Islamic refugees

[CaptainToad]

Just btw, as many of you have realized, islamic refugees are flooding Europe. A woman names Merkel has invited them, not that she has asked me or anybody else, but still those people are coming. I dont like it - to say it bluntly. Its a pagan religion in my opinion, and those people are apparently dangerous, ticking time bombs (no pun intended).

The arabic nations, who are their brothers dont want to help them, but they want to send down some money to muild mosques - yeah, thats funny...

WHat do you guys think, should christians really help those guys or send them back to where they came from?

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

Interesting question....

Individually, we are to treat everyone with respect and dignity and help them when we can... it would be better to die doing Christ's work and living His character than to live in fear and anger.

Historically and prophetically, Islam has been used by God to trouble the western nations. This was prophesied to Ishmael when God told him that his hand(his descendants, Islam) would be against every man and every mans hand would be against him. These conflicts comprise the last three trumpets, the three woes of Revelation.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

We are not long for this world, so we should strive to not get caught in the distractions that are placed as snares for us everywhere.... keep you focus on Christ and your relationship with the Father. Repentance and surrender needs to be our desire, death before dishonour our motto.

 

[CaptainToad]

We are not long for this world, so we should strive to not get caught in the distractions that are placed as snares for us everywhere.... keep you focus on Christ and your relationship with the Father. Repentance and surrender needs to be our desire, death before dishonour our motto.

Now that might be true, however we are still living in this world and have to decide if we take part in daily lives or not. We make decisions on a daily basis and lets say this world will continue for a couple of years more, maybe our children will have to deal with our decisions lateron. If we invite this particular guest into our house he might cause trouble lateron - when it will be too late to make a decision.

 

[Ubuntu]

There is a saying... "If Moses won’t go to the Mountain... Bring the Mountain to Moses!"

As Christians it is our duty to bring the gospel to the Islamic nations. If we fail to go to these nations to proclaim the gospel, God might bring these people to us instead. Hopefully the Christian inhabitants of the western nations are perceptive enough to see the hand of God behind all of this. Islamic refugees coming to our part of the world is an opportunity to introduce them to Christ.

 

[grandvizier1006]

I think evangelizing and helping is the only option we have. The left seems to think that if any would-be terrorists hidden among refugees see the West's advancements, they'll like us, although the truth is that our secular society would probably anger most Muslims.

But if we treat even people who don't deserve it with kindness, I think that a generation or two down the line we can expect the Muslims in Europe to assimilate peacefully. The problem comes with being able to show the love of Christ when that person or group poses a risk to the society at large. I think the thing is that Europeans are quick to help with economic or social problems, but without a firm ideology or set of morals like in Christianity, there's no desire to share it with others. "Live and let live" would work find if there were no terrorists. I don't know if Euorpe has enough practicing Christians to make a difference, sadly, but those there will just have to do their best.

 

[CaptainToad]

There is a saying... "If Moses won’t go to the Mountain... Bring the Mountain to Moses!"

As Christians it is our duty to bring the gospel to the Islamic nations. If we fail to go to these nations to proclaim the gospel, God might bring these people to us instead. Hopefully the Christian inhabitants of the western nations are perceptive enough to see the hand of God behind all of this. Islamic refugees coming to our part of the world is an opportunity to introduce them to Christ.

I am not sure I see the hand of God here - and definitely not in the sense of spreading the gospel. I rather see a major threat here

 

[CaptainToad]

I think evangelizing and helping is the only option we have. The left seems to think that if any would-be terrorists hidden among refugees see the West's advancements, they'll like us, although the truth is that our secular society would probably anger most Muslims.

But if we treat even people who don't deserve it with kindness, I think that a generation or two down the line we can expect the Muslims in Europe to assimilate peacefully. The problem comes with being able to show the love of Christ when that person or group poses a risk to the society at large. I think the thing is that Europeans are quick to help with economic or social problems, but without a firm ideology or set of morals like in Christianity, there's no desire to share it with others. "Live and let live" would work find if there were no terrorists. I don't know if Euorpe has enough practicing Christians to make a difference, sadly, but those there will just have to do their best.

I agree with you!

In theory everything works fine - in practice not so much every time.
Problem is, Europe is a very diverse and more and more secular community. Christianity doesnt really play a major role in most countries. My observation is that muslims want to be treated with utmost respect in regard to their faith but they dont display the same level of respect towards christianity. I even understand that in part. When you think about Jesuralem - the chrisitan quarter is associated with bars and prostitutes - so I cannot judge them for thinking christianity is weak or that christians dont take their faith seriously.

 

[Dave-W]

There is a saying... "If Moses won’t go to the Mountain... Bring the Mountain to Moses!"

Actually, that would be "Mohamed." (not Moses)

As Christians it is our duty to bring the gospel to the Islamic nations.

I agree; but those are some hard fields to work in. The spirit of antichrist is very strong in Islam. ["God has no son."] Its grip is a strangle-hold.

Until we can break up that rocky ground, the seeds of the gospel will fall on the hard places and be eaten up by the birds, or it will start but never take proper root.

Mark 4.1 He began to teach again by the sea. And such a very large crowd gathered to Him that He got into a boat in the sea and sat down; and the whole crowd was by the sea on the land. 2 And He was teaching them many things in parables, and was saying to them in His teaching, 3 “Listen to this! Behold, the sower went out to sow; 4 as he was sowing, some seed fell beside the road, and the birds came and ate it up. 5 Other seed fell on the rocky ground where it did not have much soil; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of soil. 6 And after the sun had risen, it was scorched; and because it had no root, it withered away. 7 Other seed fell among the thorns, and the thorns came up and choked it, and it yielded no crop. 8 Other seeds fell into the good soil, and as they grew up and increased, they yielded a crop and produced thirty, sixty, and a hundredfold.” 9 And He was saying, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear.”

 

[grandvizier1006]

Actually, that would be "Mohamed." (not Moses)

I agree; but those are some hard fields to work in. The spirit of antichrist is very strong in Islam. ["God has no son."] Its grip is a strangle-hold.

Until we can break up that rocky ground, the seeds of the gospel will fall on the hard places and be eaten up by the birds, or it will start but never take proper root.

Mark 4.1 He began to teach again by the sea. And such a very large crowd gathered to Him that He got into a boat in the sea and sat down; and the whole crowd was by the sea on the land. 2 And He was teaching them many things in parables, and was saying to them in His teaching, 3 “Listen to this! Behold, the sower went out to sow; 4 as he was sowing, some seed fell beside the road, and the birds came and ate it up. 5 Other seed fell on the rocky ground where it did not have much soil; and immediately it sprang up because it had no depth of soil. 6 And after the sun had risen, it was scorched; and because it had no root, it withered away. 7 Other seed fell among the thorns, and the thorns came up and choked it, and it yielded no crop. 8 Other seeds fell into the good soil, and as they grew up and increased, they yielded a crop and produced thirty, sixty, and a hundredfold.” 9 And He was saying, “He who has ears to hear, let him hear.”

The thing is, though, that many Muslims are just nominal Muslims. Another thing is that they already believe in God, so that's one step ahead of most atheists. I think many Muslims are closer to Christ than some atheists. I think in light of the terrorism we've forgotten that at the end of the day, Islam used to be treated as just a heresy of Christianity.

 

[Dave-W]

That may be so, but as to the gospel, they are blinded just as many Jews are blinded (even though they are closer than the muslims)

 

[CaptainToad]

Islam is a bit dangerous IMHO - based on my observation it is based upon tradition (pray 5 times a day etc.) and hasnt changed very much (which in comparison to christianity might not necessarily be a bad thing). As many muslims take it very seriously it can be very hard for a muslim to leave that community - its like growing up in one of those smaller churches (like adventism for e.g.), with all your relatives and friends being there and then you suddenly leave - you dont just leave that church, very often you have to leave everything behind you or will be left behind.

 

[EastCoastRemnant]

its like growing up in one of those smaller churches (like adventism for e.g.), with all your relatives and friends being there and then you suddenly leave - you dont just leave that church, very often you have to leave everything behind you or will be left behind.

Why a person want to leave such a Bible based Christian Church (like Adventism for eg.) is beyond me...

 

[love2obey]

Our quest to stay alive is that has us dead. Why worry about who will kill us? Have we accepted He who will save us?
If we have truly accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, there is nothing else to worry about. Let us enjoy and rejoice all the way to heaven. If we are laid to rest before the Lord comes, we may have been blessed to witnessing less sufferings than those who staid awake. Therefore, wherever or whoever, let us testify of Jesus love

 

[CaptainToad]

Our quest to stay alive is that has us dead. Why worry about who will kill us? Have we accepted He who will save us?
If we have truly accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, there is nothing else to worry about. Let us enjoy and rejoice all the way to heaven. If we are laid to rest before the Lord comes, we may have been blessed to witnessing less sufferings than those who staid awake. Therefore, wherever or whoever, let us testify of Jesus love

Its not that simple!

And its definitely not about me worrying about who will kill me or anybody else.

Let me give you a somewhat drastic example.

Imagine you have a daughter, lets say in her teens, she walks down the street and gets raped by a muslim - a refugee that was invited by some governments in order to escape a war or something. What do you tell your daughter? Dont worry about who might rape you? Isnt it Jesus who saves us all? - I wonder if she will understand you.

This is real life here - in theory we can all brag and boast about who we are and how brave we are. Real life is the proving ground.

I hope you get what this is all about.

 

[Dave-W]

Our quest to stay alive is that has us dead. Why worry about who will kill us? Have we accepted He who will save us?
If we have truly accept Jesus as Lord and Savior, there is nothing else to worry about.

IMO this is a short sighted viewpoint.

How can we "Preach the gospel to every creature" (Mk 16) or "Make disciples in all nations," (Matt 28) if we are dead?

We are here to do a work and I do not intend to abandon my post until HE says I am done here.

 

[love2obey]

Its not that simple!

And its definitely not about me worrying about who will kill me or anybody else.

Let me give you a somewhat drastic example.

Imagine you have a daughter, lets say in her teens, she walks down the street and gets raped by a muslim - a refugee that was invited by some governments in order to escape a war or something. What do you tell your daughter? Dont worry about who might rape you? Isnt it Jesus who saves us all? - I wonder if she will understand you.

This is real life here - in theory we can all brag and boast about who we are and how brave we are. Real life is the proving ground.

I hope you get what this is all about.

Interesting that you used that analogy. I do have a daughter and a son. After I separated from their mom, I couldnt bare the fact that their mother was not a good influence to them. After 11 years in the church, she decided to go out to the world and that she did with a bang. I would take my 2 teenagers to church Sabbath morning and she would then try to take them with her partying Sabbath evening. That would put me in a ... and I would call her and question her. Gets what? RO, Restraining Order, in front of a judge. She felt harassed and so on. This when one for a couple of years. You know what make me stop? My son. Now he is 20. He pulled me aside one day and said to me "dad you made a big mistake". You worked too hard to keep this family together. Now it is time for my sister and I to show you what you thought us.

I backed off and they have shown me how great my Lord has been in their lives. I am very proud of my children. For example, when my daughter started at Southern Adventist University, the school gave her a job in the cafeteria. Yes, cafeteria, everyone has to eat including on Sabbath. Guess what? When Sabbath came, she told the administration that she didnt work for anyone on Sabbath and walked away. She didnt call me or anyone. She knew what to do.

Therefore to answer your question on regard to the rape, I would pray with my daughter to forgive that individual and hope that all that she has learned from Jesus and love that she has received Him, and my love for her and my testimony will help her continue seeking the Lord as she awaits for the Second Coming.

 

[love2obey]

IMO this is a short sighted viewpoint.

How can we "Preach the gospel to every creature" (Mk 16) or "Make disciples in all nations," (Matt 28) if we are dead?

We are here to do a work and I do not intend to abandon my post until HE says I am done here.

Jesus only lived 33 years and in about 3.5 did more than enough. and all that He did was in a very small area of the world. How many years each of us need? How much area do we need to cover? God has a purpose for everyone who believes in Him. Furthermore, He made us for His purpose.
for instance, I dont mind driving 4 hours one way to preach a 45 minutes sermon on Sabbath morning. Yet there are some of us that you put us in a car for more than 20 minutes and we will freak out. Does that mean one is better or less? NOOOOO

 

[Dave-W]

No - my point is that if someone had killed all 120 on the Day of Shavuot/Pentecost, where would the church be right now?

 

[love2obey]

No - my point is that if someone had killed all 120 on the Day of Shavuot/Pentecost, where would the church be right now?

The Lord always has a remnant. Plus if we recall, until it was Jesus time to be sacrificed, He was not caught.
it is not our gospel my friend to keep alive for. Nor it is our live to fight to keep alive for.