Is there any going back once you've turned away from God?

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

Hey now. Lets not get into a debate that doesn't really have anything to do with the point of the OP.

Oh, I do not wish to debate, I just want to see the scriptures. That is all

 

[Vigil]

Greetings and Blessing be upon you in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.



As with all things, one would allow for a “Just” and “Knowing” creator that is “All Loving” to know the mind of a child, and know when we realize when have done wrong have come to an age of Accountability. This is not a direct verse in the Bible, and cannot be found any place, because God has said nothing for it. Now, either we can accept that “God in his Omniscience” knows our intents, or he cannot, and with his Just and Righteous Judgment, Will make accommodations for our youth until such time as they come to develop reasoning skills. They can lie to us about it, but they cannot lie to God. That is why God set no Age exactly because each child is different. However the custom of the Jewish people that you are an ‘Adult’ at 13, perpetuates the idea that there are different considerations on Gods part between children and adults.

You can disagree with me and point to the fact that there is no direct verse, it is your right, you can believe that new born infants go to straight to Hell if they die. Please forgive me however if on that issue we will need to agree to disagree.

God Bless.

Vigil.

“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:” (1 Peter 5:8)

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

it is your right, you can believe that new born infants go to straight to Hell if they die. Please forgive me however if on that issue we will need to agree to disagree.

I did not ever claim to hold such a view. Anyways, thanks for looking for scriptures

 

[Krazeekkc]

Well, I do feel better that the option is at least open for me. I'm in no hurry to reconvert right now. I don't want to be like most of the Christians I have met. I'm a lover, not a hater. I don't want to be a racist. I don't want to hate people who disagree with me. I don't want to hate people because they aren't Christians. That's just not me. I know not all Christians are like that, but that was the type of church I grew up in, and that was the type of Christian group they had at university, and I don't want to be like that at all. So...I'll wait and test the waters a bit before I make any major decisions.

I would like to invite you to my Yahoo group: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/info_about_Christianity/
There you can always feel free to ask questions and talk.

 

[Vigil]

Greetings and Blessing be upon you in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ.



If you want Scripture that backs ups the idea that young infants and children go to heaven, you can read 2 Samuel 12:15 - 23

The Key word here is “I will go to him” thus David knew he bound for Heaven because of his favor with the Lord, so if we was to “Go to His Child” it would be a Meeting in Heaven.

I hope that provides for you an adequate answer as to the idea that Infants and young children are held blameless in the eyes of God. However there is no Mention of the Age of Accountability.

God Bless.

Vigil.

“Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:” (1 Peter 5:8)

 

[Bizzlebin Imperatoris]

The Key word here is “I will go to him” thus David knew he bound for Heaven because of his favor with the Lord, so if we was to “Go to His Child” it would be a Meeting in Heaven.

I hope that provides for you an adequate answer as to the idea that Infants and young children are held blameless in the eyes of God. However there is no Mention of the Age of Accountability.

I agree that this child did make it, and that some do, but is there any scripture saying that all go to heaven? Or that they are indeed blameless?

 

[Reformationist]

Until the age of Accountability, God knows you do not comprehend what it is your doing.

As comforting a thought as it is, ignorance of sin does not make sin less sinful. If a person is deemed sin free until a certain age, as you are contending, then all sorts of ungodliness is justifiable. The issue is NOT whether something is sinful but whether God has made provision for its atonement through Christ.

God bless

 

[newlite]

James 5:19 Brethren, if any of you do err from the truth, and one convert him; James 5:20 Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins.

my bible translates it "My brethren, if any among you strays from the truth, and one turns him back; " this makes it sound like if you believe, unbelieve, then someone turns you back to believe in god nthen lalala, you'll be saved. i may be wrong though...im not quite sure if thats what it means though...

 

[Reformationist]

As with all things, one would allow for a “Just” and “Knowing” creator that is “All Loving” to know the mind of a child, and know when we realize when have done wrong have come to an age of Accountability. This is not a direct verse in the Bible, and cannot be found any place, because God has said nothing for it. Now, either we can accept that “God in his Omniscience” knows our intents, or he cannot, and with his Just and Righteous Judgment, Will make accommodations for our youth until such time as they come to develop reasoning skills. They can lie to us about it, but they cannot lie to God. That is why God set no Age exactly because each child is different. However the custom of the Jewish people that you are an ‘Adult’ at 13, perpetuates the idea that there are different considerations on Gods part between children and adults.

Because man has distinguished between when a person is accountable and when they don't know any better does not mean that God makes the same allowance. Once again, the issue isn't whether sin is sin until a certain age. All sin is sin against God. The difference is whether God has atoned for that sin through the work of Christ on the Cross.

God bless

 

[Asar'el]

Hi, I'm new here.

My ma and da raised me Protestant from birth. When I was a child, I did become a Christian in my heart. I loved Jesus very much. When I was 18, I went away to university and fell in with a different crowd, eventually renounced Christianity and became an eclectic pagan. I was really into that religion for a time, but after a few years I fell out of favor with the faith and decided it wasn't for me, either. I still have much respect for pagans, and many of my friends are pagans, but it just isn't for me.

Da was in the hospital this past month after having a blood clot in his leg (he's fine now, just on blood thinners, and strong as ever). While there, someone from my former church came and prayed for him. He seemed to have a very gentle, loving faith, which was totally alien to me. Ma and Da loved me, of course, but the church was so stiff and unkind to everyone (some of the things preached when I was a child - voting for a democrat damned you to hell, women who went to college were damned to hell, if you didn't give 10% of your money to the church you were damned to hell, if you didn't fast at least once a week you were damned to hell, if you didn't attend every church service offered at the church you were damned to hell, etc). Da told me a new pastor had come to the church, and the church is much different now, not like it used to be when I was a child at all.

I was really moved by the new pastor's faith, so when the associate pastor of the church came to pray with Da, I asked him out in the hall if it were possible for someone who has strayed so badly from the Christian faith to come back. The associate pastor asked about what had happened to make me fade away from the church, so I told him everything. He asked me if I had truly renounced Jesus, and I said yes, at the time I had. He then told me that no, there was no way for me to come back to Christianity, and that I am damned with no hope at all. He gave me several bible verses. He said that since I had turned my back on God, God turned his back on me (2 Chronicles 15:2) and that I am damned because I had turned my back on my first faith (1 Timothy 5:12), and that I had committed the unpardonable sin and there is no hope of forgiveness for me at all (Mark 3:22-30).

So, do you all think he was right? My heart has been really sad since I have been told these words.

We might be straying a bit from the opening post, so I would like to go back to it.

And, for a shocker... - I am going to, in a sense, disagree with everyone (or at least most!) here - or at least, in part; let me explain:

I believe indeed that all things work together for good to them that love God. And I believe God appoints (and gifts for service) men in His church. So, look perhaps, at what the words this associate pastor accomplished!! I believe the effect is far greater on the original poster than a 'Sure, you can sin as much as you want and come back anytime' type answer will have done. The sadness of the 'fragile one' is, I think, a good ground for true seed to grow in.

My question to the original poster is, Are you sincere enough, and do you love God enough to answer this fellow as I think you should? To say, I believe my Father will not turn me away, and I will knock until the door is opened or I die before it!

Do not think lightly on what you have done; nor, if you should find God merciful to you again, immagine that you will always be given a chance to return, when you depart from Him. You are still alive, there may yet be hope for you; but, as your trespass was great, think (as we all must) of a guilty prisoner before the Judge of the Earth. We have no defense, nor can we redeem our past - so, plead instead for mercy. Plead with your whole heart, yea, ask God to empty it of all that should not be there, and plead with Him. Seek Him so, and I will add my plea that He should show you mercy still. In Jesus Christ's most precious name.

 

[Jennifer615]

I feel sad that the pastor told you that. I don't believe it at all. There are many testamonies of people who have been into satanism etc who become Christians. These people will often lead others to Christ, because they have such a great testamony.

I can't relate to you denouncing Jesus, as I never could, but I can understand you falling away because of the unloving laws of your old church. I think Jesus wants you back. I would advise that you really know what you are doing, and are making a firm decision when you return. Truly repent of your past, kneel before God in tears. Do this only when you are ready.

If you want to PM me and tell me what part of Ireland you are from, I will see if I can find a good church for you, as I think you need to avoid your old church. There is too much negative history there.

I wish you the very best. Jennifer

 

[UMP]

Hi, I'm new here.

My ma and da raised me Protestant from birth. When I was a child, I did become a Christian in my heart. I loved Jesus very much. When I was 18, I went away to university and fell in with a different crowd, eventually renounced Christianity and became an eclectic pagan. I was really into that religion for a time, but after a few years I fell out of favor with the faith and decided it wasn't for me, either. I still have much respect for pagans, and many of my friends are pagans, but it just isn't for me.

Da was in the hospital this past month after having a blood clot in his leg (he's fine now, just on blood thinners, and strong as ever). While there, someone from my former church came and prayed for him. He seemed to have a very gentle, loving faith, which was totally alien to me. Ma and Da loved me, of course, but the church was so stiff and unkind to everyone (some of the things preached when I was a child - voting for a democrat damned you to hell, women who went to college were damned to hell, if you didn't give 10% of your money to the church you were damned to hell, if you didn't fast at least once a week you were damned to hell, if you didn't attend every church service offered at the church you were damned to hell, etc). Da told me a new pastor had come to the church, and the church is much different now, not like it used to be when I was a child at all.

I was really moved by the new pastor's faith, so when the associate pastor of the church came to pray with Da, I asked him out in the hall if it were possible for someone who has strayed so badly from the Christian faith to come back. The associate pastor asked about what had happened to make me fade away from the church, so I told him everything. He asked me if I had truly renounced Jesus, and I said yes, at the time I had. He then told me that no, there was no way for me to come back to Christianity, and that I am damned with no hope at all. He gave me several bible verses. He said that since I had turned my back on God, God turned his back on me (2 Chronicles 15:2) and that I am damned because I had turned my back on my first faith (1 Timothy 5:12), and that I had committed the unpardonable sin and there is no hope of forgiveness for me at all (Mark 3:22-30).

So, do you all think he was right? My heart has been really sad since I have been told these words.

Your pastor is a goon for telling you that. Your sad heart is enough to tell me that yes, you can come back! God will and does forgive you! Read this, it will help you !!
http://www.spurgeon.org/sermons/0075.htm

 

[fragile one]

Well...

I don't know about the age of accountability, and there seems to be disagreement if it even exists. I wasn't exactly aware of what I was doing as a child - all I knew was that I was very scared of leaving the only home I had ever known for a country I had never been to and knew little about. The pastor at my former church (which I barely remember - except that he always had a bag of peppermints in his pocket that he shared with us children; this is not the church I have been talking about) told me that if I became a Christian, Jesus would always be with me and I would never be alone. So I became a Christian. Maybe I didn't know what I was doing at the time, but I do believe I was organised well enough to know what it meant by the time I was 17. So before I became a pagan, I did know what I was doing.

However, I don't honestly know if I was rebelling against God or rebelling against what I knew as Christianity. I was formally ex-communicated by my church once I went to university (women shouldn't go to university) and left our city. I was hoping for some type of good Christian friends at university, but the town was small and the only church group there was like the one I had left behind (although they did believe it was okay for women to go to university). So I'm not sure what I was really denying and what I was not. Perhaps that would make a difference.

Jennifer, unfortunately I'm not in Ireland right now. I grew up in western-central Ireland (Mayo County), and will be returning to the Emerald Isle as soon as I finish my studies

 

[lucaspa]

So I became a Christian. Maybe I didn't know what I was doing at the time, but I do believe I was organised well enough to know what it meant by the time I was 17. So before I became a pagan, I did know what I was doing.

Someone told you to remember the parable of the Prodigal Son. You might also remember the parable of the shepherd and sheep, where the shepherd keeps looking for the lost sheep, even tho 99 are still in the flock.

You can give up on God. God never gives up on you. Apparently some Christians wanted you to believe God does. Probably made themselves feel superior. Too bad for them.

You can always come back to Christianity. If your former church won't accept you, too bad for them. There are Christians who will welcome you with open arms. Try some Methodists ) ), liberal Catholics, Episcopalians, Presbyterian Church USA, Lutherans, and Congregationalists.

A good midwestern Lutheran church will be happy to have you, especially if you have a new recipe for a casserole for pot-luck dinner!

 

[Athanasian Creed]

{snip} However, I don't honestly know if I was rebelling against God or rebelling against what I knew as Christianity. I was formally ex-communicated by my church once I went to university (women shouldn't go to university) and left our city. I was hoping for some type of good Christian friends at university, but the town was small and the only church group there was like the one I had left behind (although they did believe it was okay for women to go to university). So I'm not sure what I was really denying and what I was not. Perhaps that would make a difference. {snip} /QUOTE]

Actually, i believe you have hit the nail on the proverbial head From your posts, i honestly believe you had religion (Christianity) and not a relationship with the living God through Jesus the Christ (saying you were brought up Protestant, that you judge Christ and Christianity by the actions of some Christians) I never, even when sharing with Roman Catholics, emphasis my being "Protestant" I am a born-again Christian (to differentiate from those who would say, without knowledge or newness of life "ya, i'm a "Christian" too) And i've learned a long time ago NEVER to judge Christ and His salvation by the words/actions of Christians (sometimes those of myself as well) If you have a true relationship with Christ, you WILL follow Him though all other's forsake Him. You will rely on His Word and His Spirit to help keep your eyes on Jesus at ALL times.

The legacy of the true Church of Jesus is a wonderful one, filled with ordinary person's who did extraordinary things because of the Christ in them, the "hope of glory"

Serve Christ and Him alone - dead religion is a curse and bondage. Christ calls you to true freedom - found only in HIM !!!

Hebrews 12:1-2 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.


Ray

 

[fragile one]

I never, even when sharing with Roman Catholics, emphasis my being "Protestant"

Ah yes, but this is North America. In Ireland, it is not the same. You have probably heard of the strife in Northern Ireland between Protestants and Catholics (thankfully there is mostly a ceasefire now, although tension can flare up). There, for the most part, you are either Protestant or Catholic, no middle ground to be had. It's more of a cultural thing than a religious thing.

 

[fragile one]

And i've learned a long time ago NEVER to judge Christ and His salvation by the words/actions of Christians (sometimes those of myself as well)

Yes, but that is difficult. Maybe it's just difficult for me, I don't know. When I went to university, I visited many schools with my da and of course I looked to see if the academics were good, if a broad range of majors were offered, how qualified the professors were, etc. But one of the main determinants for me choosing the university I attended was the student body. Did I like them? Could I find myself fitting in there? Were they nice to me? Did I want to be part of this group? The university I chose, the student body was diverse and pretty accepting of everyone else (including those of us with "foreign" accents ) When I applied for my job, I looked at those I would work with and asked the same questions - were they nice to me, were they good at their work, did I want to be part of this group? I had an opportunity to work at a hotel where I made $9.00 an hour, but the people there were rude and lazy, and I ended up taking a job as a waitress where I only make $4.00 + tips, but I like the cooks and the cashiers and the other waitresses. So I can't especially say that I would never look at the actions of those in a religion to help me decide if I really want to be part of that religion or not. I mean, if I really am going to be spending an eternity with a group of people, I'd like for them to at least be nice to me sometimes

 

[CrownCaster]

I for one want to say welcome back to the fold and if I, a finite, blow it of a human being can say that, imagine how much more our loving, perfect Father in Heaven is rejoicing your return. God bless you. Cant wait to meet you in Heaven.

 

[Athanasian Creed]

Ah yes, but this is North America. In Ireland, it is not the same. You have probably heard of the strife in Northern Ireland between Protestants and Catholics (thankfully there is mostly a ceasefire now, although tension can flare up). There, for the most part, you are either Protestant or Catholic, no middle ground to be had. It's more of a cultural thing than a religious thing.

All the more reason my dear to differentiate between dead religion and true, life transforming faith in God through Christ. There are many (and you are quite aware being Irish) that profess to be "Christian" but their words/actions show, by God's Word, otherwise.

True, saving faith transforms ALL a persons life and they will bring forth fruit that comes from their relationship with Christ -

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

This is the mark of a true Christian - have they become transformed "new" creatures - turning from sin unto righteousness by the power of God's Spirit in obedience to God's Word.

John 15:16 Ye have not chosen me, but I have chosen you, and ordained you, that ye should go and bring forth fruit, and that your fruit should remain: that whatsoever ye shall ask of the Father in my name, he may give it you.

Jesus spoke these words to His disciples in particular but it also is applicable to us who follow Him today.

Galatians 5:19-23 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness, Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies, Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God. But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith, Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.

Here outlined are the works of the flesh (brought forth in the lives of sinful man without Christ) and the fruit of the Spirit (brought forth by those who have a personal relationship with God in Christ)


Ray

 

[DawnTillery]

In the bible it says I will never leave you or forsake you.
You can not be plucked from His hand, you can of course Jump out just as you did, but He is there knocking, listen to Him and let Him in again.
We fall short and we do sin, but turning away from sin and accepting Christ into your heart will take care of that.
I suggest you search around and find a church that will help you grow in your new life with Christ. I dont see how anyone can say that.
I have also done somethings in my life that would make me wonder if I can have salvation, but once you accept Christ in your heart you slate is wiped clean.. Just as mine and just as anyones can be.
Dont be sad, Jesus loves you

Hi, I'm new here.

My ma and da raised me Protestant from birth. When I was a child, I did become a Christian in my heart. I loved Jesus very much. When I was 18, I went away to university and fell in with a different crowd, eventually renounced Christianity and became an eclectic pagan. I was really into that religion for a time, but after a few years I fell out of favor with the faith and decided it wasn't for me, either. I still have much respect for pagans, and many of my friends are pagans, but it just isn't for me.

Da was in the hospital this past month after having a blood clot in his leg (he's fine now, just on blood thinners, and strong as ever). While there, someone from my former church came and prayed for him. He seemed to have a very gentle, loving faith, which was totally alien to me. Ma and Da loved me, of course, but the church was so stiff and unkind to everyone (some of the things preached when I was a child - voting for a democrat damned you to hell, women who went to college were damned to hell, if you didn't give 10% of your money to the church you were damned to hell, if you didn't fast at least once a week you were damned to hell, if you didn't attend every church service offered at the church you were damned to hell, etc). Da told me a new pastor had come to the church, and the church is much different now, not like it used to be when I was a child at all.

I was really moved by the new pastor's faith, so when the associate pastor of the church came to pray with Da, I asked him out in the hall if it were possible for someone who has strayed so badly from the Christian faith to come back. The associate pastor asked about what had happened to make me fade away from the church, so I told him everything. He asked me if I had truly renounced Jesus, and I said yes, at the time I had. He then told me that no, there was no way for me to come back to Christianity, and that I am damned with no hope at all. He gave me several bible verses. He said that since I had turned my back on God, God turned his back on me (2 Chronicles 15:2) and that I am damned because I had turned my back on my first faith (1 Timothy 5:12), and that I had committed the unpardonable sin and there is no hope of forgiveness for me at all (Mark 3:22-30).

So, do you all think he was right? My heart has been really sad since I have been told these words.