It’s Paul For Me

[oikonomia]

Yep, and my wife is your wife as well

You're clever.
But I'd really like to see a little more wisdom from you though.

It is not your little analogy which is at stake but the truth of Scripture.

The gospel of grace is also the gospel of the kingdom.
Now if you don't think the kingdom is part of the good news show us why not.

The Thessalonian church was composed of many non-Israelites.
Yet Paul told the, to conduct themselves in a manner worthy of the kingdom of God to which they were called.

So that you might walk in a manner worthy of God, who calls you into His own kingdom and glory. (1 Thess. 2:12)

They were not only called to the kingdom and glory of God. But the Apostle Paul tells them they were suffering for that kingdom's sake.

that you may be accounted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which also you suffer; (2 Thess. 1:5b)

The Christians in the church in Colossi contained many Gentile believers.
By being redeemed in Christ they were transferred into the kingdom of the Son of God's love.
That of course is the kingdom of God.

Who delivered us out of the authority of darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of the Son of His love,
In whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins; (Col. 1;13,14)

Notice it is in the passed tense not the future tense.
They have been transferred into this kingdom. All then who have been saved in Christ should stand upon the truth.
"Thankyou Lord Jesus. We have been transeferred out of darkness and into your kingdom."

 

[Guojing]

You're clever.
But I'd really like to see a little more wisdom from you though.

It is not your little analogy which is at stake but the truth of Scripture.

The gospel of grace is also the gospel of the kingdom.
Now if you don't think the kingdom is part of the good news show us why not.

The Thessalonian church was composed of many non-Israelites.
Yet Paul told the, to conduct themselves in a manner worthy of the kingdom of God to which they were called.

So that you might walk in a manner worthy of God, who calls you into His own kingdom and glory. (1 Thess. 2:12)

They were not only called to the kingdom and glory of God. But the Apostle Paul tells them they were suffering for that kingdom's sake.

that you may be accounted worthy of the kingdom of God, for which also you suffer; (2 Thess. 1:5b)

The Christians in the church in Colossi contained many Gentile believers.
By being redeemed in Christ they were transferred into the kingdom of the Son of God's love.
That of course is the kingdom of God.

Who delivered us out of the authority of darkness and transferred us into the kingdom of the Son of His love,
In whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins; (Col. 1;13,14)

Notice it is in the passed tense not the future tense.
They have been transferred into this kingdom. All then who have been saved in Christ should stand upon the truth.
"Thankyou Lord Jesus. We have been transeferred out of darkness and into your kingdom."

As I already said to you, when you see the phrase kingdom of God in Paul's epistles to the Body of Christ, you are in error when you think its equivalent to the kingdom of God in the gospel of the kingdom to the nation of Israel, example in Mark 1:15

If you reject this, I am fine, let's move on.

 

[oikonomia]

As I already said to you, when you see the phrase kingdom of God in Paul's epistles to the Body of Christ, you are in error when you think its equivalent to the kingdom of God in the gospel of the kingdom to the nation of Israel, example in Mark 1:15

If you reject this, I am fine, let's move on.

I think we can work through some of this if we do not jump to conclusions too prematurely.
Also in one post it is not easy to cover the points needed for a thorough understanding of the issue.

My response would be nuanced. It has to be because you are right that after the resurrection the eleven disciples
ask if it was at this time now He would restore the kingdom to Israel.

So the ones who came together asked Him, saying, Lord, are You at this time restoring the kingdom to Israel? (Acts 1:6)

So the initiation of the church age was not the time to restore the kingdom of God to Israel. If this is what you imply, I agree.
But a few verses before it says Jesus spoke with them after His resurrection concerning the kingdom.

. . . He presented Himself alive after His suffering by many irrefutable proofs, appearing to them through a period of forty days and speaking the things concerning the kingdom of God. (Acts 1:3)

Do you believe Christ spent those post resurrection forty days talking only about Israel, possession of the land of Canaan, restoral of
the throne of David, etc. etc ? I do not believe He spent all that time discussing the Messianic kingdom of the nation Israel. I grant that He spent some time on it. But His teaching of the kingdom of God mostly regarded the spread of the gospel FOR the establishing of the church.

Isn't that what Acts says?

. . . are You at this time restoring the kingdom to Israel?
But He said to them, It is not for you to know times or seasons which the Father has set by His own authority.
But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria and unto the uttermost part of the earth. (Acts 1:6b-8)

I agree that complete equivalency between the restoration of the kingdom of God to national Israel
and the building of the church is not exact.

But this should explain this kingdom of God was not put on hold, suspended, or given up.
He said He would take the kingdom from Israel and give it to a nation to produce kingdom fruit.

Jesus said to them, Have you never read in the Scriptures, “The stone which the builders rejected, this has become the head of the corner. This was from the Lord, and it is marvelous in our eyes”?

Therefore I say to you that the kingdom of God shall be taken from you and shall be given to a nation producing its fruit.

And he who falls on this stone shall be broken to pieces; but on whomever it falls, it shall crush him to powder and scatter him like chaff. (Matt. 21:42-44)

Keep reading. Don't zone out yet.
This other nation to whom the kingdom of God was given is not Germany, England, America, China, or any other nation.
It is the church which is ordained to produce these fruits God must have. Whether the church has always succeeded in this is another
discussion, probably.

But the kingdom was taken from Israel as her leaders rejected the cornerstone, killing Him, and indirectly under God's sovereignty
causing the kingdom to be opened to those who come into the church. And the church is His Body.

And He subjected all things under His feet and gave Him to be Head over all things to the church,
Which is His Body, the fullness of the One who fills all in all. (Eph. 1:22,23)

Your comments now?

PS

And saying, The time is fulfilled and the kingdom of God has drawn near. Repent and believe in the gospel. (Mark 1:15)

This reality which had not yet come but had "drawn near" you surely believe came when the Lord gave to Peter the
keys of the kingdom to open its door to all who believe in Christ. Surely, you have no problem with that?

And I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.

I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatever you bind on the earth shall have been bound in the heavens, and whatever you loose on the earth shall have been loosed in the heavens. (Matt. 16:18,19)

 

[Clare73]

That equallly applies to Romans 8:30 and 1 Corinthians 6:11

It equally applies to all, understood in the light of and in agreement with the whole NT.

 

[Guojing]

But this should explain this kingdom of God was not put on hold, suspended, or given up.
He said He would take the kingdom from Israel and give it to a nation to produce kingdom fruit.

This other nation to whom the kingdom of God was given is not Germany, England, America, China, or any other nation.
It is the church which is ordained to produce these fruits God must have. Whether the church has always succeeded in this is another
discussion, probably.

Your comments now?

As I already said to you, when the singular nation is used in scripture, it always refers to the nation of Israel.

The Body of Christ, which is the church today, is never referred to as "a nation".

If you disagree, please present scripture that contradicts my above 2 points.

 

[oikonomia]

As I already said to you, when the singular nation is used in scripture, it always refers to the nation of Israel.

The Body of Christ, which is the church today, is never referred to as "a nation".

If you disagree, please present scripture that contradicts my above 2 points.

This principle will not work completely. The church is "a holy nation" [ ἔθνος ἅγιον] according to the Apostle Peter.

But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people acquired for a possession, so that you may tell out the virtues of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; (1 Peter 2:9) (comp. Deut. 7:6; 10:15; 14:2)

Who is Peter speaking to? He is speaking mainly Jewish Christians who have been formed into the church.
The salutation of the letter is:

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the sojourners of the dispersion of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
Chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father in the sanctification of the Spirit unto the obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: . . . (1 Pet. 1:1)

If Peter simply meant Israelites in the dispersion he could have stopped simply at to the sojourners of the dispersion of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

But out FROM those Israelites in the dispersion as sojourners he qualifies his audience as the ones in the church by
Chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father in the sanctification of the Spirit unto the obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ:

In other words these ones called out to be the living building of God are the recipients of the proclamation that they are a holy nation
called . . . out of darkness into Christ as the marvelous light.

The Israelites who remained in darkness are not under the process of sanctification of the Spirit nor believing or receiving redemption
through "the sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ" whom they have rejected.

Instead they have followed their leaders to crucify Him with shouts and clamor.
And they have been disobedient, to which also they were appointed.

Coming to Him, a living stone, rejected by men but with God chosen and precious,
Israel as a nation at this time did NOT come to Him.

You yourselves also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house into a holy priesthood to offer up spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ.
Israel rejecting the cornerstone is not being built up as a spiritual house. But the church is that holy nation being built up into "a habitation of God is spirit" (Eph. 2:22)

For it is contained in Scripture: “Behold, I lay in Zion a cornerstone, chosen and precious; and he who believes on Him shall by no means be put to shame.”

To you therefore who believe is the preciousness; but to the unbelieving, “The stone which the builders rejected, this has become the head of the corner,” (vs. 4-7)

The church is [ ἔθνος ἅγιον] "a holy nation".

 

[Guojing]

This principle will not work completely. The church is "a holy nation" [ ἔθνος ἅγιον] according to the Apostle Peter.

But you are a chosen race, a royal priesthood, a holy nation, a people acquired for a possession, so that you may tell out the virtues of Him who has called you out of darkness into His marvelous light; (1 Peter 2:9) (comp. Deut. 7:6; 10:15; 14:2)

Who is Peter speaking to? He is speaking mainly Jewish Christians who have been formed into the church.
The salutation of the letter is:

Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, to the sojourners of the dispersion of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,
Chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father in the sanctification of the Spirit unto the obedience and sprinkling of the blood of Jesus Christ: . . . (1 Pet. 1:1)

If Peter simply meant Israelites in the dispersion he could have stopped simply at to the sojourners of the dispersion of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

If you meant the church as the "Body of Christ", your interpretation cannot be correct, based on the agreement set with Paul at Galatians 2:7-9.

Peter is to restrict himself only to the circumcised little flock, which is, as you have earlier quoted from Jesus before the cross Matthew 21:43, a nation that the kingdom was given to.

Once you can see this, Peter quoting that Exodus passage to them in 1 Peter 2:9 would make perfect sense. They are the true Israel of God (Romans 9:6, Galatians 6:16).

If God had not interrupted the prophetic program, this little flock, as true Israel, would have to undergo the Tribulation, which is the fiery trial he was describing in 1 Peter 1:6-9

 

[oikonomia]

If you meant the church as the "Body of Christ", your interpretation cannot be correct, based on the agreement set with Paul at Galatians 2:7-9.

The church which is His Body -

. . . gave Him to be Head over all things to the church,
Which is His Body, the fullness of the One who fills all in all. (Eph. 1:22b,23)

Peter is to restrict himself only to the circumcised little flock, which is, as you have earlier quoted from Jesus before the cross Matthew 21:43, a nation that the kingdom was given to.

Peter is speaking about the same builded up spiritual house which Paul calls the built up habitation [dwelling place] of God in spirit.

Jesus - I will build My church, (Matt. 16:18)

Peter - You yourselves also, as living stones, are being built up as a spiritual house (1 Pet. 2:5)

Paul - you also are being built together into a dwelling place of God in spirit. (Eph. 2:22)

Once you can see this, Peter quoting that Exodus passage to them in 1 Peter 2:9 would make perfect sense. They are the true Israel of God (Romans 9:6, Galatians 6:16).

If God had not interrupted the prophetic program, this little flock, as true Israel, would have to undergo the Tribulation, which is the fiery trial he was describing in 1 Peter 1:6-9

The interruption is temporary but is real. He said because Israel rejected the cornerstone of God's building He would take
the kingdom from them and give it to this holy nation. The holy nation consists of circumcised and uncircumcized, Jews and Greeks
built up into "one new man" and "the new man" blending out the distinctions as Christ is all and within all in the church.

Abolishing in His flesh the law of the commandments in ordinances, that He might create the two in Himself into one new man, so making peace, And might reconcile both in one Body to God through the cross, having slain the enmity by it. (Eph. 2:15,16)

And have put on the new man, which is being renewed unto full knowledge according to the image of Him who created him,
Where there cannot be Greek and Jew, circumcision and uncircumcision, barbarian,
Scythian, slave, free man, but Christ is all and in all. (Col. 3:10,11)

For as many of you as were baptized into Christ have put on Christ.
There cannot be Jew nor Greek, there cannot be slave nor free man,
there cannot be male and female; for you are all one in Christ Jesus. (Gal. 3:27-29)

Going back to First & Second Peter, he refers to the elders. He doesn't mean the elders of Israel but the elders
in the Christian churches. He was also an elder in the church in Jerusalem.

Therefore the elders among you I exhort, who am a fellow elder (1 Pet. 1:5a)
( Compare Acts 11:30; 14:23; 15:2; 20:17; 1 Tim. 5:17,19; Titus1:5; James 5:14)

 

[Guojing]

The church which is His Body -

. . . gave Him to be Head over all things to the church,
Which is His Body, the fullness of the One who fills all in all. (Eph. 1:22b,23)

You are quoting Paul there, so that is irrelevant, to my point.

As I have already said to you, not all churches you read in scripture is the Body of Christ.

Just because the BOC is the church for today, it does not allow you to conclude that every time you see church in scripture, it must therefore refer to the BOC.

 

[Clare73]

If you meant the church as the "Body of Christ", your interpretation cannot be correct, based on the agreement set with Paul at Galatians 2:7-9.

The NT is written to Christians. Gal 2:7-9 does not change that.

Peter is to restrict himself only to the circumcised little flock, which is, as you have earlier quoted from Jesus before the cross Matthew 21:43, a nation that the kingdom was given to.

The kingdom was taken away from the Jews (Mt 21:43) and given to the Gentiles.
Not only will outsiders be brought into the kingdom (Mt 8:11), but the sons will be put out in order to do so (Mt 8:12, Ro 11:11-14)

Once you can see this, Peter quoting that Exodus passage to them in 1 Peter 2:9 would make perfect sense. They are the true Israel of God (Romans 9:6, Galatians 6:16).

If God had not interrupted the prophetic program, this little flock, as true Israel, would have to undergo the Tribulation, which is the fiery trial he was describing in 1 Peter 1:6-9.

 

[oikonomia]

You are quoting Paul there, so that is irrelevant, to my point.

As I have already said to you, not all churches you read in scripture is the Body of Christ.

Just because the BOC is the church for today, it does not allow you to conclude that every time you see church in scripture, it must therefore refer to the BOC.

So the church in Ephsesus was not the Body of Christ?
Did Paul lie to them when he explained that the church there including "we" are members of the Body of Christ?

Because we are members of His Body. (Eph. 5:30)

Which New Testament church has nothing to do with the Body of Christ in this representative list?
The church in Corinth, Rome, Thessalonica, Antioch, Ephesus, Colossi, the churches in Galatia, the church in Jerusalem, or Phillipi,
or Ephesus, or Sardis, or Philadelphia or Laocdicea or other church designated in the New Testment.

Tell us which one or ones were not the Body of Christ.

 

[Guojing]

So the church in Ephsesus was not the Body of Christ?
Did Paul lie to them when he explained that the church there including "we" are members of the Body of Christ?

Because we are members of His Body. (Eph. 5:30)

Which New Testament church has nothing to do with the Body of Christ in this representative list?
The church in Corinth, Rome, Thessalonica, Antioch, Ephesus, Colossi, the churches in Galatia, the church in Jerusalem, or Phillipi,
or Ephesus, or Sardis, or Philadelphia or Laocdicea or other church designated in the New Testment.

Tell us which one or ones were not the Body of Christ.

Do you understand why I inserted the word "today"?

Just because the BOC is the church for today, it does not allow you to conclude that every time you see church in scripture, it must therefore refer to the BOC.

 

[oikonomia]

Do you understand why I inserted the word "today"?

I can't say that I follow your point.
The church universal read of in the New Testamnt is the Body of Christ unto eternity - forever - from now on - with no possible termination.
Do you understand this?

Now the churches [plural] that concern my discussion are also part of the Body of Christ for eternity.
The church in Jerusalem, the church in Antioch, the church in Philippi, the church in Thessalonica, the seven churches in Asia,
the churches of Judea, the churches of Galatia - all are part of the Body of Christ unto eternity.

The church is Dallas, the church in London, the church in Jerusalem, the church in Lagos, the church in Sidney, etc, of TODAY are also
part of the Body of Christ today and unto eternity. (The Lord is recovering today the local ground of the churches).

If you want to make a point that the ekklesia (church) which gathered as a riotous mob to shout against the apostle "Great is Artimis of the Ephesians" I have no interest in that assembly OR claim it is the Body of Christ. I think that should be obvious to the readers.

Just because the BOC is the church for today, it does not allow you to conclude that every time you see church in scripture, it must therefore refer to the BOC.

As I said your point is not clear to me.
However the church and the churches of which I am discussing in this thread are the Body of Christ.
All human beings within whom Christ has dispensed His divine life are members of the Body of Christ for eternity.
All human beings into whom Christ has come as the life giving Spirit which He became (1 Cor. 15:45) are constituents in His Body.

What makes a human being a member of the Body of Christ is the divine life of Christ imparted into him or her.
Yet if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not of Him. (Rom. 8:9c)

Now let me ask of you a question. Answer if you can please.
When the twelve Jewish apostles of Christ are reigning over the tribes of Israel in the restoration do you believe they will still be members of the Body of Christ? If not why would they no longer be of the Body of Christ?

And Jesus said to them, Truly I say to you that you who have followed Me, in the restoration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you also shall sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Matt. 19:28)

 

[Clare73]

Do you understand why I inserted the word "today"?

Just because the BOC is the church for today, it does not allow you to conclude that every time you see church in scripture, it must therefore refer to the BOC.

Church (ekklesia) = "called-out assembly/congregation," and refers to both OT saints (Ac 7:38, Heb 2:12) and NT saints (Mt 16:18, 18:17, Eph 5:13, Col 1:18, Heb 12:23).

All those who believed in the promise (Ge 15:5, Seed, Jesus Christ, Gal 3:16) were saints in the OT church (Ac 7:38, Heb 2:12), the one body of Christ of both the OT and the NT saints (Ro 11:16-23).

 

[Guojing]

I can't say that I follow your point.
The church universal read of in the New Testamnt is the Body of Christ unto eternity - forever - from now on - with no possible termination.
Do you understand this?

Now the churches [plural] that concern my discussion are also part of the Body of Christ for eternity.
The church in Jerusalem, the church in Antioch, the church in Philippi, the church in Thessalonica, the seven churches in Asia,
the churches of Judea, the churches of Galatia - all are part of the Body of Christ unto eternity.

The church is Dallas, the church in London, the church in Jerusalem, the church in Lagos, the church in Sidney, etc, of TODAY are also
part of the Body of Christ today and unto eternity. (The Lord is recovering today the local ground of the churches).

If you want to make a point that the ekklesia (church) which gathered as a riotous mob to shout against the apostle "Great is Artimis of the Ephesians" I have no interest in that assembly OR claim it is the Body of Christ. I think that should be obvious to the readers.


As I said your point is not clear to me.
However the church and the churches of which I am discussing in this thread are the Body of Christ.
All human beings within whom Christ has dispensed His divine life are members of the Body of Christ for eternity.
All human beings into whom Christ has come as the life giving Spirit which He became (1 Cor. 15:45) are constituents in His Body.

What makes a human being a member of the Body of Christ is the divine life of Christ imparted into him or her.
Yet if anyone does not have the Spirit of Christ, he is not of Him. (Rom. 8:9c)

Now let me ask of you a question. Answer if you can please.
When the twelve Jewish apostles of Christ are reigning over the tribes of Israel in the restoration do you believe they will still be members of the Body of Christ? If not why would they no longer be of the Body of Christ?

And Jesus said to them, Truly I say to you that you who have followed Me, in the restoration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you also shall sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Matt. 19:28)

There are churches in the OT as well as the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC.

But when Paul write his epistles to churches, he is addressing the BOC.

Hope that is clear.

 

[Guojing]

Now let me ask of you a question. Answer if you can please.
When the twelve Jewish apostles of Christ are reigning over the tribes of Israel in the restoration do you believe they will still be members of the Body of Christ? If not why would they no longer be of the Body of Christ?

And Jesus said to them, Truly I say to you that you who have followed Me, in the restoration, when the Son of Man sits on the throne of His glory, you also shall sit on twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. (Matt. 19:28)

During the millennial reign, Israel will be ruling the Earth with the 12 apostles as their judges (Matthew 5:5, Zechariah 8), so none of them will be in heaven, unlike us in the BOC, so no, they are not in the Body of Christ.

They were never in the BOC, and they never written in any of their letters to Israel that they were.

 

[oikonomia]

During the millennial reign, Israel will be ruling the Earth with the 12 apostles as their judges (Matthew 5:5, Zechariah 8), so none of them will be in heaven, unlike us in the BOC, so no, they are not in the Body of Christ.

They were never in the BOC, and they never written in any of their letters to Israel that they were.

I understand you to believe that Matthew's gospel is not for anyone else except the Jews, especially the "Sermon on the Mount".
This concept I must reject as wrong.

I further understand you to teach that during the millennial kingdom no members of the church which is His Body are anywhere else but
in heaven. This concept is wrong.

I further understand you to teach that Peter, James, John and the other original apostles are not now nor ever have been members of the
Body of Christ. This too is wrong.

I'm sorry but there is no way I would teach these errors. We don't share the same view here.
How can the Apostle Peter who was given the keys of the kingdom of the heavens to open the doors of the church
not himself be in the church? And the church which Christ said He will build is definitely the Body of Christ.

And I also say to you that you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build My church, and the gates of Hades shall not prevail against it.
I will give to you the keys of the kingdom of the heavens, and whatever you bind on the earth shall have been bound in the heavens, and whatever you loose on the earth shall have been loosed in the heavens. (Matt.16:18,19)

Of course Peter a stone for the building of the church is of the Body of Christ.
And of course opening the door of the kingdom with the keys given to him, he himself is in the building of the church.

His special assignment to be one of the twelve reigning over the twelve tribes in the millennium doesn't change that at all.
And the posts on this subject I wrote previously already demonstrated this.

 

[oikonomia]

There are churches in the OT as well as the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC.

But when Paul write his epistles to churches, he is addressing the BOC.

Hope that is clear.

It is crystal clear to me that this is badly misconstrued and displays a very bad understanding of the Bible.

Especially the words "There are churches in the OT as well as the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC."

I can go along with teaching that with the varied assemblies in the OT the Body of Christ had not come yet into
existence except in typology.

But to say the new testament churches "are certainly NOT the BOC" I would strongly dismiss as probably a doctrine of demons which
has you completely deceived. This is not a mean personal ad hom to you. Rather it is meant as a faithful warning in love, frankly.

And I told you I am not concerned with assemblies which clearly were not typical new covenant churches like the city council or
a rioting mob in Ephesus. Are you hanging on to some face saving little exceptions to prove not every gathering is Christ's body?
We don't need that. It is obvious.

Your concept directly contradicts the New Testament in several places.
To the church in Ephesus - Because we are members of His Body. (Eph. 5:30)

I will not change that verse to "Because we are [NOT] members of His Body."
So your teaching is a direct contradiction of the New Testament there.

The church in Corinth consisted of Jews and Greeks. Paul says in one Spirit they were all baptized into one Body.
Of course that is the Body of Christ.

For also in one Spirit we were all baptized into one Body, whether Jews or Greeks,
whether slaves or free, and were all given to drink one Spirit. (1 Cor. 12:13)

 

[Guojing]

It is crystal clear to me that this is badly misconstrued and displays a very bad understanding of the Bible.

Especially the words "There are churches in the OT as well as the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC."

I can go along with teaching that with the varied assemblies in the OT the Body of Christ had not come yet into
existence except in typology.

But to say the new testament churches "are certainly NOT the BOC" I would strongly dismiss as probably a doctrine of demons which
has you completely deceived. This is not a mean personal ad hom to you. Rather it is meant as a faithful warning in love, frankly.

You must have a huge problem in reading comprehension to interpret my statement

"There are churches in the OT as well as the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC."

into me saying

the new testament churches "are certainly NOT the BOC"

Please improve your reading ability, and that is also not a "a mean personal ad hom to you"

Anyway, as an example of my actual point There are churches in the NT that are certainly NOT the BOC:

The acts 2 assembly is a church (Acts 2:47), but it's certainly not the body of Christ.

Jews and gentiles are not equal in that church, otherwise peter would have been contradicting himself at acts 10.

 

[Guojing]

I further understand you to teach that Peter, James, John and the other original apostles are not now nor ever have been members of the
Body of Christ. This too is wrong.

I'm sorry but there is no way I would teach these errors. We don't share the same view here.
How can the Apostle Peter who was given the keys of the kingdom of the heavens to open the doors of the church
not himself be in the church? And the church which Christ said He will build is definitely the Body of Christ.

I already gave you a clue where you can really prove me wrong, when I said "they never written in any of their letters to Israel that they were."

You just need to show me any where in their epistles where they tell any of the circumcised little flock that

1. We/they are in the Body of Christ where
2. Jews and gentiles are equal
3. if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing
4. They are dead to the Law.

and I will agree with you.