Is there anything wrong with skinny dipping on your own?

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I agree that according to Paul, we sin against Christ if we cause a weaker brother to stumble.

This is sufficient.

 

[RDKirk]

Swimming alone is against the Boy Scout Code of Safety. You would not get your merit badge if you suggested swimming alone was OK.

Buddy System Minute

That was actually my first thought about the topic. My second thought was what would the media say when they found the drowned body nude.

When I was a kid, boys who couldn't afford swimming trunks swam at the YMCA in the nude.

All my life in the military, men showered in communal showers in the nude.

If my 40-year-old son and I went to a gym or a pool, we'd see each other nude in the shower.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Just the bare facts.

 

[MyChainsAreGone]

Jesus says the FATHER REVEALS,
quite different than your posts.

i.e. no such interpretation is permitted, as you claim.

Jeff, evidently you know nothing about sound hermaneutics.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Jeff, evidently you know nothing about sound hermaneutics.

It is best to learn what Jesus and The Almighty Father, ABBA YAHWEH, says about that.
Same with everything.

It does not work out good for the educated ones, not usually.

 

[Archivist]

'you', not 'others'/'them'

Study Bible
Food Sacrificed to Idols
…12By sinning against your brothers in this way and wounding their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. 13Therefore, if what I eat causes my brother to stumble, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause him to stumble.
Berean Study Bible · Download

Once again, where do we draw the line?

So, it is wrong to swim nude around others because that could cause another to sin (lust). Is it wrong to own a nice home or drive a nice car because that could cause others to be envious? Is it wrong to state you views on a given topic because it could cause others to become angry? Is is wrong to consume good food because that could cause others to overeat (gluttony).

There is much that we all do that could cause others to sin.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Once again, where do we draw the line?

Follow Jesus. He never told the disciples to draw the line. He always says obey the Father, DO as HE says. Which is also 'DO what is right',
and even a child can know, while adults stumble over the truth.

 

[MyChainsAreGone]

Once again, where do we draw the line?

So, it is wrong to swim nude around others because that could cause another to sin (lust). Is it wrong to own a nice home or drive a nice car because that could cause others to be envious? Is it wrong to state you views on a given topic because it could cause others to become angry? Is is wrong to consume good food because that could cause others to overeat (gluttony).

There is much that we all do that could cause others to sin.

Archivist, I agree with you.

However, I would offer a clarification...

When someone sees our home or car and covets them, we have not "caused" them to sin. Mark 7:14-23 make it clear that any sinful response they have to what they see is simply a revealing of the impurity that is already in them.

If my actions, appearance, or possessions trigger a sinful response in another person, a "trigger" is different than a "cause."

Being a trigger is NOT the same as "causing to stumble" ... else we would have to hold Jesus responsible for triggering/causing the Pharisees' murderous hatred towards Himself (He didn't have to heal on a Sabbath, you know...).

I know that we are in agreement... I'm just suggesting a clearer nomenclature.

 

[Archivist]

Archivist, I agree with you.

However, I would offer a clarification...

When someone sees our home or car and covets them, we have not "caused" them to sin. Mark 7:14-23 make it clear that any sinful response they have to what they see is simply a revealing of the impurity that is already in them.

If my actions, appearance, or possessions trigger a sinful response in another person, a "trigger" is different than a "cause."

Being a trigger is NOT the same as "causing to stumble" ... else we would have to hold Jesus responsible for triggering/causing the Pharisees' murderous hatred towards Himself (He didn't have to heal on a Sabbath, you know...).

I know that we are in agreement... I'm just suggesting a clearer nomenclature.

I would agree with that. Clarification accepted.

I would note that most people who skinny dip or who visits a nude beach are not trying to cause others to sin. A trigger, perhaps, but not an intentional effort to cause a sinful response..

 

[Archivist]

Follow Jesus. He never told the disciples to draw the line. He always says obey the Father, DO as HE says. Which is also 'DO what is right',
and even a child can know, while adults stumble over the truth.

So is owning a nice house or car not doing what is right if some who look at it may sin? How is that any different than skinny dipping?

 

[MyChainsAreGone]

Follow Jesus. He never told the disciples to draw the line. He always says obey the Father, DO as HE says. Which is also 'DO what is right',
and even a child can know, while adults stumble over the truth.

OK, Jeff. As you say.

I have obeyed the Father while skinnydipping. In so doing, I have done what is right.

You may be tempted to judge me and my actions, but if you did so, yourself would disobeying the Father and doing what is wrong, for we are Instructed in God's Word:

Each person must be fully convinced in his own mind....

But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God. For it is written, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee shall bow to Me, And every tongue shall give praise to God.”

So then each one of us will give an account of himself to God.

Therefore let us not judge one another anymore,...

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

13Someone in the crowd said to Him, “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me.” 14But Jesus replied, “Man, who appointed Me judge or executor between you?”…
Berean Study Bible · Download

So is owning a nice house or car not doing what is right if some who look at it may sin?

 

[MyChainsAreGone]

I would agree with that. Clarification accepted.

I would note that most people who skinny dip or who visits a nude beach are not trying to cause others to sin. A trigger, perhaps, but not an intentional effort to cause a sinful response..

Right... there is the admonition to "as much as possible, live peaceably with all men." (Rom. 12:18)

I have no interest in acting as a trigger for anyone, but the important point is that I have no moral responsibility before God for any sin that I happen to trigger in anyone else.

Joseph was not responsible for Potiphar's Wife's lust for him. Bathsheba was not responsible for King David's lust after her. Jesus was not responsible for the Pharisees' hatred towards Him. All were triggers... none were sinning.

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

I have no interest in acting as a trigger for anyone, but the important point is that I have no moral responsibility before God for any sin that I happen to trigger in anyone else.

tch tch....
1 Corinthians 8:9
Be careful, however, that your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the weak.

1 Corinthians 8:11
So this weak brother, for whom Christ died, is destroyed by your knowledge.

1 Corinthians 8:12
By sinning against your brothers in this way and wounding their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.

New International Version
Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble.

New Living Translation
Don't tear apart the work of God over what you eat. Remember, all foods are acceptable, but it is wrong to eat something if it makes another person stumble.

English Standard Version
Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats.

Romans 14:20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to let his eating be a stumbling block.

 

[Archivist]

13Someone in the crowd said to Him, “Teacher, tell my brother to divide the inheritance with me.” 14But Jesus replied, “Man, who appointed Me judge or executor between you?”…
Berean Study Bible · Download

So, do you live in a nice house or drive a nice car?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

no

 

[MyChainsAreGone]

tch tch....
1 Corinthians 8:9
Be careful, however, that your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the weak.

1 Corinthians 8:11
So this weak brother, for whom Christ died, is destroyed by your knowledge.

1 Corinthians 8:12
By sinning against your brothers in this way and wounding their weak conscience, you sin against Christ.

New International Version
Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a person to eat anything that causes someone else to stumble.

New Living Translation
Don't tear apart the work of God over what you eat. Remember, all foods are acceptable, but it is wrong to eat something if it makes another person stumble.

English Standard Version
Do not, for the sake of food, destroy the work of God. Everything is indeed clean, but it is wrong for anyone to make another stumble by what he eats.

Romans 14:20 Do not destroy the work of God for the sake of food. All food is clean, but it is wrong for a man to let his eating be a stumbling block.

Jeff,

• What is Paul's definition of "Weak" in Romans 14 and 1 Cor. 8?
• What is Paul's definition of "Stumble" in Rom. 14 and 1 Cor. 8?

 

[Archivist]

no

I presume this was a reply to my post 55. So, you don't live in a nice house or drive a nice car. Do you eat good food? Do you ever say anything that could cause another to become angry?

 

[yeshuaslavejeff]

Luke 6:10 And after looking around at all of them, He said ... - Bible Hub

https://biblehub.com/luke/6-10.htm
... Jesus looked around at them with anger and sorrow at their hardness of heart.
Mark 3:5-7 NIRV - Jesus looked around at them in anger. - Bible ...

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=Mark+3%3A5-7&version=NIRV
Jesus looked around at them in anger. He was very upset because their hearts were stubborn. ...

 

[Archivist]

Luke 6:10 And after looking around at all of them, He said ... - Bible Hub

Luke 6:10 And after looking around at all of them, He said to the man, "Stretch out your hand." He did so, and it was restored.
... Jesus looked around at them with anger and sorrow at their hardness of heart.
Mark 3:5-7 NIRV - Jesus looked around at them in anger. - Bible ...

Bible Gateway passage: Mark 3:5-7 - New International Reader's Version
Jesus looked around at them in anger. He was very upset because their hearts were stubborn. ...

This would be easier if you would quote my posts so I would know what you are replying to.

The scripture you are quoting is about righteous anger. That is not what I'm talking about. And you didn't answer my question about food.