Jerusalm Belongs To The Jews!

[MaryS]

Nitpick, in the Six Day War, Israel staged a pre-emptive attack against Egypt and Syria, after those two countries were making preperations to attack. Now, it appears as though Egypt and Syria were only bluffing, trying to win some concessions but, in my opinion, if you're going to play that sort of game, you deserve the consequences if it blows up in your face (for example, a pre-emptive attack by your opponent).

There are plenty of books and websites with info about the Six Day War, but even the wikipedia entry describes the war as justified:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Israel
(excerpt:
In 1957, at the UN, 17 maritime powers declared that Israel had a right to transit the Strait of Tiran. Moreover, the Egyptian blockade prior to the 1956 Suez War violated the Convention on the Territorial Sea and Contiguous Zone, which was adopted by the UN Conference on the Law of the Sea on April 27, 1958.

On May 23, 1967, Egypt again cut off the Straits of Tiran (Israel's main shipping route to Asia and other major places of trade) to Israeli shipping, and also blockaded the port of Eilat.

Egypt ordered United Nations peacekeeping forces to leave the Sinai, and in their place, Egyptian tanks and troops were concentrated on the border with Israel. In accordance with international law (United Nations Conference on the Law of the Sea, (Geneva: UN Publications 1958, pp. 132-134.), Israel considered the blockade of its port a casus belli, and launched an attack on Egypt, especially the Egyptian Air Force.
Hostilities came to include Jordan (after Jordan reluctantly chose to dismiss Israeli appeals for neutrality and undertook shelling of Tel Aviv in adherence to its defense treaty with Egypt), Syria, and the Iraqi Air Force. This was the Six-Day War (June 5 - June 10, 1967), during which Israel captured East Jerusalem, the West Bank of the Kingdom of Jordan, the Gaza Strip, the Golan Heights, and the Sinai Peninsula. In 1973, Egypt and Syria launched a surprise joint attack in the Sinai and Golan Heights, in what became known as the Yom Kippur War.

 

[MaryS]

Reconciliation is what is needed, not the further emphasis of differences between Jews and Muslims. We've heard enough of that for decades.
If, the Palestinians and the Israeli's can show the world how well they can get on with each other, then the world will take notice and the impetus for global Islamic terrorism would be drastically reduced.

That sounds good, but as long as Palestinian leaders remain supportive of groups like Hamas, I just don't see any lasting peace.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamas
The Hamas Covenant, written in 1988, states that the organization's goal is to "raise the banner of God over every inch of Palestine," i.e. to eliminate the State of Israel (and any secular Palestinian state which may be established), and to replace it with an Islamic republic.

Hamas rejects "so-called peaceful solutions and international conferences" as
incapable of realizing justice or restoring rights to the oppressed, believing "there is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad."

The Hamas Covenant cites the long-discredited anti-Semitic fraud, The Protocols of the Elders of Zion, describing it as "the embodiment of the Zionist plan to usurp Palestine". Hamas dismisses the Freemasons, Lions Club, and the Rotarians as organizations promoting "the interest of Zionism."

Some Hamas members have alleged that Jewish people were responsible for the French Revolution, "Western colonialism," and both World Wars.

Palestinian leaders like Arafat and his followers have been a long problem

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/11/12/60minutes/main655482.shtml
(excerpt:
Wallace: You say you want peace, correct, Mr. President?

Arafat: Yes

Wallace: But you incite Palestinians, especially young Palestinians, to violence. Just this past week, you said publicly, "Millions of holy warriors are on their way to Jerusalem. Jihad, jihad, jihad, jihad, holy war, holy war, holy war." What does that mean?

Arafat: I am repeating some of holy Muslim words, not mine.

Wallace: On your state-controlled television, a cleric – here's what he said.
"Whoever can fight them with his weapons should go out to battle. Nothing will deter the Jews, except the color of their filthy people's blood. Nothing will deter them, except for us voluntarily detonating ourselves in their midst."

 

[Pentecostal Boy]

I Hate The Un They R A Piece O trash!

 

[DailyBlessings]

I Hate The Un They R A Piece O trash!

Yes, working for peace is a terrible thing-

Cry havoc and let slip the dogs of war!

 

[the_cheat]

I Hate The Un They R A Piece O trash!

A compelling argument.

 

[Scribbler]

I think Israel is right to give up its settlements in Gaza and the West Bank. They were taken during the Arab ISraeli War and its high time they gave it up. Its obviously a tremendous burden on the Israeli people who have been living there now for years to just give up their home and go but its a price they're being forced to pay due to bad government and bad history. However, I don't think ordinary Palestinians are leaping up and down in joy to see their Israeli brothers and sisters being evicted.
The terrorists, who make living in the Middle East a hellish prospect are still lurking in the background, ready to pounce at any given opportunity, whether or not Israel gives in to compromise.

It seems the only thing Israel gained from the pullouts was...expectations of more pullouts. I'm sure once they give up Jerusalem, there'll be peace. So saith the Sudis, any road.

 

[SH89]

An interesting thing is that only the NIV bibles mentions a temple in this verse.
Here's Daniel 9:27 in a couple Bibles
The KJv.
27And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

NASB
27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."

Well, you know where BibleGateway.com is, you can see for yourself only the NIV versions mention a temple. If you have e-sword, you can look up the verse and see there is no word like "temple" in the verse.

Here's Daniel 9:25-27 in the NASB
Daniel 9:25-27
25"So you are to know and discern that from the issuing of a (A)decree to restore and rebuild Jerusalem until (B)Messiah the (C)Prince there will be seven weeks and sixty-two weeks; it will be built again, with plaza and moat, even in times of distress.

26"Then after the sixty-two weeks the Messiah will be (D)cut off and have nothing, and the people of the prince who is to come will (E)destroy the city and the sanctuary And its end will come with a (F)flood; even to the end there will be war; desolations are determined.

27"And he will make a firm covenant with the many for one week, but in the middle of the week he will put a stop to sacrifice and grain offering; and on the wing of (G)abominations will come one who makes desolate, even until a (H)complete destruction, one that is decreed, is poured out on the one who makes desolate."

The verse is clearly talking about the city of Jersalem, not a temple, rebuilt or otherwise. And it fits with the events of the early 7th century.

In 614 the Persians invaded palestine and on May 5 614 your beloved Jews betrayed Jersalem to the Persians and they massacred many Christians and sacked the city.

The Byzantine Emperor Haraclius later recatpured the city and rebuilt it, and it was newly rebuilt when the Muslmis took it in 638, and they later built the Dome of the Rock on the site of the Temple the "abomination of desolation" that was to be set up.

Daniel 11:31
"Forces from him will arise, (A)desecrate the sanctuary fortress, and do away with the regular sacrifice And they will set up the (B)abomination of desolation.

Can you pm me? I disagree, but i want to explain why through a private message. (I dont want to go off the topic of this thread).

 

[CHARLES H]

there will not be peace in isreal till JESUS returns.

 

[kurabrhm]

there will not be peace in isreal till JESUS returns.

The second coming....



But to be honest, if we dash the Mid Eastern people's and the world's expectations of "the second coming", then perhaps the non stop violence will grind to a halt.

Sorry if I dissapointed any strong believers in Christianity. I'm simply putting forward an argument.

 

[Victory of the Cross]

I Hate The Un They R A Piece O trash!

The UN are weak and pathetic, everything they do is motivated by fear.

 

[kurabrhm]

By the way, there is not a shread of evidence that links the Jews with the French revolution, Western Colonialism or the two world wars. Western Colonialism was started initially by the Spaniards and the Portugese. Who knows, maybe the Spaniards were inspired by the all conquering Jihadists who reached the shores of Spain once. The Spaniards in turn inspired the Brits and the French, the two of them together have managed to create "hot spots" in the world were the Americans, in the post war era, have come to grab the spoils like vultures picking on dead carcass.

 

[Artos]

Jerusalem belongs to God!
So let Jews, Muslims and Christians live together there.

 

[OhhJim]

But to be honest, if we dash the Mid Eastern people's and the world's expectations of "the second coming", then perhaps the non stop violence will grind to a halt.

Oh, I dunno. Seems there was plenty of violence in the world before the first coming.

Sorry if I dissapointed any strong believers in Christianity. I'm simply putting forward an argument.

Not disappointed. Even if the argument were true, the possibility of it happening is pretty slim. You might as well argue that if we could get rid of Islam, the world would be a more peaceful place.

 

[kurabrhm]

Oh, I dunno. Seems there was plenty of violence in the world before the first coming.



Not disappointed. Even if the argument were true, the possibility of it happening is pretty slim. You might as well argue that if we could get rid of Islam, the world would be a more peaceful place.

When you talk about negatively about Islam, as seen in the last quote, what you're basically saying is that if you get rid of the competition, then the world would be a safer place.

Yeah, like that makes sense!

 

[kurabrhm]

To compete, in whatever form, is a fact of life. Its been in existence ever since day 1.
Religion is no exception to the rule when it comes to competition.
People may delude themselves into thinking that this is not the case but its actually only a small minority of religious leaders, especially in the really small religions like Buddhism, who have no interest in competing. Christianity, Islam or Judaism, by contrast, all have political motivations to compete as fiercely as possible. Hinduism also does this, albeit only in India, but before 1947, it was the entire subcontinent.

 

[OhhJim]

When you talk about negatively about Islam, as seen in the last quote, what you're basically saying is that if you get rid of the competition, then the world would be a safer place.

Yeah, like that makes sense!

I think we agree. The assertion I addressed can only be made by history-ignorant Christians, who don't know that there was plenty of Christian on Christian (Thirty Years War, Inquisition) violence, Pagan on Christian (Rome, pre-375 AD) Christian on Pagan (America 1492-1950) and Pagan on Pagan (Zulu wars, etc.) violence, all of which had nothing to do with Islam.

 

[Kripost]

To compete, in whatever form, is a fact of life. Its been in existence ever since day 1.
Religion is no exception to the rule when it comes to competition.
People may delude themselves into thinking that this is not the case but its actually only a small minority of religious leaders, especially in the really small religions like Buddhism, who have no interest in competing. Christianity, Islam or Judaism, by contrast, all have political motivations to compete as fiercely as possible. Hinduism also does this, albeit only in India, but before 1947, it was the entire subcontinent.

I would disagree with the part about Buddhism. It is hardly a small religion, and certain groups did have political influence, such as the warrior monks of Mt Hiei in the Sengoku era.

 

[kurabrhm]

I would disagree with the part about Buddhism. It is hardly a small religion, and certain groups did have political influence, such as the warrior monks of Mt Hiei in the Sengoku era.

Buddhism may have been more political and more active in the past, during feudal times, for instance.

But I'm talking about the contemporary age. Now, Buddhism is less vocal. Indeed we've seen in modern times how the Chinese have brutally suppressed the Buddhist monks in Tibet. The Dalai Lama is now a political refugee in India because of China's unjust occupation of Tibet. Yes, the Lama does like to talk a lot but there's a difference between gentle talk such as the Lama, in contrast to the dangerous talk espoused by the Christian Right in America and Bin Laden.
The Lama, it seems, understands the need for compassion and humanity no matter how much the individual or the group is suffering from persecution. By contrast, the Christian Right, whose country was arguably "punished" on 9/11 and Bin Laden who took up arms on the day of the Soviet invasion of South Asia, do not show any compassion. Hence the sheer number of Iraqi and Afghan civilians dead due to the AMerican military invasion and the sheer number of American and other civilians around the globe dead due to Islamic terrorism.

 

[mishachanito]

SH89 sounds very correct man I totally with him in this matter

 

[mishachanito]

but many have disagreed to the fact that Revelation 11 will be a fulfiilment in the Holy city