around trying to ruin other people's careers, or laughing at people's suffering, or being violent, or deliberately insulting people, or refusing to help others, or putting myself before others. I'm generally a very decent person, but that comes from me being happy; and I'm happy because I live my life including the drunken nights, the occasional sexual encounter, the pretty un-PC sense of humour, the sarcasm, the fun of putting on a posh frock and slapping on the make-up and being a bit flirtatious... I mean, if I started wearing ankle-length skirts, no make-up, stopped dying my hair, stopped drinking, took a vow of chastity, spent my days reading Scripture and shunning even the slightest whiff of Heat magazine or Bridget Jones' Diary... sure, I'd be a "good Christian". But I wouldn't be happy. And what's more, I wouldn't be me.

I don't feel like the move to faith would be me accepting Christ. It would feel like me totally denying who I am, and living a lie.

I am a horrid sinner. Aren't we all? I spent most of my adolescence as a militant atheist, mocking Christians, shunning the church, rolling my eyes at it all, doing my own thing... wasn't it St Paul who originally persecuted Christians? Well sorry folks, I'm not writing Letters to the Corinthians or whatever, just Posts to the Forums, which admittedly is marginally less powerful a title. Probably got my references wrong there; ah well. I'm pretty clueless. I'm just utterly bewildered.

I'm told the idea of salvation is "go and sin no more". Well, I'm sorry, but I just don't understand what is and isn't sin. Sex is the biggie for me at the moment; there's so much debate about "porneia" or whatever the word is, and sexual immorality, etc etc, that all I'm thinking is "but is it REALLY immoral, if it's intended as mutual expression of attraction, not just self-gratification at the expense of another?" Drunkenness is another biggie. I'm no alcoholic, but I am a young woman with a student lifestyle, who very much enjoys having a teensy bit too much wine and getting a bit daft and giggly, and cringing at photos the next day. I like to eat shellfish, I love my steak medium-rare, and I do love my bacon sandwiches (usually after aforementioned nights of alcohol...)

Christians talk about rebirth, about starting a new life. Well, I tried it. I went without alcohol for a while, I told myself I'd save sex until marriage now, I stopped fussing so much over my appearance... and did it make me a loving, caring person? No. I became depressed, irritable, and well over the borderline of insanity. My quest to live a pure, Christian life left me sitting, staring blankly into space, my friends and family despairing, trying to get me to take an interest in things which I looked on as worldly and unimportant... my attempts to contemplate morality and scripture instead turned into my constantly convincing myself that I and those around me were damned, my friends began getting irritated with me talking of nothing but issues of doctrine or moral debates between denominations. My sense of humour was lost, my sense of fun turned to guilt and fear over every little action, and the "gift" of life became a burden, as I found myself unable to remain optimistic in a world so far from Christian standards of perfection.

And what do people say to me? "we want YOU back." I am not me. I am a nervous wreck, I am a guilt-ridden mute, I am driving friends away and driving family to despair.

It all seems a bit extreme, I know. And this isn't as simple as "I'm going nuts because I'm being told to stop having sex and drinking". It may sound like that, but those are just a few examples. I've been stressed over everything from Sabbath-keeping to tithing, from homosexuality debates to wondering if those who commit suicide really have done something unforgivable. It's just this constant stream of thinking everything is wrong, that modern society has gone to the devil, and that enjoying myself in the ways that match my (usually) outgoing, quirky, eccentric and energetic personality will mean I'm defying God.

Everything just feels so meaningless. Films, TV, music, politics, books, my career... if all it comes down to is "you're going to die, be judged, spend an eternity there or THERE", I'm sorry, but my couple of decades here in this life suddenly feel so meaningless and terrifying.

This rant hasn't been as coherent as I planned for it to be. Oh well. I'll shut up for now and come back if/when I have something constructive to say.

Over and out.
 

lismore

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I've been stressed over everything from Sabbath-keeping to tithing

Hello Lostandfoundgirl:wave:

If you look at my thread 'self-loathing', I think we are going through or have gone through many of the same issues.

As Merlin said, hang in there.

There is so much junk in Christianity that can attach to a searching Christian.......

And stress over tithing, yes I've been there and heard that. Emotional blackmail and threats, 'God won't bless you if you dont tithe' , 'Your not a real Christian if you dont blah blah'.

God is love. All this other stuff....is not love. Is not from God.

God Bless:)

Lismore
 
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Lostandfoundgirl

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:) tithing isn't a biggie for me at the moment since I'm not even attending church (I'm doing a denomination-tour once I'm back in Uni), the biggies for me at the moment are sex, sexuality, and drink. I find it so difficult to be black-and-white with things. It's like, I plan to stop getting completely drunk and acting like an idiot. But I don't plan to give up alcohol, or forbid myself from getting a bit tipsy. As for sexual stuff, because I'm currently not fully convinced or inclined to take a vow of chastity till marriage, I'm taking the "I'll avoid it, I'm certainly not going out looking for it casually, but if the situation comes up I can't say how I'll respond, depending who it is and whetever." As for sexuality, the fact so many of my friends are gay/bi is tricky, but I'm going to take the attitude "let God deal with it, it's none of my business what he thinks of their love lives." I need to start a journey to enrich my soul and lighten my spirit, rather than sit around writing do and don't lists and dwelling on Hell. That's what Christianity is about, right? Getting closer to God, praying, letting the Spirit change you from within. I'm putting too much focus on yes-or-no questions which people argue about constantly. Hopefully over the next few months/years, I'll grow spiritually, which will give me far mroe satisfactory answers, and a lot more happiness, than this worrying is providing right now. Love x
 
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xElliex

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:) tithing isn't a biggie for me at the moment since I'm not even attending church (I'm doing a denomination-tour once I'm back in Uni), the biggies for me at the moment are sex, sexuality, and drink. I find it so difficult to be black-and-white with things. It's like, I plan to stop getting completely drunk and acting like an idiot. But I don't plan to give up alcohol, or forbid myself from getting a bit tipsy. As for sexual stuff, because I'm currently not fully convinced or inclined to take a vow of chastity till marriage, I'm taking the "I'll avoid it, I'm certainly not going out looking for it casually, but if the situation comes up I can't say how I'll respond, depending who it is and whetever." As for sexuality, the fact so many of my friends are gay/bi is tricky, but I'm going to take the attitude "let God deal with it, it's none of my business what he thinks of their love lives." I need to start a journey to enrich my soul and lighten my spirit, rather than sit around writing do and don't lists and dwelling on Hell. That's what Christianity is about, right? Getting closer to God, praying, letting the Spirit change you from within. I'm putting too much focus on yes-or-no questions which people argue about constantly. Hopefully over the next few months/years, I'll grow spiritually, which will give me far mroe satisfactory answers, and a lot more happiness, than this worrying is providing right now. Love x

You seem a little bit better Lostandfoundgirl. :) I am not brilliant at advising people regarding religion as I am only just coming back to my faith. A couple of months ago I started reading forums online, etc, and it was a very big mistake, so now I'm back to reading the Bible and praying and going to church. I still read and write on here, but I avoid boards like "fundamentalist", etc. :)

I think you really need to hang out with normal Christians. By "normal", I mean people who won't scare you with hellbound stories and such. Just so you can see how they live their lives. No one is perfect, not even the people who like seeing sin in others. :wave:
 
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lismore

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Hmmm, well I've just made a lengthy and perhaps too liberal thread about sex in its different forms in the philosophy and ethics section, so this might be goodbye from me, I'm probably going to get branded a heretic and banned. Sigh. Hope not.

I hope you don't get banned............

But dont worry, I've been labelled this and that so many times on the forums that it bounces off now.

^_^
 
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Lostandfoundgirl

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I've just been googling some stuff, came across this blog entry about pre-marital sex, and one person commented; "Sex is evil, sex is a sin, sin is forgiven, so let's begin!" I shouldn't laugh. I really shouldn't. *titters* I probably come across as such a nympho on these boards. Whoops. I'm actually not that sexually active; only had a few partners. But on this journey to faith, this is one of the most life-changing decisions I have to make, and it is tricky for me at the moment. It's a big deal to go from average 21st century views of sex with a sprinkling of self-respect and morality thrown in (self-description never sounded so odd) to deciding I'm never engaging in sexual activity again and need to seek out a Christian boyfriend/fiancee... when the sort of people I'm attracted to generally have very outgoing and flirtatious personalities, which I've never experienced among Christian guys my age. So it is a tricky thing for me, but I don't want to come across as sex-crazed, haha :/
 
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AzA

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Yah, it was a bit of a liberal thread, lol.

I won't prejudge the responses you're likely to get but truly this is not the most open environment. So even those who do believe more broadly than "touch not" are not likely to say so.

I'm beginning to think that learning how to love the body and physical desire, and learning also ways they tie into more subtle aspects of who we are and how we connect with each other -- this might be the journey of a lifetime.

And that's not designed to make you groan in pain, but to say "How beautifully exciting!"

It's possible that you could find a Christian group that's not afraid to jump whole-soul into that kind of conversation, or encourage you along the way. You'll see with time.

In the meantime, perhaps instead of seeking out people's conclusions about what you do or should do, perhaps you could keep monitoring how you do connect with people, how the connections flow between you and others, how alcohol changes those connections (if it does at all), how your emotions mix into all of this, what you feel in your spirit (if you do), and how your conscience speaks to you. Try to only do things you feel clear about. Don't overrule your conscience.

A friend once told me that I was created to experience bliss. It's not the sort of thing a fundamentalist hears very often, at least not with a lot of conditions and footnotes attached. Well, turns out that friend was right.

It's a beautiful path, this life. Along the way, you'll learn which flowers to pick and which to leave by the side of the road.
 
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childofGod31

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I have to get this stuff off my chest. I figure this forum is the best place to vent it, since my experience of you guys so far has been very positive and comforting.

Where do I start? I guess I just need to rant about what this so-called "journey to faith", or more realistically, "plummet into insanity", has done to me recently.

It's like... faith is supposed to be this glorious thing, but to me it just seems like this nexus of contradictions and fears. One minute, you're being told God loves you. The next minute, you're a sinner and going to Hell. One minute, I'm reading that our acts and deeds don't decide whether we go to heaven. The next, I'm scared to order a prawn sandwich in a restaurant because I've read this article about how Christians ought to obey Levitican law because it's God's word.

And worse than that, my life hasn't been enriched recently. It has been destroyed. I haven't started seeing God's splendour in everything and feeling inclined to love people. No, rather, I've come to loathe the world, and treat life with utter indifference. I try to relax, sit back, watch a DVD of my favourite sitcom; yet, suddenly, I realise that the jokes are sexual, that the characters have no religious conviction, that the lifestyle and humour being advocated is what makes modern society hellbound, and I have to switch it off, pace the room, slide into terror again.
Over and out.

Wow, I think you expressed yourself very well. Somehow, I can identify with confusion such as that. I agree with you on most points. It is extremely difficult out there with everybody telling you different things, things you can't verify, things you can't know whether they are true or not, whether you should believe them or not... things that make this life a scary place to be (waiting for a judgement day).

Or about trying to change yourself and be somebody else, and in the process shut down any happiness you might experience from enjoying the things you like...

Not knowing what the right thing to do is...which way to turn...

I really feel for you. And I really wish I could help...but I don't know how. Anything I say would probably be: just an additional thing somebody else have added to the mix of confusion.

I feel like I myself am in the eye of the storm. You know, in the eye, there is calmness and safety, while the storm is raging all around. I believe myself to be very lucky to end up in the "eye" somehow.

Or I also feel like I am walking on the ground with lots of holes in it and my eyes are covered. And my only hope is that I hear this voice guiding me: to step to the left or to the right in order to avoid the holes. But I have to listen intently...

Like you said, there is so much stuff out there....sooo much....and who knows what is true and what is not.

Very fortunately for me, I developed my communication with God and He is my only source of truth. I believe only whatever He personally tells me. Fortunately for me, I met Him and He started to teach me things. Things that were new to me, but somehow I trusted Him. And now it's like He is my only anchor, a pole that I am holding on to while the storm is raging.

I don't know how to tell you how to get there. I only know that that place of safety and security in God exists and that each person has a different path to it. In my personal journey, I started to seek Him ABOVE ALL THINGS, and that's when I found Him.

For me it was not about changing myself. It was more about finding the real Him. Not theology, rules, doctrines...but just simply the HEART of God, the mind of God, His thoughts, His feelings..... I really wanted to know the real God, the one who is NOW! Not in some books some time ago but NOW, with me...in present...

When I found Him and He started to communicate with me, it was all worth it. He taught me lots of stuff. Most of it was new to me. It was different from what people taught me. He is a pleasure to know.

Again, the journey to this treasure of finding this communication is not an easy one. But it's possible. A DESIRE plays a big role in finding Him.

And most of all, maybe it will help you, no matter what you decide or do, just always know that He is right there with you invisibly. He knows ALL your thoughts and he FEELS your feelings. He is NOT the one who is going to judge you for something, because He feels like you feel. He feels your pain, your inability to overcome certain things. He would judge you even less than you would judge yourself because He understands you more than you do. He knows why you do what you do. He feels sorry for you. He knows how hard it is. All He wants to do is help. Help you to feel good, feel free and feel connected to Him.

I learned that God's ideas of what is good and what is bad are not the same as people's in lots of cases. Take sex for example. Some teach that it's something to be ashamed of. But they forget that God likes it: He was the one who created it, along with pleasure. So it wasn't just for pro-creation. And if somebody tells me: no, how could you say such a thing.... Then I would say: well, did you talk to God about it? If not, how could you possibly know? By somebody else's words, ideas, opinions? You have to get your information from the source. The Bible is also the words of other people. It's best to get your information from the source. Because who knows how many words from the Bible were - man's ideas? Believing that all are from God, doesn't necessarily make it so. Believing doesn't make anything true. Finding out from the source - IS THE ONLY WAY TO KNOW THE TRUTH.

I love laughing and humor. So I was extremely pleased to find out that God has a sense of humor and He laughs...and He likes to have fun... I am sure this is against the doctrines, but it's according to God, and that's all that matters to me.
 
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Avonia

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Lostandfoundgirl, I checked out your post in the ethics forum.

The most disheartening sexual relationships I see are more often in marriage - not outside of it. For many, sex has become a low-level act based on need instead of a creative expression. One of the most unfortunate situations is the wife obliging the husband, but stepping almost completely out of her own sexuality. This sometimes goes on for decades. These couples are easy to spot. It feels like they have a "working partnership," not a marriage. Their hearts are closed to each other.

Here are are few suggestions that may or may not be helpful.

1. Don't feel guilty about having sex. Guilt is a destructive and dark emotion. If you are doing something that makes you feel guilty, don't do it. But continue asking all the questions you are asking. What matters is whether you feel aligned - not what other people think.

2. You are a sexual creature designed to have sexual experiences. Unlike the narrow definition most people use, this happens every day, throughout the day, with an array of people in an array of situations. This is because sexual potential (creative potential) is present anytime you are around the opposite polarity. The act of sex is the tiniest part of this experience. When people repress these energies, they are essentially grabbing on to them, instead of simply letting the energies move through them.

3. Many of us from the Christian tradition are rather unsophisticated when it comes to sexuality - we are still waiting for our "first grade teacher" to open the first lesson. Because of this, I've found that it's mostly up to us to learn about sexuality. I've done this by looking broadly. There are lots of interesting communities with lots to offer.

4. I personally find that some of the most amazing sexual experiences have nothing to do with physical acts. This level of sexual experience requires the awareness to receive it. Hard to explain, but amazing to experience.

5. Be patient. If you continue to ask these questions in a neutral way, you will gain insight.

6. Understand and respect that many Christians are afraid to ask the questions. That's OK.
 
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Lostandfoundgirl

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I'm reading the book recommended to me on that thread by someone, and it's very good so for (Google books, brilliant invention). I feel like sexual standards of total abstinence are something so big and scary to me that right now they're crushing my desire for spiritual growth and faith-seeking. It's not only about sex; it's also about drinking, about life in general, about my sense of humour, my essence, my personality, my career... it's all tied in, you know? And at the moment, I feel like I'm being caged in and crushed, not set free. I may have made a mistake joining a forum frequented largely by Conservative Christians, rather than what I see as real-world Christians (that sounds more offensive than I mean it to; I mean the average young person who goes to Church, believes in Christ, treats people well, questions issues like homosexuality and abortion, but generally lives a carefree, 21st century life.) Many of my friends are like that; my best friend is Anglican, prays regularly, goes to church, yet also has a very satisfying sex life, enjoys secular music, drinks, parties and is very much a free spirit whilst also having teh moral centre of "I shouldn't gossip like this" or "it's not my place to judge" or "I feel absolutely terrible that I hurt someone, and want to show that I love them and make things better." I see her as a Christian. She has faith in God to help her. But she doesn't live governed by a big finger pointing at her and saying "BAD human, you're going to Hell." I wish I could adopt that Christianity, even only temporarily. She has FAITH. Not religion, but FAITH in Jesus, in prayer, and in God's glory and forgiveness. Even if I try to keep up with that for a while, instead of trying to jump in the deep end, change my entire life to something very alien to me, and ending up completely devastated, angry and inclined to turn FROM, instead of TO, religion. I found this other site called Ship of Fools, which I looked at briefly last night after being directed to it through a Google search. From what I gathered, it's a Christian forum, but where people aren't afraid to be critical or satirical about aspects of religion, or to talk openly and liberally about stuff. Maybe I got the wrong impression, I don't know, but I'm going to look into it again later, because it really made me smile. Fact is, every human being is different, that's how we were made. Some are introverted, some extroverted; some loud and comical, others sombre and serious. Why were we all made with personalities, if our faith has to all be the same? Why can't we worship God in different ways, as long as we hold true to the moral core of the Bible, and faith that Christ died for us? I'm so confused. And scared I'm going to die overnight when I'm in this frame of mind and not have enough time in my life to grow into full Christian faith. Heh :/
 
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[Snip]

I'm so confused. And scared I'm going to die overnight when I'm in this frame of mind and not have enough time in my life to grow into full Christian faith. Heh :/

Why?

I suppose it could happen. But such things are comparatively rare. You're young and presumably healthy. I don't understand why this fear.
 
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[Snip]

...my best friend is Anglican, prays regularly, goes to church, yet also has a very satisfying sex life, enjoys secular music, drinks, parties and is very much a free spirit whilst also having teh moral centre of "I shouldn't gossip like this" or "it's not my place to judge" or "I feel absolutely terrible that I hurt someone, and want to show that I love them and make things better." I see her as a Christian. She has faith in God to help her. But she doesn't live governed by a big finger pointing at her and saying "BAD human, you're going to Hell." I wish I could adopt that Christianity, even only temporarily. She has FAITH. Not religion, but FAITH in Jesus, in prayer, and in God's glory and forgiveness.

Then hold on to her. She's a keeper. And if perchance you haven't yet, schedule some time for a long heart-to-heart talk. And then tell her all about your struggles with faith, with sex, with whatever. And ask her to help you as best as she can.
 
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Lostandfoundgirl

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Why?

I suppose it could happen. But such things are comparatively rare. You're young and presumably healthy. I don't understand why this fear.

Years of bulimia, which is still uncured, have left me with an irregular heartbeat which terrifies me. I'm also a hypochondriac in general, always convinced I have some terminal illness without realising. I don't know, I'm just worried I guess. Anything can happen.
 
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